Steering wheel is loose; anyone have experience fixing this problem?

[Reatta Man]

My '90 coupe with 68K miles has a loose steering wheel. When you place two hands on the wheel, you can move it up and down, although the tilt wheel mechanism is clearly locked in place. The steering column is NOT loose where it bolts to the instrument panel. What I'd like to know from anyone that has experienced this is:<P>1. What causes it? It feels like the U-joints in the tilting steering column mechanism are worn. Anyone taken a column apart that exhibited these symptoms and saw what parts were worn or failed completely?<P>2. Is this a DIY project or one better left to the dealer? I have a factory service manual, but am not sure of what to look for before disassembling the column. <P>3. If anyone knows which parts have failed, do you have the GM/Buick name for the parts needed to fix it, or the part numbers?<P>Thanks in advance for any help you can provide!<P>Joe<BR>BCA#35662<P>------------------<BR>"Speech should not be free because people want to speak; <BR> Speech must be free because people need to hear."<P>1965 Wildcat Custom Convertible<BR>1970 GS coupe<BR>1990 Reatta coupe<BR>1999 Regal GSE<BR>2002 300 HP Regal GNX (I wish!)

[Barney Eaton]

Never gone inside the column... just thinking out loud, If the tilt or other part inside were moving, this could/would cause a problem with the wheel locking. Have you tried the simplest fix...check the nut that holds the wheel on.

[Guest]

Hi Barney & Joe!<P>When I bought my current 1990 nearly 4 years ago, the mechanic I took with me to look at the car pointed out the very same thing about the steering column. I had been told that there is a piece in the column (which may or may not be part of the tilt mechanism - I really don't recall at this point) which wears out over time. I was also told that this happens much faster in cars where the steering wheel is used as leverage for getting out of the car.<P>I had looked into having it repaired at the time & decided against it due to cost. Nearly 4 years & ~100k later, it's still fine ... as long as the steering wheel isn't used to 'help' the driver out of the car.<P>~Brenda<P>------------------<BR>REATTA SITE:<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/gohighr/reatta.html" TARGET=_blank><BR>http://members.aol.com/gohighr/reatta.html</A>

[Guest]

My '91 has the same "problem", when applying downward pressure to the top of the wheel,the wheel "gives" or bends with the force applied.It seems to be in the tilting mech area.

[Guest]

What normally happens is there are 4 screws (inverted torx heads) that loosen up. It happens more when the customer leans on the wheel getting in and out of the car. Any good auto repair shop can fix this. To do a quality job the screws should be removed and coated with loctite. Their is also a way that some tecs will do a half a** job by only tightening 2 of the 4 screws. To get to the other two screws requires more time. <P>To sum it up:<BR>1. Disarm and remove airbag<BR>2. Remove wheel (puller required)<BR>3. Remove Lock plate (lock plate tool required)<BR>4. Remove air bag clock spring (see manual for warning)<BR>5. Remove turnsignal lever, hazard knop, loosen and pull back multifuction switch<BR>6. Remove lockcylinder<BR>7. Remoce upper column screws<BR>8. Remove piviot pins (tool required)<BR>9. Remove the next piece of the column by pulling the tilt lever<BR>10. Now you can get to the screws<P>It should take a shop 2 hours or less but it may be a bit much for some people. If you live near Illinois I can hook you up.<P>Tom

[Reatta Man]

Thanks, all,<P>I think I will take my service manual to my local Buick dealer and get an estimate for doing this job. When the proceedure involves the air bag, and the manual advises the tech to carry it with the front of the bag facing away from his chest, I'll leave that little explosive package to the dealer to play with. <P>I'm sure if I called a service advisor and asked for the cost of tightening the torx screws in the steering column, all I'd get is a long 'duh?' <P>If I have the manual in front of me, I can probably get an intelligent answer. <P>You guys continue to amaze me. This problem is a perfect example; in the 35+ cars I've owned in the last 20 years, I've never had this problem. Yet, after posting the problem here, I get good advice from several people who have experienced the same thing. Not only does it let me know that the steering wheel isn't going to come off while driving the car, it probably will save me several hundred dollars when I go into the dealer. Now I know I won't get taken for needing my tie rods retied or my windshield washers needing to be sent out for dry cleaning. <P>Thanks, <BR>Hope I can return the favor soon. <P>Joe<P>BCA#35662

[Guest]

I have had that happen on several GM tilt columns and it has always been the torx bolts. I am guilty of only tightening three though, since to get the other one was a huge pain.

[Barney Eaton]

I am trying to understand the logic of the air bag exploding in the repair persons hands....... <BR>I believe it is in the manual as a CYA statment. Why should the bag be any more likely to deploying in the technicions hands than while you are driving the car?<BR>The only logical answer is static electricity, so if you don't touch the wire while you are carrying a static charge what will set it off? <BR>I carefully removed mine and replaced the horn buttons....all the time wondering when I was going to die, then wondered what I was worried about.

