buick man

I have said it before and still think it could work. That is, an externally mounted 12-volt vacuum pump capable of, I believe, the 18-lbs or such of vacuum needed to run the system optimally. This would have many features and benefits over the crankcase mounted system. Unless I am missing something here.

Pete: Yes I am documenting the entire adventure and could write something up for you at the end here soon as I am currently working on this and am trying a few thinks out. I could wrap over a Special's glove box but that would be too easy. I am cursed with having to have things just the way they were and kinda a stickler for details so I am developing a way to reinvent this thing if that is possible. I want my finished effort to replace what was there originally as close as possible and have it look and feel like it should. Incidentally, once perfected I could make it available to the Buick community perhaps as a finished item or whatever. So we will see and will keep everyone posted here as to my progress. TG: Here is the link to the post that I think you may be referring to regarding the buick special glove box door route. http://forums.aaca.org/f162/help-does-1957-buick-drivers-ac-304012.html#post886974

Thanks for the cheer Rob. I will keep all posted. It may very well be the photo but the green glove box vinyl looks like the definitive crescent ridge is not present? Again I cannot tell by the photo.

Here is what I have decided to try first. Go and get some balsa wood and leave the two horse hair book ends in place and use them as a trace template so I can copy their unique shape onto some good gauge steel plate. Then cut the plates down in size to allow for a 1/2- inch high density foam to be installed over the balsa wood once it is shaped. However, before that I will attach the metal template plates to the ends of a correct length of 2.75 x 1.6 inch balsa block, then using the end plates as a guide shape the balsa wood block to conformity. Once that is completed I can attach (screw/glue) balsa block into position. Then attach the 1/2 - inch closed cell high density polyethylene foam over the block as and where needed to assure exact contouring, then recover and attach my original vinyl over that. It should work. I will report how it turns out. A secondary approach could be to fiberglass over the final shaped balsa wood and then install the foam over the fiberglass instead of the balsa wood. Could be good as well.

Jerry: Way to go those seats are nice and I like the combo look - very correct. So this is a kick in the pants to get mine done now that I see yours.

Hey Jim! Yeah I was thinking along the same lines but as I have gotten into this it dawned on me the area around lock to be "right on" needs some concave detailing as it approaches the surround area of the lock and still be solid to the touch as original. My mantra is always Be Original. With that said, it is more now an academic endeavor to try and replicate what was there before, what to use and how to go about it. To remove the skin vinyl and keep it freshly intact, I use a light heat gun massage along with a very thin hobby spatula. When tactfully heated the original glues softens and the edges can be separated and lifted tactfully with no damage as my vinyl is still very soft and pliable. The inner core foam cellular bonding just went south and turned to mush as noted. I was told a buick special glove box front metal trim piece can be used and then just cover over that on the fly. Another suggestion I have gotten was to use fiberglass, mold it however is necessary and then skin over that. The fiberglass can be scaled down a few notches in overall dimensions and then a thin layer of foam of either closed cell dense polyethylene or softer polyurethane can be used as a skin over that to replicate the original "Charmin" - firm but somewhat soft feel, that the original had. The canned 3M urethanes and polystyrenes are not correct chemistry here and will not work as you noted. I think it neatly organic in a way how they used the burlap and as you say horse hair as bookends on this glove box door so they could inject the foam in. I can remember my 1962 Healy 3000 MKII used a kinda treated hay straw to cushion the rear and front seats. I was checking out some of the P-Chem history of the day back in 1957 to try and figure out what they were using as these injection foams and it appears these products were just making headway onto the manufacturing scene. More later as I proceed and what ideas I can get from this post.

I am currently working on replacing the cushion foam backing on my glove box and would like to know if anyone has attempted this in an authentic acceptable manner? I have been told by an award winning upholsterer, that they were injected with a poly foam which cannot be replicated on a non-production basis so he just fiberglass molds underneath with a little foam glue over that and then covers them since he is not set up to inject. I have been told that if you put just any foam in they get that rounded hotdog look I am sure you have all seen at shows. If you are in the know, this is just not correct. So, I am thinking of using a tight closed cell dense foam that I can cut to shape. Perhaps a polyethylene. At any rate when I removed my cover the foam was not toasted but rather very soft, tacky and gummy as it has broken down. What this must mean, is it is of a different type of foam material from that of seats as seats get dried and crumbly so this has an original different composition giving the injection foam idea some merit. All that remains are the two end pieces that appear to be a different non foam such as a waxed burlap and some remnant foam at each end. As the pictures below show the end pieces are about 1-inch thick each and were placed there by Buick to establish and maintain the overall sharp edge shape that the glove box cover should have and the foam was pumped/injected in. This is apparent because around the door lock area, the overall foam material needs to have a gradual recess down to the escutcheon of the lock itself and also fill into the cavity between these two burlap shape end pieces. So, does anyone have a technically correct way of replacing the foam and if so what kind did you use? I know I will probably not be able to find a material to inject and will have to resort to carving up some closed cell polyethylene but would be interested any hearing any all solutions. In the last photo you can see why I had to remove the door from the dash and then the surgically remove the cover. The other photos show what I found. {Edit Notes: 12/20/11 I have posted the conclusion of this restoration process on another separate post. If you came here from there, please notice how the original horse hair end pieces were also covered in foam as well as the overlapping metal edges. What this means is that the original foam was more enveloped than just the outline of the horse hair end blocks and too, the metal radius edges were covered as well so the new foam insert needs to cover these edges as well. The original injection process forced the foam into and over these areas so the vinyl cover would be fully contoured and resilient.}

