1990Buick Riviera Problems!

[spizzybee]

I have a 1990 buick riviera that has had no problems up until last week. my car will no longer start or even begin to turn over. i have plenty of battery. i replaced the starter, that wasn't the problem. i replaced the battery, that wasn't the problem. by bypassing the solenoid, we could jump it but the car wasn't getting any fuel. so if we sprayed ether into the carb. and jumped it it would run as long as it got starter fluid. any suggestions?? i tried my spare key but that didn't work either. the buick dealer said maybe it was a bad key chip? *my car also has an automatic start which hasn't worked for a month or more*

any suggestions would be appreciated!

beth

[Reatta Man]

STRONGLY recommend you have that automatic starter system removed before going further.

Your car has a chip in the key, which you can see as a small black plastic square, with what looks like a flat wedge of metal embedded in the plastic. That is the chip that could be bad. However, if you spare key is new or nearly new and still doesn't work, I suspect the automatic starting system.

If a chip goes bad, the car should turn over (spin when the starter motor turns the engine) but not start. If you engine isn't turning over, COMBINED with no fuel, your computer is not getting a signal to start. That accounts for not getting any fuel when you bypass the solenoid.

If the automatic starting system is new, have the shop that put it in disconnect it from ALL factory wiring harnesses and connections. Also check the ingnition and ECM fuses. That starter may have spiked the wiring harness, shorting out the fuse.

Good luck. The 1990 Rivieras were very complex electronic cars to start with. Hopefully all of your problems are caused by the add-on system.

Joe

[NTX5467]

With regard to the chip key theft deterrent systems, many times the edges of the chip will wear away from use. The chip complete the circuit within the key cylinder. If the theft deterrent computer "reads" a wrong chip key or no chip key, then no "start" signals will be sent to the ECM. So, first thing would be to take the key to the dealer and get them to put it into their "decoder box" to see if a code is still being read. IF there's any doubt, get them to cut you a new chip key (there are 13 or so different chip codes! so they are not all the same).

From there, you'll need to make sure the key cylinder does not have an "open" circuit. Key information -- if you get a new key cylinder, it will come with a blank key in it for the "cut code" of the key. The dealership will use that blank to cut the new chip key, but the chip key will still need to match the code of the existing key. So . . . new key with the existing chip code. Chip keys are about $25.00 each.

The VATS key cylinder will look like a regular ignition key cylinder, but it will have two orange wires coming from it with a connector plug. The key cylinder and the keys are the main "wear" items in that system. The separate VATS computer is elsewhere in the vehicle. As mentioned, if the VATS computer suspects anything is not as it should be, no "start" command is sent. If a new VATS computer is needed, it must match the chip code of the key.

I concur, wiring that remote start system could be the entire problem so get it deactivated until you get the problem figured out. Could well be that is the whole problem too.

Now . . . if the vehicle has a transponder key, there will be no visible chips in it. It'll look just like a regular key, except they usually have the stamping "PK3" near the head of the key. If the vehicle's systems do not recognize that key, it will crank but not start. The vehicle has to recognize that key as being correct for the vehicle just as a keyless remote has to be programmed to the partcular vehicle.

Also, I suspect the vehicle could also have a factory keyless entry system. If the system does not read the vehicle as being "unarmed", it could keep things from working at all.

If you have a remote start system, it's highly possible they had to deactivate ALL of the factory theft deterrent systems so it would work. Which would probably generate their unique keyless entry transmitters. Sounds like a good bit of wiring harness "whacking" to make it work too--just my gut suspicion. One reason that GM started offering remote start systems on many of their new vehicles is so everything would match and not have any "interface" problems, which could happen between some aftermarket systems and the factory security systems.

Looks like there are several possibly failure modes in this situation. Personally, I don't see the need for remote start systems, especially in a vehicle with heated seats, but I know some people desire those systems. They might be a car theft waiting to happen, especially with an aftermarket system.

Just some thoughts,

NTX5467