gearboy

As you know, Denman stopped producing wide whitewalls in 7.00 x 15, an original equipment size in many 1941-47 cars, including 127-inch-wheelbase senior Packards, non-limo Cads, Buick Century/Roadmaster, Chrysler, etc. I have two new, one of them unwrapped, always in dark, cool storage. A third is used, cosmetically gorgeous, still good for concours and/or touring with 45% of tread remaining. A fourth has a cut in the carcass and is only good for a trailer queen or museum car driven on concours field and is yours for price of shipping. All four are unchecked, pliable, bright white sidewalls--tho' the unwrapped tire obviously still has the green soap Denman coats the tires with beneath the wrapping paper when they leave the plant. If you've given up finding wide white Denmans in this size, you're in luck. Reasonable. mike-exanimo@sbcglobal.net

As you've discovered, Denman no longer produces wide whitewall tires in 7.00 x 15, a correct, original equipment size on various 1941-47 automobiles, including 127-inch-wheelbase senior Packards, Buick Century/Roadmaster, non-limo Cads, Chryslers, etc. I have two new Denman 7.00 x 15s, one never unwrapped, always in dark, cool storage. A third is cosmetically gorgeous, but was used, with 45% of the tread remaining--still excellent for concours and/or touring. A fourth has a cut carcass and is only good for a trailer queen or museum car driven on concours fields and is yours for the cost of shipping, $15. All four are pliable with bright white, not yellowing, sidewalls. If you've given up finding Denman 7.00 x 15 wide whitewalls, i have them. Reasonable. [color:\\"black\\"]

Anyone have accurate information on gas lifespan, assuming your car's stored in a dark, cool, dry garage, not exposed to sunlight? Chevron says gas is good for a year, providing it is so stored at temperatures not exceeding 80 degrees Fahrenheit. A friend with a large car collection so stored says he's had no problem with two-year-old gas strictly in the above conditions. Chevron obviously doesn't want to open themselves to exceptions, litigation, etc. and so understates the maximum "shelf life." As all gasoline is essentially like aspirin, we figure this generalization holds true for other brands. We've noticed that gasoline stabilizers on the national market promise to protect gasoline for "....up to one year." So it looks like these companies offer only gladhanding. Anyone have anything concrete to offer? Please, no hearsay or pontification. Don't try to impress us with aviation, legal, quasi-engineering or baseball jargon. Just the facts, ma'am. We already know about avgas' increased longevity, but that's no longer a convenient option, so please stick to what you KNOW about automotive gasoline life today. Chevron also states that reformulated and California gas are equally or more stable than conventional blends. So please, stay on the subject. No rants about the EPA, MTBE, the good auld days, politicians, [color:\\"black\\"] ad nauseum. Just the facts, ma'am.

While not in Maryland, you can't go wrong with Hibernia Auto Restorations, Hibernia, NJ (973) 627-1882. They've been rebuilding US, English and Euro CCCA Classics since 1964. [color:\\"black\\"]

Why don't we hear more about wonderful, storied Classics like Rileys, Railtons and so many others? Rileys were not only front-runners at Le Mans in the '30s, but won the RAC Tourist Trophy at Ards 1932, '35, '36. Tho' long out of print, Richard Hough's splendid A History of the World's Sports Cars, with introductions by W.O. Bentley and S.C.H. Davis, profiles Rileys, including the MPH model. We should encourage owners of Rileys and other interesting sports and road cars to come out of hiding before the CCCA suffocates under Detroit/US iron and whitewall tires to the exclusion of all else. It's one thing to own a Packard, Cadillac, Auburn, etc., another to be unable to see past your own hood ornament. [color:\\"black\\"]