Ohhh, I did not know about that option. It is food for thought if all else fails. Guess I will post this question to our community and see what comes up.

Oh and by the way I see by the photos that you went into your dash. I am currently working on repairing my glove box cushion and wondered what you did on yours as it looks like it was recovered. I have been told by an award winning upholsterer, that they were injected with a poly foam and he just fiberglass molds underneath with a little foam glue over that and then covers them since he is not set up to inject. I have been told that if you put just any foam in they get that rounded hotdog look I am sure you have seen at shows. This is not correct. I am thinking of using a closed cell dense foam that I can cut to shape. Perhaps a polyethylene. At any rate when I removed my cover the foam was toast. All that remains are the two end pieces that appear to be a waxed burlap and some remnant foam at the ends. As the pictures show the end pieces are about 1-inch thick each and were placed there by Buick to establish the over all sharp edge shape that the glove box cover should have and the foam was pumped into the cavity between them as I am told. Maybe I will make a new post and see what others have done but would like to get your take on this.

Dan you are the man! I just could not find my shop manual today and had to answer this question for a friend so I posted. Thanks.

Hello: Perhaps someone who has AC in their 57 Buick should know the answer to the following question: Does the driver's side suppose to have a control knob sticking out of it or does the passenger's side only have this directional flow knob sticking out of it? The one I am looking at has part number: 1178377, and is constructed so it does not use the knob and the flap is fixed so I do not know for sure if this is for a 57 application but it looks like what should be in the car. Anyone?

Good deduction and maybe to the point where only a few dusty museum cars will be in one piece and everything else will be as scattered parts cars - if you can find them!

I have used INC many times and have had no problems as long as you can hang-in with that unique east coast posturing, back and forth etc, then no problem and I live on the left coast. With that said, I believe our hobby world would be a lot smaller without them.

Thanks for the heads up, but they are welcome to knock all they want. There is nothing illegal about putting any type of fuel in any vehicle as long as it is not driven on public roads since only there is where the road or use tax is levied and valid. If you are going to store a vehicle it appears that AV is the best fuel to put in them if you do not have a cat converter to worry about. At any rate I will be certain not to put E-10 in my tanks. IMO: As far as any monitoring chips are concerned or for that matter any of the other current vast array of proposed or recently house passed legislation in the current U.S. Congress is concerned, that is just about as far as these far flung agendas proposals are going to get, so I am not too concerned about all of that. The hobby will survive we just have to be creative and be sure to get active in local, state and federal government and elections. Some states have through the result of active car clubs and societies, been able to persuade/propose and help draft democratic legislation to help level the playing field and counter some of these draconian measures that we are seeing attempted around the country. Hope springs eternal.

Yes indeed fellas... The true "reality governor" placed on this cartel's campaign is going to be the overall basis economy. That is the everyday economy that runs on solid 20th century technology and commerce since the 21st century economy is non-existent to date and for that matter the foreseeable immediate future. Ethanol is an excellent solvent on one hand and a poor producer of power on the other. For automakers, commerce and trade a lose - lose situation. That I suspect is why BMW and other manufactures are telling all just like it is. Engine components will have to be made out of some other kind of material other than heat and wear sensitive metals and alloys. Also to truly replace fractioned petroleum, they would have to literally cover the world with cornfields. E-10 or E-15 is not the answer nor even a mini solution to any of their postulates they deliver as fact and/or remedies. Personally, I am switching to AV - 100LL for all my stored vehicles. There will be no associated E-10/15 problems by doing so. It is by chemical formulation and design a stable long term life fuel especially when compared to E-10/15 - hands down. So where does that leave us? We will have well and properly stored large dust collectors or cars we can should be able to drive? Therefore it is clear by simple reasoning there is no "real" need to cover our american landscape with monopolized ethanol belching stations while at the same token barring true fuels no pump space what-so-ever. This would not be occurring if not for the well organized and payed for efforts by the pro ethanol groups. However, with that said, I think their "plan" is going to backfire on them sooner if not later. Stayed tuned....