[Guest allbuick]

Have seen several Reattas with this condition. If the looseness is just that, the tilt assy is loose and sloppy, tightening the torx bolts will fix it. The thing I have noticed however is that the Reatta tilt has a looseness that is under spring loaded pressure. You can pull down on the column and it moves down and to the right but spring tension puts the column back in place as soon as you let go. This seems, for some reason to be by design and I have not been able to stop that

[Guest]

Allbuick,<P>The center piece in the column that loosen up(sorry I don't have a name for the part)is under spring tension. It's the spring that pops the wheel up when you hit the tilt lever. With out a spring the wheel would drop down when you hit the tilt lever. It's kinda hard to explain but to disassemble the spring tension must be released. When the screws are loose the spring tension takes up the slack because the pieces are tring to move apart. Unless you have a rare case where the center bearings came apart using loctite and tighting those screws will fix the problem. Some play is not considered normal but some people can live with it until it gets too extreme.<P>Tom

[Guest]

Reatta Man,<P>That sounds like a typical trip to the dealer. You both know what the problem is but it sounds like they are tring to hit you up for a bit more money. No one has a majic touch that can wiggle a wheel and tell you if it's a bearing or loose bolts. I can just imagine the writter going to the mechanic and saying "just wiggle the wheel and say it's the column bearings and I'll get you more money on this job". Maybe 1 out of 100 has a bad column bearing. I could understand if he warned you saying there is always a chance it will need more work/parts.<P>Tom

[Guest]

All Gm colunms loosen up after time. This usually happens from grabbing the steering wheel to pull yourself out of the car, or when getting in the car. Actually there are no failed parts. The four tilt housing bolts loosen up. They are inverted torx head bolts. You can use a standard 1/4 dr 12 pt 1/4 inch socket if you don't have an inverted torx socket.If you have never taken one apart let someone do it. A dealer usually chages 2-3 hours labor to fix it. I do them quite frequently and use loctite on the bolts. Good luck.

[Reatta Man]

Barney,<P>I took my Reatta to Cavender Buick yesterday. The service writer had a tech look at it in the service lane, and the tech thinks it is a bearing in the column in addition to the bolts being loose. If so, that should only add about $20-30 to the bill. <P>As for why I don't like to fool with airbags-- two reasons. First, as I'm sure you realize, here in South Texas, we can go from 80% relative humidity to 15% relative humidity, sometimes in the same day or within hours. When the RH goes down, the likelyhood of a static charge goes up--way up. The airbag operates on a dry chemical charge, which means, once its lit, it burns, or explodes, until it is out of fuel. If you don't think that charge can be set off unintentionally, then think of the last time you touched a metal desk, doorknob or your TV and got a shock unexpectedly. If that happened with the airbag and that shock touched the metal connector--poof! <P>Second reason is that, if it DOES go off, even if no one is hurt, Bobby Cavender's service boys owe me a new airbag worth several hundred dollars, thank you very much!<P>There are a LOT of things I've tackled on a car, some of which the book said a DIYer like me couldn't do, and got away with it. After working around ejection seat charges on Air Force fighter aircraft, fooling around with explosive charges on my car is not on my to-do list. <P>I'll let you know how it turns out. <P>Joe<BR>BCA#35662<P>[This message has been edited by Reatta Man (edited 03-16-2001).]<p>[This message has been edited by Reatta Man (edited 03-16-2001).]

[Reatta Man]

Tom,<P>You were right. After getting a phone estimate of $150-160 (for a two-hour job) I took the car in. The tech said it might be the bearing....which should add $20-30. No problem, right? <P>Phone call from me late Friday to the dealer..."Where's my car?" I had taken the day off and expected to pick it up late Friday. Short version of the story: Service writer now quoting $250+ for repair, no explanation as to why other than to say it is now a 3-3.5 hour job. Talked to the service manager, explained the problem of car not fixed, price nearly doubled, told him my discussions with other Reatta owners on the forum indicated it was a 2-2.5 hour job, asked whasssup? He called back, said it would be fixed for the original estimate, but since the couldn't get it fixed by closing time, would I like a free rental car over the weekend? I declined.<P>Seems knowing what to expect based upon input from other Reatta owners saved me about $100-150. Thanks, guys. <P>Will let you know how it feels when I get it back. Wonder if they will call me today and say, Oh, Joe, while we were in your steering column, we found out we need to replace the (fill in the name of an expensive part here)?<P>Joe

[Guest]

That's one problem with the industry. There are some places that will raise the final price to increase proffit. There are other times when the job was quoted wrong and the shop does not want to eat the loss. Finely there can allways be a unforseen chance something elce is wrong. In this case the shop is justified in wanting more money for the extra parts or labor. When this happens to a customer they don't know if they are being ripped off, served by incompitants, or just more is needed for a good fix. This is where some good shops can get a bad reputation. They may do good work but if they tend to be inacurate with the estomates find somewhere elce. On the other end of the extreme some shops don't want to call the customer for more work/money and let bad parts go only to cause a problem some other day.<P> <BR>I can understand wanting to get 3-4 hours for puting in column bearings. I just can't see knowing they are bad by wiggling the wheel. Only adding $20-30 to do these bearings is too low. I'm glad in the end they took care of you.<P>Tom

