BqUICK

Adam, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year! I installed the first of a set of two Talbot Racing Mirrors. They were made in Berlin in the late 50's to early 60's. There are many copies made of these mirrors found on $250,000.00 Shelby Cobras and other fine racing automobiles. Real Talbots cost nearly $300.00. each for 4" Berlins. These have the authentic stamp from the Talbot Co. in West Berlin, Germany. Please post thanks, Michael PS: Ebay, ofcourse!

Smartin, Thanks again for posting my pix! John, thanks for the photos from your Electra225.com archives. Tires: What you see are the new Pirelli CORSA racing tires with the wavy tread AND the "old" P-ZERO Pirellis with more traditional tread for comparison purposes. The P-ZERO front tires were 235/45/17s and are regarded as too narrow for such a heavy car. I bought the P-ZEROS without the benefit of experienced road racers that we now have on the team. The CORSA offers a 255/40/17 wide tire with much more contact area than the Pirelli ROSSOs we tried a few weeks ago. Also, the SUPER wide 335/35/17 Pirelli P-ZEROS are staying on the rear. We needed a tire that was capable of handling a road course as well as straight line capability in excess of 150mph with the proper load rating. At one time I did see driving the car on the street, however as the Faithful Pursuit goes faster it will be less streetable. We will use slicks for Watkins Glen to see how the car handles. My thanks to the Langley Crew for the Pirellis! These guys just want to see what this thing will do so they send me some neat things from time to time! Cal and his friends are great sponsors!

Merry Christmas too all of you! Thanks for all of the support and encouragement, especially the service personnel who took time to write and view. God Speed and God Bless!

JohnD Yes, this is the code that I am referring to. There are a few club members and some other GS GSCA and other organization members who have such parts and OR the cars. They are difficult to find these days. 1969 Buick Assembly Instructions Manual Le Sabre - Wildcat - Electra - 45000 - 46000 - 48000 - SERIES Axle & Rear Suspension and Driveline (Section 4) THESE CODES ARE FOR 1969 BUICK ELECTRA 225 SERIES 48000 ONLY! If you have a different car some codes are shared. 3.42, was also a big car rear. Look on the drivers side rear drum for the yellow painted two letter code within the bolt circle. There are also stampings on the axle tube bottom three inches from the differential housing flange. Once you have located the code I can tell you what you have. This will give you a start... RATIO - REGULAR - POSI - DUTY ---------------AC DELETE 2.78 -- PL ------- P0 -- STANDARD ------------NO -- Great 15 sec gear for stockers 2.56 -- PB ------- PN -- ECONOMY -------------NO -- Great economy & 130 mph+. Good BMW killer. 3.23 -- PH ------- PR -- PERFORMANCE -------- NO -- Great 14 Second gear in stock form. 3.91 -- N/A ------ PX -- SPECIAL CAR ORDER -- YES -- All the greats ran this. 3.07 -- N/A ------ PV -- SPECIAL CAR ORDER -- NO -- I do not have personal knowlegde. We used to call it a 3.08 in error, but it was a good Electra gear. GS/GN/NE #33

JohnnyD'56 This is an option that was available for the big Buicks and was a special order. 10 - 11 - & 12 second Electras often ran with this gear in the huge "9-3/8" BUICK ONLY rear. Back in those days Buick still made their own rear ends. In any case, you will find the 3.91 code or "PX" on the build sheet as it was a special option. You will also find the code on the driver's side rear drum. It is a painted code near the bolt circle. It was A/C delete. I am not sure if it is on the plate. There may be other ways to tell exactly what you have and perhaps some of the others on this thread can pipe up.

BUICKRACER, SMARTIN, & ALL, Thanks for the information on the new Buick Block. The photos are great, especially the ones with people that are clearly pleased. The final machining looks like it has yet to be completed. I know Jim B. is taking orders but I dont know if they have actually built and run it yet.