All Good Points. Please consider as well the following facts: Current fuel price fluctuations since September 2008 to present has had nothing to do with supply or demand. It was Speculation. Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley using Index Futures through utilizing the London ICE ( Intercontinental Exchange ) a totally deregulated structure even worse than what currently exists in the U.S. which means you pay at the pump .50 cents per gallon to Morgan Stanley and .50 cents per gallon to Goldman Sachs. World oil prices in this time frame went from $ 150 per drum of oil down to $ 35 per drum of oil in as little of couple of months with little or no real change in the world economy. So what was up with that? Now these guys are up to their same under handing tactics and speculations to create a new fuel costs spike. Purely speculation. Governmental Ethanol Support from corn growers to refineries: Your tax dollars are being used to mandate production and tax relief benefits to these parties to dump onto the market and redirect the supply to fuels rather than through traditional use markets for corn. This is costing the U.S. public in real time dollars to prop up this cartel. Ethanol Hype & Inefficiency. Ethanol provides 10-15% less energy and resulting overall mileage per gallon for the end user when compared to traditional fractional petroleum products. This leaves the U.S. in the Red to a much higher degree than just the 10-15% loss in the capable energy release with Ethanol. The results are increased usage, decreased efficiencies, increased private profits, increased commodity prices and food prices, decreased purchasing power to the general public. In short we in America are being used to support and prop up an industry and what it's paid for legislators are mandating upon us. Again a benefit for the few thru a thrashing of the many. Now we will be getting an E-15 pushed down our throats via this same cartel spouting the same twisted logic of distorted benefits and features for going that direction, many having to do with fuel independency, ecological issues and the like which by the way are not as they are presented and do not help the energy situation one bit statistically. Hope: Some states, though not enough, have legislated that at least one pump be provided for non-alcohol laced gasoline per each public filling station. There is a large interlaced economy out there that straight out does not benefit from the purchase or use of E-10 not to mention the proposed cartel's E-15 mandates. It is raging cost havoc on many unsuspecting americans.

I have absolutely no affiliation with this site and some of you may already know of this site. However, I believe that everyone could benefit from the information on this site so below I have provided a link. BTW: You can also get a kit from these guys to test that "Fuel Additive" that you thought was safe to put in your beauty for long term storage when using E10 based fuels - This may help you to re-Think that again! Fuel Testers - Home - E10 Gas

Good points Mike. Long live our AC Sytems!

My bubble? ... Yeah right. Look. You made the comment, not me and I corrected you by stating a fact. If someone is going to create or repeat fictions as fact, it does no one good service. It does however, one of two things very effectively. First it reveals what limited capacity there is for truth and fact as opinion, and secondly what limitless capacity there is to manufacture truth and fact to suit opinion. For example: Fox News does a good job at that!

BTW: Fact: Richard Nixon was the person who proposed and created the EPA and it became operational December 1st 1970. Yes a Republican. Not Jimmy Carter . . . Of course you won't hear this and other Facts by watching and listening to Fox News (aka FOX Entertainment and Opinion ) bill o'reily (aka:bill o'really), glen beck, sara palin, etc . . . for that matter either.

Gee.... so how is the Professor doing with the 59 Adpato project? Have not heard anything for awhile and the front office is calling wondering what is up.

Thank you for your reply. I will follow up on it.

Wonderbar Radio for a 1957 Buick. What do you have for tubes n vibrators? I have an AC Delco service book and could look up the various tubes by number if you need me to. Let me know.

Thanks for that input. I thought it would be interesting for a few folks to let me know what their perspective steering wheel free play is when the engine is not running and again what it is once the engine has started just to get a sense of real world normality. I went thru the shop manual last fall when I was getting ready to rebuild my unit and just thought a comparison to others rebuilt or not would be nice. So if anyone can let me know what their free play stats are it would be appreciated.

I have a question for anyone who is in the know regarding this for 1957 Buicks. 1) On Power steering equipped models, what is considered "acceptable" regarding just how much at rest static steering wheel left to right free play movement should be available on a car with a newly rebuilt steering box and completely rebuilt front end steering components? Qualifier: The free left to right movement with the engine off, car on level and flat ground and before any engagement of the worm gear binding in the steering box or before any torsional stress is applied to steering components ie. the tie rods. My wheel has about an 1-1/2" to 2-1/4" free play movement under above described conditions. 2) I take it that once the engine is started and the power steering pump is working, this free play is taken up by the pump. Then how much free play left to right steering wheel movement is available, left or right, before any movement is noticed in the steering components and or wheels? My engine is not running currently and cannot check this second condition out. Just getting my stuff together for rebuilding and could not find an answer to my 2 questions above in the spec sections of the shop manual. Any help would be appreciated.