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Dave Mitchell

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Posts posted by Dave Mitchell

    I hope you're enjoying the Gooding & Co. auction live online right now (Jan 18, 2014)

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    He does Marrs, plus he has some humor without being a total smart aleck like some of the others working now. When I sold my car with Gooding, Charlie worked really hard to get it done. I really like your 62 MB coupe - my first car (running and driving) was a 1962 220Seb, same color as yours, but a 4 door sedan, which I drove to high school. There used to be a 1918 Pierce 66 with the same cast aluminum 4 place roadster right there in Portland. I came very close to buying it.

    PreWar Mercedes Benz

    in CCCA - General

    Posted

    I think this is the car on the top of page 85 in Melin's vol 1, as I recall Jan told me that there were 3 of these built and there are only 2 known. I remember asking him about it as it is probably my favorite outside of the Special Roadster. I think that the bulk of the 12 were the earlier flat windshield versions on page 84. I like it because it has the special roadster vee windshield and a completely disappearing top, which gives it a very clean look, it is modern, yet still classic. The windows in the doors are plexiglass and the quarter windows are removable. Edgar Masters traded his 34 Packard 12 Dietrich coupe for this car and RM restored it, taking it from the dark blue to silver, and it is now in the Parfet collection. I think it is even better in person than in photos.

    Auburn

    in CCCA - General

    Posted

    The 8 cylinder Auburn Speedsters with supercharger and 2 speed rear axle can easily cruise at modern highway speeds, which was above average for 1935/36. The Speedsters were lighter and faster than the average car and each one was driven by test driver - in most cases by race driver Ab Jenkins and was affixed with a plaque stating how fast it was driven. They were all certified to exceed 100mph.

    Auburn

    in CCCA - General

    Posted

    Are you in Bettendorf IA? There used to be a real Auburn Speedster near here, but as it was for sale, I'm not sure if it is still around. I have driven a number of Auburns and they are fun to drive. They aren't the best or fastest cars of the era, but are however better than the average low priced car. The Auburns were marketed with flashier colors and styles than the everyday cars.

    help identifying a 1930s Packard

    in Packard

    Posted

    Please do try to post the photo larger or email it to me at packard12s@hotmail.com I think it has a flat windshield and a shorter fender which would be a more likely a 37 115.

    New to this forum and not sure I am posting appropriately. But I need to know the model and year of the Packard pictured here with the cute kids.

    [ATTACH=CONFIG]205432[/ATTACH]

    Could any one offer a suggestion?

    Many thanks!

    RC Knapp

    Packard meet in Rochester, MI today

    in CCCA - General

    Posted

    He is correct, it is a radio delete. The man who ordered the car from Derham specified that the fluted trim between and at the sides of the instruments be ground off the dash and only the rings and border be chrome with the rest black, (from the letters btw he and Derham)

    Packard market values

    in Packard

    Posted

    Hi Oldcar, I didn't get your email, I will look in the filtered folder and see if I can find it there. I haven't seen your thread about it, but it is a good looking car. I have friends in NZ who tour in Australia fairly often, perhaps you have met them. It looks very nice in the photos you posted here - very authentic colors. Dave

    Hello

    This one is really for Dave Mitchell, I sent you an e-mail asking for a realistic valuation on my 1923 Single Six but have not yet received a reply.

    I have been completely up front about the car and its restoration in my thread on "Our cars & restoration projects" I know to the last cent how much I have spent on the car excluding my own time. Perhaps someone may care to suggest what I could expect to sell the car for. Hemmings keep trumpeting about record prices being paid for 1920s cars so obviously there are still some cashed up buyers out in the market. While the car is in Australia it could be shipped to anywhere in the world for less than $10,000.

    oldcar

    [ATTACH=CONFIG]187309[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]187310[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]187311[/ATTACH]

    Packard market values

    in Packard

    Posted

    The car in Hemmings was not in top shape. and sadly I think that the writer just didn't know enough about Packards to properly evaluate it and called it a #1 because it is has shiny paint. He also comments on a 34 12 that there is nothing wrong, but it is missing the sidemount covers which would probably set the new owner back about $7 - 8000 alone to buy and restore to match the car. If he missed that, what else did he miss? He may know other cars, but he doesn't seem qualified to grade a classic Packard. Quote:

    I think the car in Hemmings, if truly in top shape, was an anomoly, and more indicative of the occasional good buy in a somewhat fragmented market than a trend, IMHO.