Jim Flack makes sound, long-overdue points regarding his Buick, especially since the 1938-39 80-Series Roadmaster became the 1940 80-Series Limited. This is a fine case where the spirit should trump the letter of the law. Regardless of original price, these Buicks had a certain cachet, and given their performance edge, often eclipsed their Clark Avenue stablemates with wealthy customers for the same reasons many English preferred a Bentley over a Rolls-Royce. Jim's comments on the original market for his car are correct. Most of the CCCA-approved Limiteds were in less august fleet and hire car service. In 1938-39, a senior Buick was as fast as anything off a new car showroom, discounting the last 18 '38 Pierce-Arrows with standard R-1 Warner overdrive and a handful of 134" wb Packard Twelves with the rarely ordered 4.06:1 axle. The '38 Buick Harris polled as most beautiful US car that year, and Jim's "banker's hot rod," as such barouches were often called, shares the aforementioned interior, etc. with the Cadillac. So perhaps it's time for the CCCA to accept what was called then, a "fine car," regardless of Flint orgins. Sadly, we've noticed the CCCA increasingly focusing on minutiae like "correct" hose clamps and fawning over Vietnamese and Mexican bias ply tires while overlooking the big picture: elan, performance, overall historical perspective. Meanwhile, if [color:\\"black\\"] you look in the Fisher Body Manual, you'll see that the CCCA-beloved yet down-market ($1,645 FOB, well below Jim's Buick) '41 Cadillac Series 62 convertible coupe shares every piece of sheet metal with the Pontiac, so a little historical perspective comes in handy.

I dislike using those old bumper jacks on a restored car with nice chrome. 1941-47 Packard Clippers have to be lifted higher than older models for the rear tire to clear the wheel well. I'm looking for the lightest possible jack to carry in the trunk. This question is only for Clipper owners who've changed a rear tire. The rest of you can get by with just about anything and a block of wood. We know these cars have power, but serious road car fans (and fliers) appreciate "weight is the enemy." I've already jettisoned 90 lbs. of dead weight and dislike carrying a single ounce of unneeded weight. I'd welcome make/model, collapsed and raised height, weight of jack of any type any of you are using on one of these cars. Cheap is good because this is only for the sake of a flat on the road, i'm not having the jack judged, and already have a serious three-ton floor jack for routine maintenance. [color:\\"black\\"]

If the CCCA is serious about authenticity, why aren't 1946-47 Classics with whitewalls docked points? Only a very few '47 models during the last weeks of the model year were delivered with whitewalls. A 1947 Classic otherwise would not wear whitewalls until the 8.20 x 15 size came out later in 1948 to replace the 1941-48 7.00 x 15. We thought the Club acknowledged only that which existed before the war; that which was a carryover from 1942. So, unless a 1947 Cadillac, Lincoln, Packard, etc.'s delivery date shows that the car was sold during the final few weeks of the 1947 model year, that car should NOT have whitewalls. All other 1946-47 Classics with whitewalls, to be authentically restored as "period used cars," would have to be shod in 8.20 x 15s, NOT 7.00 x 15. This would of course be a point deduction as this size didn't exist before the war, and preserving, maintaining, or restoring Classics as "late-model period used cars" is not the goal of the CCCA nor in the Club guidelines. [color:\\"black\\"]

I have a pair of 7.00 x 15 Denman wide whitewall (4 1/4-inch whitewall) tires which were never unwrapped until late June of 2004. They are still fresh and pliant. I ran them a total of 137 miles before deciding to try radials. (I've used Denmans on my Packards since 1976 and never a problem. Neither did they yellow like so many of the other brands of wide white collector tires.) If you've given up trying to find Denmans that still feel, look and smell new in every respect, I can help. These would do justice to a 100-point car. They're that nice. They are not blems or seconds. I also have another 7.00 x 15 Denman wide white that looks just as good (the car was always stored in a dark, cool garage and ridiculously babied) with 40% of its tread left, thousands of useful miles of life. A fourth tire also has 40% tread and is in the same shape, except an unseen cut in the carcass means it is best for a museum car or a trailered car driven only on show grounds. (You may have this fourth tire for the cost of shipping.) The tires are not mounted on wheels. Also: Set of four 5.50 x 15 Packard wheels. This size was used on 1942 160 conv. and 180 Darrin, as well as 1942 160/180 Cipper and 1946-47 Super/Custom Super Clipper (except limo, which is 5.50 x 16). Probably fit other Packards as well. Check your parts manuals. Two of these wheels are freshly powdercoated glistening black and have never been used. A third is also shiny black powdercoated, has been lightly used but still looks fresh. The fourth wheel is in good shape but needs painting or powdercoating. mike-exanimo@juno.com [color:\\"black\\"]