[Reatta Man]

Tom,<P>I think the problem in San Antonio is that one family now owns both Buick dealerships. Guess the result is that competition between Buick dealerships is now gone. <P>I saw this coming years ago when GM, in their infinite, fix-what-ain't-broke wisdom, announced that they thought they had too many dealerships in certain lines, including Buick, and would be closing or consolodating certain dealerships. <P>I've been doing business with this dealer for over six years, so we definitely know each other. As for dealerships needing more profit, if they can't make profit on their original estimate, at $70 per hour shop rate, something is definitely wrong. <P>Got the car back--seems to be perfect. <P>Once again, thanks to all those who had helpful suggestions. <P>Joe

[tjenkins]

Joe, we are *ALL* wondering - exactly what did they do for the repair???<P>--Tom<BR>

[Reatta Man]

Tom, <P>According to the service rep, there are four hex bolts that come loose over time. The dissasemble the column, replace the bolts using Loctite, and reassemble the column. <P>I'll examine the workorder closely when I get home tonight to see if they did any additional work. <P>Joe

[Guest kennyw]

I posted a message to this subject and somehow it was erased. I wonder why my comment wasn't needed??-----Most all got this one right. Glad to hear your problem is fixed and at the right cost....I had this problem with another G.M vehicle. I worked at an assemble plant so I went to the dept. where this part is installed. The [FACTORY REP], was there from that G.M. plant. He said that he was going to fix one after work for someone else and would be glad to do my steering wheel. It took him just over 30 minutes to take it all apart, install the new torx bolts and have it back together. The bolts he used were factory coated with a blue locktight. As you found out, don't think a first timer can do it in this time. There are more part in there than you can count. Mine was with out the air bag.

[Guest DMG]

i just had the same problem with my car. Problem seems to be in the pivot pins. I checked the four bolts everyone talks about, they were a little loose but not too bad. Upon further dianostics I found that the inner housing that the pivot pins fit into was too worn to hold the housing tight. so I'll have to live with it or get another column.<BR> DMG

[Reatta Man]

DMG, <P>The inner housing is available, but rare. That, of course, directly affects its price. It is also a bear to replace. <P>Check with your insurance company to see if they have a shop they use for damaged steering columns. Most GM cars are stolen by shattering the left side of the column, and when the police recover the vehicle, insurers usually get the column fixed before they give it back to the owner. If your insurer doesn't know of one, check with the sales manager of a large used car lot; they have cars stolen and have to know who can repair or re-key one quickly. <P>Joe

[Guest Pudgee]

Hi..I see this thread is 11 years old, but today I am tackling this problem on my '90 Convert w 37k miles. It is amazing how much has to come out/off to see what is going on with the steering column! ...the console top has to be removed to get the lower leather panel out!

I found 2 problems - the main reason for the lose column is that the steering wheel was pushed forward (panic stop?) and its brackets slid out of the 2 slitted, wedge ("A") shaped holders that hold the steering column bracket up and center. This may be a safety device, because if the wheel is pushed forward hard enough it will slide out of the holders and forward 2+ inches (I should take some pix). The ONLY thing holding up the column in mine was the steel plate under the column. Farther down the column I also found 2 broken aluminum fasteners with a threaded hole, but not sure of their function. These are split in two and there may be a third on the top of the column (3 @ 33* apart). ....I'm thinking I may lock the steering column bracket into the slotted, "A" shaped holders with JB Weld and bolt them back into place. (There is one 1/2" hex head bolt holding each. ) I probably need to investigate the 2 aluminum fasteners that are cracked in half also.

This seems like the problem that everyone is having....so no bearing probs, or loose torx bolts. And, I didn't see the torx head bolts that is talked about except for the 2 that help hold the decorative leather bottom cover into place. My steering was fine unless I hit a bump and the wheel would jump all over the place. I know how the old Saginaw tilt columns should feel and this felt like there was another elbow there somewhere.

...while this is apart, I am also going to redo the shifter tape and the radio's crackling capacitors....and hopefully won't have to remove half of the dash again for a LONG time!

Edited June 30, 2012 by Pudgee (see edit history)

[Guest Richard D]

I had the same problem in my 1977 ElCamino after the warranty expired. Charged me around $200.00 in 1979 dollars. Glad to see it only took them 20 years to fix the loose bolt problem.

[Guest Kitskaboodle]

All Gm colunms loosen up after time. This usually happens from grabbing the steering wheel to pull yourself out of the car' date=' or when getting in the car. Actually there are no failed parts. The four tilt housing bolts loosen up. They are inverted torx head bolts. You can use a standard 1/4 dr 12 pt 1/4 inch socket if you don't have an inverted torx socket.If you have never taken one apart let someone do it. A dealer usually chages 2-3 hours labor to fix it. I do them quite frequently and use loctite on the bolts. Good luck.[/quote']

Yep, this is a VERY common problem with GM columns. Mine was as loose as any Reatta out there!

The Fiero forum even has a guy that does a rebuild service for $100 (with exchange)

Kit