Sloth

Hello Al, The rear corners of the tonneau will be build on the same way as the corners of the front seat. The coming days I will continue with the building process, so you can expect some pictures, of the progress. Furthermore, to increase the structural strength of the tonneau seat back and side panels, I will add some steel brackets. Glue: in earlier days I used phenol resorcinol formaldehyde glue, wonderful stuff, but I became very allergic to it. Instead, I use Bostik PK 75, a pasty polyurethane stuff, dispensed from a tube. It does not foam as regular polyurethane. One has about 5 minutes to apply it, after that time it starts slowly to set. Fully hardened in about 24 hour. What I do is making sure that every thing needed is ready, and lays neatly within reach on a flat surface. Mold is clean and ready, clamping boards clean and ready, and so on. Than I start to put the glue in thick rolls on the surface of one board and use a large putty knife ( 5" width) to spread it very fast and evenly on the board. Then put the board on the mold, put the other board on it (first time right, no adjustment possible) and clamp everything together. Today I did a little experiment, got the whole procedure fixed within 4 minutes and 20 seconds . The dimensions of the boards are 4' 2" x 2' each. One advantage of the PK 75, no extreme clamping force is needed. But one warning, be careful with this glue, it sticks on everything and removing is a quiet a chore😡 (some experiences in life I can live without, this was one of them...). Regards, Harm

Good morning Mike, Thank you. Well, to be honest, several years ago I thought the same. So I made a perfect mold, and used 1/16" aircraft quality triplex, which is expensive stuff. Then I ran into problems, I had to laminate 10 layers. The glue began to set after I had laminated 5 layers, still 5 layers left to do, long story short, it very soon it became a huge and expensive mess. After a while, I spoke with an older gentlemen who used to build horse drawn coaches. He teached me what kind of flexible triplex to use and how to make simple molds for one time use, since then no scrap anymore, and no time consuming perfect molds to build.... just simple molds who are dimensional correct and with the right edges. When you laminate two or three layers of 9/32" (7 mm) flexible triplex, the end result is very stiff and keeps its form, after the glue hardens no form adjustments are possible. (for the Cleveland toneau and front seat, I used two layers). Regards, Harm

Last days I glued the side panels of the toneau. I laminated both of them from flexible plywood 9/32" thick each, total thickness 9/16". Today I cut out the toneau panels. I am happy with them, no splits in the wood caused by bending at a small radius. Wooden form for left side of toneau panel (outside view). This side will be used for forming the flexible plywood. Wooden form for toneau side panel, left side (inside view). Left side toneau panel Right side of toneau panel Furthermore, I started with cutting out the seat bases, make them from 1" thick ash. Regards, Harm

Hi Al, I designed it, to be removable. Our Celebration was very quiet, as the whole northern part of the Netherlands was covered in a very thick fog. Code Red (severe weather) was issued by the authorities. Many car accidents, with a lot of wounded people and some fatalities. At some parts, you could not see whats 30 feet in front of you. Regards, Harm

Anna and I wish you all a Happy and Healthy New Year!

Hello Al, Yes, its going well. I guess next week I will build the door. One thing I am pondering about: how to fasten the toneau on the under frame. Any idea's about this? Regards, Harm

Hello Al, not all the way, the rear panels of the toneau are straight, but tilted backwards. The edges will be 1/4 round as at the front seat. Today I made the first side panel, it is momentarily fixed in the die (big word for a simple wood form). Made the side panels of two layers, glued together, flexible plywood. Tomorrow I will see what has become of it. Regards, Harm

Hello Mike, unfortunately, I think you are right about the London to Brighton run. At the hotel, where we stayed this year (very near Hyde Park), on Sunday morning about 5 o clock, two very large lorries turned up. Both of them containing 6 or 8 pre 1905 cars, all were unloaded. Two or three owners in sight, further, only technicians.... Later on, at the start we recognized a few of the unloaded cars, most drivers were not the people who attended unloading the cars.... Its a pity, but I hope there are some real enthusiasts left, as you and I, who do most of the work them self. Last weekend I spoke a friend who attended the LBR many times, but not 2018 and 2019. Mentioning the subject of the LBR, he told me, he considers the cost involved with attending the LBR outrageous. As he says, costs have exploded, he is a "well to do person" so money-wise no problem , but he feels its more and more becoming a commercial circus and does not want to be a part of it. But luckily for us, there are other pre 1905 events. But first I have to finish the restoration of the Cleveland. I retired at the first of June this year, and I must say, most days being in the shop, from 8 in the morning to 5 in the afternoon, gives me much pleasure and satisfaction. Regards, Harm