White it's good to have a sanctioning body like the CCCA as a "higher court" to help maintain authenticity, there's no denying that when it comes to tires, judging is skewed to vanity. Every 1946-47 US Classic (and non-Classic) with whitewalls should receive the same mandatory point-deduction, unless the serial numbers show the car was produced during the last month or so of '47 production. No cars were delivered with whitewalls during that period. In all other years, blackwalls should always be given an edge over whitewalls. Perhaps one car in 50 had whitewalls, fewer still in the '20s. Many people considered whitewalls tacky, ostentatious, even a little fruity. Meanwhile, let's say Bill's '40 LaSalle was instead a Full Classic '41 Cad Series 62 or 60S. It'd seem ludicrous and phony to dock him more points for wearing a bias-ply-sized and dimensioned Canadian blackwall radial instead of a crummy Vietnam- or Mexican-made bias-ply slathered with a whitewall and a US company logo/script. By the way, same with fog or driving lights. You hardly saw these things on cars back then, but today, everyone tacks them on. Look at photos of major city Packard agencies, for example. You'll see Packard Twelves of all body styles parked on carpets with potted palms in the background, and the cars have blackwalls and the base hood ornament almost never seen today, not the flying lady or cormorant. If the radial tire is in a non-metric, bias-ply size, as on Bill's coupe with its 7.00 x 15s, there should be no more point deduction than there is for using multi-viscosity oil instead of straight weight, using a modern quality corrosion inhibitor instead of soluble oil in the cooling system, or having safety glass in cars which originally didn't have it. Finally, this dichotomy of "those who drive their cars" vs. "those who show their cars" is wearying and a real turn-off, unless the CCCA's major thrust is over-restored trailer queens purveyed by wheeler-dealers and members whose business/livelihood is connected to the auto restoration/vanity industry. [color:\\"black\\"]

Thanks for the pictures, Bill. Spunky coupe. Is the Yokohama script in huge block letters? How noticeable is it? That'd be my only possible objection on a WWII-era car. We know Yokohama is actually a Canadian company, but we can hear the ribs from the sort of duffers who are still fighting WWII (but probably served in a supply depot in Kansas), overlooking that the Japanese-American 442nd Infantry Regiment was the most highly decorated in US Army history. I know of a '40 Packard 180 Darrin, black with black top with blackwalls (7.00 x 16 Firestone bias ply). Very sleek: basic hood ornament; no flying lady or cormorant. No foglights. No grille guards. You really see the car, not the tires. The owner tells me that for everyone who appreciates the tasteful understatement, someone else tells him he's "supposed to" have whitewalls. These "supposedta" types are a drag. We thought Model A Ford catalog restorations were for them. Have you racked up enough miles on the radials to note if there's any increased i.f.s. component wear? [color:\\"black\\"]

Thank you, gentlemen. This is exactly the sort of "hands-on," first-person, real-world, "Ask the Man Who Rolls on a Set" experience we're looking for. I say "we" because several Packard & Cad friends are waiting for me to be the rolling test bed before they abandon their Firestone and other bias plies. For some reason, the ONLY fellows we know hereabouts (the greater SF/Oakland Bay Area) running radials are several 1936-37 Cordites, who are all happy thus far; two of them even driving back to the A-C-D national meet in Auburn, Indiana. One other hesitation: I've heard from some savvy-sounding veterans that radials are harder on our older suspensions than bias ply. Have any of you observed or heard of any increased suspension component wear? Thanks again, Chuck, and a special word of congratulations to Bill for going blackwall. As we all know, in their day, perhaps one of our cars in 50 wore whitewalls; just look at any period newspaper or magazine street scene. And NO new cars, no matter how expensive, came with whitewalls during the 1946 and '47 model years (perhaps a very few during the last month of '47 deliveries). So if we're really serious about authenticity, perhaps we should all be docked points for whitewalls, or at least handicapped, with the nod going to blackwalls. What color is your LaSalle? My '47 Super Clipper's black with skirts, and i'm thinking blackwalls would look right sinister. I've looked in vain; is there a place online where we could see these Yokohama mommas up close and personal? Meanwhile, we'd love to see your LaSalle so equipped if you could post a picture or two! Always thought those final LaSalles were good-looking. (What became the '38 Cad 60S Fleetwood was originally intended as a LaSalle design.) The Europeans are more sophisticated than we are and learned long ago that a clean, elegant design doesn't need baubles like whitewalls. In the US, we have a tendency to load our cars with everything that was available to the point where at any meet or show we rarely get to see these cars as they really looked. [color:\\"black\\"]