    Packard market values

    in Packard

    Posted

    I agree. If all you care about is that this is a car of a certain model and nothing else - no history or "provenance" then the swap around cars are fine, but I don't think they are as valuable as a car that has not been swapped. As a rule, I don't think the swap guys do a great job, they are usually the quick and dirty type. That may or may not be corrected in subsequent restorations. I think that a car with a known documented history should carry a premium.

    Great thread. I'm on vacation; so am late in chiming in. I was at a small swap meet 15 years ago and met an old guy who told me he converted a 1932 Packard Super 8 conv coupe into a Twin Six back in 1950. Yes, 1950. He said he sold the car shortly there after. Now think about it, that car has probably been restored twice since then. Probably once in the 1970's and again in the 1990's or 2000's. Each subsequent restoration "corrected" what was missed in the 1950 conversion. Someone out there now has a 100 point 1932 Twin Six conv coupe that isn't really what they think it is, and it's true identity has probably now been lost to time.

    In regards to the three 433 Packards being switched around, the sad thing is that in the beginning we had three original engine/chassis/body cars, and now we have none.

    Packard market values

    in Packard

    Posted

    It does make a difference if people admit to what they have done and are not doing it to deceive. People certainly have a problem with interchanging major components on muscle cars - this can drop the value a great deal, or even on a Duesenberg, or Cadillac (where there are records), but with Packards, people don't seem to mind as much. Perhaps because it is hard to prove, and it has been done so much. I'd hate to be the guy who ended up with the last version of the worn out 443. I also feel sorry for the people who have the sedans that clubs find unacceptable as they have been swaped to smaller series, all the while accepting the open big series cars that belong to prominent collectors. Not fair.

    Packard market values

    in Packard

    Posted

    I remember the Jackson Brooks Dietrich well. I was on the CCCA board and classifications committee. The sad thing is that there was once a real Dietrich convertible victoria, and now there are two cars built from the pieces of that one, and neither has much claim to be the real car anymore. That is the other thing that we haven't mentioned is that it is sometimes cheaper to build a new body than to restore the original and some wealthy and well known collectors do this as a routine thing with no regard for history, only to save money and to make things easier. If they destroy the evidence no one is the wiser, and won't be until down the line when someone goes to restore or repaint it again and finds out that it was all new in 1990 or some recent year. Brooks' mistake was to sell the remains, and the buyer took advantage of his mistake. It really made a mess. It proves once again that you really have to do your homework on these cars. That is why I get really excited when I find a car like the 1938 Packard 12 Derham convertible victoria and it is sitting there in bare aluminum and I can document it back to new and know it is a real car with a history and has no skeletons in its closet.

    There's an interesting little book, "Cars I Could've, Should've Kept" by Jackson Brooks.

    In it, he tells the fascinating story of acquiring a Packard Dietrich Victoria, number 904-95, a project car. He proceeds to restore the car, and he goes into detail about using a parts car, replacing part of rear tub of body, and switching from an 8 to a 12 cylinder chassis.

    He was very open about doing this, even consulting with CCCA rules and prominent members about the fact that the car would be accepted in the club. Everything and everyone confirmed it was no problem, as the components were all of the same year.

    He'd sold the original chassis, and later a man bought his leftover parts and even the rusty piece of rear tub from him.

    THAT person proceeded to build an identical car from the pieces, and then had the CCCA confirm it as the REAL 904-95. The car that Brooks restored, with many original parts and even the firewall VIN plate, was deemed by CCCA to be a replica!!

    The entire story is worth buying the book, just for that one chapter, as he goes into great detail about the restoration, subsequent legal action, and the result, which went into arbitration. And yes, he ended up selling his car as a replica!

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