Today, I spend with completing the mock-up (more or less 😉). It is a bit difficult to get the right form of the seats, only reference I have are the pictures of Roger Weiss's car, and a sales catalog picture. I made it with cheap plywood, leftover slats and some stiff paper (its floor protecting paper for painting walls etc., cheap and plentiful available). Side view of toneau seat Inside view of mock up construction Top view of toneau seat mock up. Regards, Harm

Hello Mike, The story in your Humberette blog of your London Brighton Crestmobile experience is wonderful and very recognizable for Anna and me. When Anna and I married, we went the other year to London. It was the first weekend in November, visiting theaters, Kew garden and some more. We where not aware about the London to Brighton Run. But at Saturday evening we saw some (a lot) veteran cars appearing at the hotel. We asked what it was going on, and spent a very pleasant evening with some attendants . Sunday morning we set course to Hyde park. It was freezing cold but dry, and we had a lot of fun. Watching the starting cars was something to be seen. After a while, Anna tapped me on the shoulder and said: that is what I want to do some time in the future. Well, at that time, not fully aware the expense of such a pre-1905 car, the subject was brought to a rest for a very long time (we are now 42 years married 😊)... At the year 2001 we bought the remains of the Cleveland, and the rest is history as they say. Regards, Harm

Hello Mike, Thank you for the friendly words. No problem with the questions, that is the purpose of the forum (as I see it). I am sorry to say, but I don't have drawings of the toneau. What I do, I make a mock-up, and go ahead and adjusting and tuning during building. Fifteen years ago I got some low resolution pictures of the car from the owner of the only other 1 cylinder Cleveland. Furthermore I copied and enlarged the drawings of the 1 cylinder Cleveland from the sales catalog. That is all the documentation I have. If you like it, I can make a sort of drawing by putting detail pictures of the toneau in PowerPoint sheets, and add dimensions and construction details for building a toneau. As far as I can see the side panels of the toneau of the car below, they are straight and not curved as the Cleveland. That makes building one a whole lot easier. Mike just a question: is the front seat of your car made of wood, or has it a wooden frame and is it covered with steel sheet? I included a picture of another British Crestmobile. Regards, Harm

Hello gentlemen, thank you for your comment, hope you all had a nice Christmas. Anna and I had nice and quiet Christmas celebrations. I created the Christmas card with Power Point. Mike I don't think you need some challenges from Alan or one of us, you show good and steady progress. And, by the way, the engine of the Humberette looks to me as more than enough of a challenge.... Yesterday, lousy weather, could not do anything. Made a parts list for the wood work. Today, beautiful weather, so out with the machines. Started at 8.00 hr and put the machines inside at 18.00hr, a long day. Sawed and planed all the wood needed for building the toneau. Also finished the mock up of the toneau. Mock-up of toneau seat frame Rear of toneau detail Rear of toneau with door posts Rear of touneau with door post inside view Alan, here are the some pictures of the construction of the front seat slats. Front seat detail with middle slat (just a bit to short) Front seat top detail Front seat bottom detail, on the left the slot for the gear, brake and ignition levers This ends my report for today. Regards, Harm

Hallo Alan, Thank you for your nice compliments, we feel honored. We wish you good health and happy celebrations. Regards, Harm

Dear ladies and gentlemen , at last: here we are, (Anna and I) sitting in the Cleveland. Regards, Harm

Al, I am working to it. The vertical runners in the seat back will be joined on a small beam on the bottom of the seat frame, and on top, on the timber which runs from left to the right side. Tomorrow I will post detailed pictures of it. Now the glue has hardened, the seat is very rigid, won't fall apart for the first decades ☺️ (or hundred years). Regarding the weight, this afternoon I weighted the frame, seat and slope nosed hood. Frame: 95 lbs Seat: 37 lbs Hood: 16 lbs Total weight: 148 lbs = 67 Kg I Guess that the toneau will be about 90 to 100 lbs. Including the upholstery, I guess that the body (which includes the toneau) weighs in total about 270 t0 290 lbs. I must admit that I have not the slightest idea if that is heavy or not. Gentlemen, please let me know what your thoughts are about this. Regards, Harm

Hello sir, it feels good inspiring people😊. The side panels of the front seat are 2 glued together boards of plywood. Thickness of each = 9/16" total 1 1/8". Its a waterproof quality plywood, but light weight. The rear panel of the seat is build by gluing 2 flexible layers plywood of 9/32" thickness, total 9/16". Regards, Harm