Anyone have experience running, specifically, Diamond Back 7.00R15 radial wide whites on, specifically, 1941-48 Packards or Cadillacs? What psi are you running? Do you note an appreciable improvement over bias plies on a correctly aligned front suspension in good shape? Any whine, thrum, or hum? Quieter? Any experience with this size Diamond Back on the above cars? [color:\\"black\\"]

Getting back to the initial poster's opening question, "1940s Cadillac top speed?" GM Proving Grounds' figures for 1941-47 Cadillac Series 62 were 96 mph. The range was slim, 96 mph with manual transmission and the optional 3.36:1 "economy" rear axle, which was standard on the Hydra-Matic cars. Frictional losses in the Hydra-Matic cars netted a top speed a few tenths of a mile an hour slower. A factory publication on the 1941 Cadillacs issued to dealers admitted the '41 Buick Century/Roadmaster (Series 60 & 70 same wheelbase that year) was "....four miles an hour faster." That would put a new, stock, razor-tuned '41 Buick Century/Roadmaster with stock Compound Carburetion and the no-cost 3.6:1 "economy" rear axle instead of the stock 3.9 cog at an even 100 mph. Top speed is the result of horsepower, overall final gearing and coefficient of drag; CD rating or "aerodynamics." It has nothing to do with the hood ornament, brand name, speedometer reading, marketing or what Uncle Bob recollects. We've never seen factory, fifth-wheel or AAA-sanctioned, or reliably observed timed speeds (Autocar, Motor Trend, The Motor, etc.) for 1940-47 Packard Super-8 160 in either traditional body or the 1942-47 Clipper equivalent. However, we'd think that the 1942-47 Super-8 One-Sixty Clipper/Super Clipper would be slightly faster than the Compound Carburetor Buick. The Buick's listed equal hp came at 200 higher rpm, but the Clipper was a shade cleaner aerodynamically, including a more raked windshield (45 vs. 49 degrees), and an overall final drive of 2.95:1 in overdrive against 3.6, which is still fairly trucky. Acceleration is the result of torque, gearing and weight. Packard torque was 292 ft. lbs. vs. 283 for the Cad, 274 for the Buick. The Packard weighed anywhere from 60 or so to 185 fewer pounds than the corresponding 1940-47 GMobiles, and had better gearing for acceleration from rest, as well as from a 5 mph rolling start, which is how acceleration was usually tested in the '40s. The posters who typed "the '41 Buick was fastest ....claimed by the factory to top 108 mph, or 112 with the 3.60 gear" and that it was "....published somewhere by Cadillac....top speed somewhere around 106 or 107mph" are dreaming or confused. The best the respected, terribly precise magazine The Motor could extract from a supercharged '37 Cord 812 was 102 mph, and these had a dead minimum 170 hp, some later in the production year 180-185hp thanks to less blower inlet restriction. The Cord had much less frontal area than any of the aforementioned '40s cars and a final drive of 2.95:1. Ab Jenkins managed 108mph with a blown '37 Cord sedan at Bonneville, but that car may (there's still discussion) have been stroked. Motor Trend fifth-wheeled the new 1951 Chrysler Saratoga, carefully broken in with the 180-hp hemi-V-8 at 108 mph. This engine put out its peak hp at 4,600 rpm. The best R-R could do with their new 1952 Bentley R-Type Continental, again, less frontal area than '40s GM or Packard, 158 hp at 4,200 rpm through a 3.08:1 final drive, was 116.7 mph. The buff books enthusiastically round this to 120mph, but endlessly repeating does not make it so, just as 96mph does not magically, wishfully become "around 100 mph." So, let's enjoy our cars, but stick to facts. We have no idea what the poster was trying to get at by bringing up the '39 Langhorne, Pennsylvania stock car race on a dirt oval track. That's the province of acceleration and cornering, among other factors. Railroads used to test express steam locomotives in the '30s, with speeds to 110 and 120 mph, but it took eleven miles or more to get there. The poster's original question was "top speed." By the way, when Jaguar tested their new XK-150S, they not only removed the rearview mirror, but the radio antenna---how many square inches of frontal area was that? [color:\\"black\\"]

Why is it so urgent that the MKII or any other '50s car be admitted to a club for, essentially, prewar automobiles? Does the word "classic" have that much cachet? Instead of insisting that the CCCA recognize your out-of-the-era car, handsome as it is, why not join the Milestone Car Society, a respected organization created specifically to celebrate such automobiles? Why would you ask a group reinacting the 1861-65 US Civil War to include you, when you have a WWI doughboy uniform? Why not join the club reinacting WWI? Sounds like this is all about glomming on to the word "cla$$ic" instead of "mile$tone." These are all nice cars, and there are already clubs for all of them. It's not complicated. www.milestonecarsociety.org [color:\\"black\\"]

I think our auld friend Peter Hartmann was right on the money when he pointed out on this forum last year that people today are eager to have their cars considered "Classics" because it helps resale value, ego, etc. Monsignor Hartmann's also right that when the CCCA was formed 52 years ago, NO ONE cared about "Classic" cars. The term "Classic" was, if anything, effete in those days. Fast forward a few decades. Prewar Classics finally have their day in the collecting sun, so by the 1970s, mainstream America $ee$ a good thing and calls their '57 Chevrolets, T-Birds, '62 Impalas and anything else no longer in the current Kelley Blue Book "Classic." (In the late 1950s, early '60s, Simplex Speed Cars, Locomobiles, Pierce 66s, Chadwicks and the like were the blue chip cars, Duesenbergs still second-tier in most circles.) Why is it so difficult for some people to understand that the Classic Car Club of America was established in 1952 to celebrate and support the maintenance, preservation and faithful [color:\\"black\\"] rebuilding of fine automobiles of 1925-1942 [color:\\"black\\"] , the only postwar cars accepted being warmed over '42 models? You wouldn't show up at an 1861-65 US Civil War reinactment in a WWI doughboy uniform. Most of us with Classics have friends with (or own ourselves) equally fine cars built AFTER the CCCA years. My friend with a '59 Ferrari Pininfarina coupe doesn't whine about his car not being a CCCA Classic. He's too busy enjoying his car. This isn't rocket science. Anyone visiting a website who's too self-absorbed or dizzy to read the description of the organization on the homepage shouldn't merit an apology that his 1949,1950/60, etc. [color:\\"black\\"] wheeled alter ego isn't a CCCA Classic. I enjoy certain old Bentleys, but i don't take umbrage that my Packard isn't allowed into the Bentley Drivers' Club.

Darrin built a one-off convertible from a 1941 Clipper for Errol Flynn. The car vanished in Mexico decades ago. Tom Sumner, Seattle, WA, who owned it as a used car 50-odd years ago, recreated it using the more-robust 1947 Custom Super Clipper four-door sedan, which shares the '41 Clipper's 127-inch wb and sheet metal, tho using Packard's nine-main-bearinged 356-ci Super-8, the industry's most powerful engine until the '49 Cad ohv and '51 Chrysler hemi V-8s. The original '41 Clipper, and snub-nosed '42-'47 junior Clipper Eights, used a high-compression version of the 120's 282-ci inline 8. The 1942-47 junior Clippers are on a truncated 120-inch wb. (and excellent cars in their own right). [color:"black"] [color:"black"] The Classic Car Club of America refuses to accept Sumner's recreation, while allowing all manner of bogus-bodied '30s Cad V-16s, Duesenbergs and Packard Twelves. Order Spring,'92 The Packard Cormorant issue #66 from the Packard Club (PAC) for a brief story with a couple color photos of Sumner's exhaustive recreation, as well as a b&w of Flynn's car. If the Club's sold out, i have a couple back issues, as well as many parts for 1941-47 Packard Clippers. See my ad several months ago (scroll down) on the CCCA's website Parts for Sale forum. Best. "gearboy"

Just wondering. Given a savvy, careful driver, is it less trauma on the car to downshift, to ease down into second gear overdrive from overdrive third on the occasional times when overdrive's too long-legged on the open road than to floor the accelerator and use the kick-down switch? I'm not concerned with how streamlined, Buck Rogers and E-Z automakers were trying to make driving 60-65 years ago, but with what's easiest on the overdrive/transmission gears today. [color:\\"black\\"]

As historically important as the debut Ferrari is, isn't it better represented by the Milestone Car Society and the SCCA, among many other clubs? We thought the idea of the Classic Car Club of America was to recognize fine cars, luxury, sporting, or both, produced between 1925-42, with certain exceptions through 1947 or '48 so long as they're [color:\\"black\\"] essentially unchanged continuations of prewar models.