Mike Macartney and Edinmass, gentlemen thank you for your appreciation. Reading about both of your restorations, I must say your appreciation means a lot to me. Regards, Harm

Today I made some progress, assembled and glued the front seat. Also managed to put one back panel in (tomorrow the second one, I ran out of the right glue). The slope of the side boards (leaning outwards) = 84 degrees. The slope of the back panel starts with 72 degrees, increasing to the top to 86 degrees. I mounted the side panels with a kind of pin in hole connection, made by a long groove in the seat frame and also a long groove in the side panel (see pictures), both will be connected with a strip of ash. Two long screws to secure everything from moving during the setting of the glue, and I have a very sturdy seat. Grove and wooden strip ( router got a bit offline) Wooden strip glues in groove Groove in bottom of side board Front view of seat Rear view of seat Rear view of seat corner Just a few days, and Anna and I can "take a seat", I look forward to it😊. Regards, Harm

Hello Al, Anna and I are not from big cities. Anna comes from a small village in the northern part of the Netherlands, her family where millers for several hundreds of years. She is born at a mill as is painted on classical Dutch paintings. I am from a very small village in the same area, but more to the north. My father was born on a ship, most of his family members where skippers/sailing masters. Later on my father became lock keeper, at a lock in a very remote area, I am used to not having neighbors 😉. Back to the Cleveland: today, i made a lot of fine tuning and adjustments of the seat wood work. I am satisfied with the fitment of the parts. Tomorrow everything will be glued together, but before that I will take a lot of pictures for future reference and this blog. I have the dimensions of the tonneau more or less sorted out, I am tempted to start with the building of the tonneau too. Regards, Harm

Hello Al, Well, it was a nice weekend with limited shopping. We went to Rotterdam, it is the largest harbor of Europe. Nice shopping, but very bad weather, a lot of wind and rain. So instead to continue shopping the whole Saturday, we went in the afternoon for a harbor tour by boat. We were impressed, a very busy harbor. Stayed the night over, and had a very good "surprise diner" at one of the restaurants (good wine too 😋). Regards, Harm

Hello Al, Yes, I worked out the degree of slope, the pictures of the Crestmobile were of a great help. Will let you know, as soon as I assemble the front seat, probably Monday. Today I assembled and glued together the side panels. Tomorrow some shopping is foreseen by Anna 😒, no Cleveland wood work. So my degree of happiness is a bit declining 😁. Regards, Harm

@Mike Macartney: Hello Mike, thank you very much for making this effort. I am very pleased to tell you, the dimensions of the Cleveland seat are within 1/2" identical of those of the Crestmobile. I am reassured and a very happy Harm now, so I pored myself a hearty drink, and toasted on your health. This is just what I needed to continue (the dimensions, not the drink...😊). This forum proved invaluable for me, as I have no frame of reference or help for restoring a 1903 American car of which only two exist. Regards, Harm

Hello Mike, It would be a great help, if you post some measurement of the body and seating area, it seems that the body of the Crestmobile looks nearly identical to the Cleveland. Thank you in advance! Yes Mike, I am human with all the quirks belonging to it. Horizontal flat surfaces magically collecting stuff, can hardly do anything to prevent this 😉. But nothing gets lost, I think... (Takes sometimes more than a few minutes to find something back....🙄) Regards, Harm

Hello Gary, thank you for your advice, will take a look at my Buick of 1910 seats. Regards, Harm

It was a very productive day. Last night I got an idea how to fabricate the front seat. The seat will consist of two left/right main pillars, with notches for the side panels and a notch for the rear panel. The pillars provided me with some fabrication challenges, the rear panel is curved, and the side panels are on an angle. For the pillars, I used mahogany I had in stock, the ash I have is just to small. I like milling/routing mahogany, its reasonably dense and not too bad for the tooling. Sectional view of right side main pillar Curved back side of the main pillar. A lot of milling and sanding was needed to get the notches right. Quarter rear view of main pillar and side panel Side view of right side side panel and main pillar Main pillar angle Gentlemen, the angle of the main pillar in last picture presents me with a problem. I have no idea if the angle is OK, or must it a bit more leaning outward? What do you think about it? Things to do tomorrow, rounding the main pillars, I searched for a router bit with the right (large 1 1/2" radius. Found some at €150-; mmm where did I leave my spoke sheaves... Further, make a top board, an underside beam and 3 small trusses between the top board and the under beam. Alan, I told Anna what you wrote in an earlier post, she liked the idea of the sitting very much.... I am in a hurry now 😁 Regards, Harm