Samb2 --- This is a site for fans of the finer cars of 1925-42 (and a few unchanged, carryover [color:\\"black\\"] exceptions through '48). So it looks like your event's a mite new for us. I thought, out of "10,000 cars," we might've seen a few prewar survivors. It's always nice to see how 60-80-year-old genuine Classics have survived around the world. I've sold parts to owners of Full Classic Packards in Scandinavia. All best.

Samb2 -- For those of us Yanks unwilling to bolt pontoons on our Packards, would you post a few photos of this Swedish extravaganza? Thanks! [color:\\"black\\"]

Anyone know the reading range when using an ohmmeter to monitor electrical properties of engine coolant as measure of the coolant's health? In other words, below such-and-such OK, between such-and-such marginal, over such-and-such, time to change coolant. Would the baseline be different for soft water and a good quality corrosion inhibitor like No-Rosion or Redline vs. water and antifreeze? Anyone using this test? We tried it 20 years ago in one of my cars, but as we moved the meter's test probes in the coolant, got varying readings and gave up. [color:\\"black\\"]

There's an interesting feature on taller gearing for vintage and Classic cars in the Nov./Dec.,'94 Special Interest Autos issue #144: Down to the Interstate in Ships; Modern Speed in Vintage Iron. A couple aftermarket sources are listed in the article. You can order a back issue from Hemmings at 1 (800) 227-4373. OD/taller gearing really improves the [color:\\"black\\"] experience.

I have an array of excellent parts cherry-picked from several restorable California cars in the 1970s by a fastidious collector. Most wrecking yards handling cars older than 20 years have long-since been bulldozed, developed, malled and paved. I prefer quick sale to CCCA and PAC insiders now. If i have to pay for pricey ads the sale price will reflect that expense and hassle, so if you or any friends are rebuilding/repairing/upgrading one of these fine road cars, act pronto. Scroll midway down the preceding page of this forum for detailed listing [color:\\"black\\"] .

When Packard approached Darrin to tender what led to the successful 1941 Clipper, they were, to quote Darrin himself, "So afraid of GM they couldn't see straight." Darrin often said Packard had the finest chassis in the industry. But the upper-echelon GMobiles, Buick and Cadillac, weren't bad cars. It's just, in my 'umble opine, that Packards were more refined and better road cars; overdrive, needle bearings where GM used a plain bushing, fine-threaded bolts everywhere, etc. Were you a savvy motorist visiting new car dealerships in 1940-47, you'd feel the difference in a Packard vs. GMobile. But for most folks, GM was good enough, plenty of car at cutthroat pricing, and the coup de grace was the sophisticated GM styling, notably the racy new 1940 1/2 (introduced mid-year) C-bodies, and the muscular-looking '41 Cad and Buick (tho' i personally prefer the softer "waterfall" grille of the 1939-40 Cad). In fact, the 1941 1/2 (introduced mid-year, April, '41) Packard Clipper borrowed a little from GM's C body. Thanks to the Clipper, Packard momentarily regained style leadership, but war 18 months later ended that. As owner of a '47 Packard Super Clipper, i'd have to agree with Darrin's assessment of GM's styling dominance in 1939-40. Packard's traditional look might look swell to collectors today, but it was increasingly old hat as the Forties opened, hence the need for the Clipper, whose promise was cut short by War II. And don't forget GM's Hydra-Matic. While it's a convenience, not performance feature, and of no interest to fans of genuine "road cars," Hydra-Matic was an enormous boon to GM sales. Packard could only counter, hastily, with their 1941 Electromatic clutch. (1948-on Buick Dynaflow and 1949-on Packard Ultramatic are beyond the scope of this website.) Please refer to my earlier post, and remember, these were just companies manufacturing consumer products, not armed camps.[color:\\"black\\"]