There are many neat plates that I have seen over the years and I am sure that you have as well. Thinking about the LeSabre... 1. GHOST (Recalling Harley Earl's most fabulous '51 LeSabre) 2. IEATZ28S (Used by an old friend 20 years ago) 3. IEATRCRZ (Drag Ricers might get Pissed, if they get it) 4. QUICKLE (The only original idea in the bunch) 5. LESIZMOR (Not the run of the mill.) 6. SEMIWEDG (Run of the 430 "mill" & its partial wedge design.) 7. THX1138 (This is cool because you have to be over 40 to know what it means.) You have to think about what you like about your car. Is it the mechanics of the driveline, the clean lines of the body, or the stealth aspects. Also, why blow your cover? Make something up original and YOU will give it meaning when you earn a rep on the street among your friends, the show circuit, or at the track when you [censored] off the unsuspecting. May God Speed you in a Buick,

One of my old car buddies from Flatbush is crew chief for a FWD drag ricer team. He races 1990's RWD 500++ cube Caddy's on the side. After not hearing from Don in about 20 years, he calls me and tells me there was an R&D effort underway for a successor to the the fabulous Buick 455. We talked for an hour about engine and head development work, porosity issues in the castings and other challenges. This was about 2 or more years ago. New Buick 455, I think, "Sure, sure I know all about it!" No, it was not the TA people or the Poston people, or any of the other guys who have been talking smack about designing a new block and needing $$ partners for the past 20 years! The Caddy performance guys Don has been working with, an outfit called BullDog, gave him the slim on a side project. Don knew the "Faithful Pursuit" back in the '70s when she was 1969 Electra, with a '70 nose, in Black primer with a new SF 455 from a '70 GS we gutted. (Sorry GS guys!) Don called me, after bumping into another old Poncho 400 buddy of mine from the block and now after 20 years I was talking to a Caddy guy who seemed to know a bunch about this Buick project taken on by people I had never heard of. Roberta knew, ofcourse, but hey that's Roberta for you. She knows stuff you can't imagine! My humble attempts to get information were fruitless and besides I had my own issues, my chassis man had died at around that time. There was no data for about a year as Don dropped out of sight again. These "Bulldog" people could not be found. Site searches came up empty. Within the past two years stuff started popping up. Jim Burek at PAE seemed to be part of this too. It seemed for awhile like it was just another pipe dream as there were delays, issues, whatever! Now, BAM! The new block is here and the price does to seem bad either! $3,500 base. Okay, well suppose I buy one. What is the skinny on the the Buick V-8 block? The word on the street is that it should be a much better block but there may have been compromises that traded off traditional Buick strengths for more power handling capability. Lets look at the soft side first. For example, I personally liked to bragg about the light weight Buick 455, about the same as the all aluminum Z-L1. Now what do I say, I have a boat anchor chivvy with Stage "?" heads? I guess I got used to being the underdog. Is this new block basically a Chevy with Buick heads? IF she will hold SUSTAINED WOT 900 HP for 30+ minutes we MAY be able to talk. My car weighs over 4500lbs with the aerodynamincs of a painted brick. Having the stones is not a touchy-feely "would be nice" requirement. If she blows her biscuits at 185 mph, then what! Do a Guadagno (sorry Scotty) on my roof at 185? In the Nevada desert, 100 miles from nowhere? No way! I would like to see a statistically significant comparison of the engine's performance and reliability against my "mild" 500HP Scotty Guadagno/Pee Gee/TA Performance INTIMIDATOR in my Electra GSX "Faithful Pursuit". I want to see it stacked up against the big boys in an engine build off competition. I want to see low 8 second "stock bodied" 3,500lb GS pulls. I want incredible performance data and solid results! I am already talking to an ex Garrett guy about a low rpm Turbo setup for the Faithful pursuits next Buick motor. By 2007 I will really need 900+ HP to sustain the goal of a 194.9mph high speed pass by 2009. I want to run the Electra GSX. If this motor is the real deal, I need to know now! Buickracer, what do you think? (PS: Ruth says hi and to drop by when you are up this way again!) http://bulldogperformance.net/buick.html

Hej (Hello) Nailswede, I have selected the P-ZERO CORSA racing tires, 255/40/17 for the front. There is a RIGHT tire and a LEFT specially made for that position. Also, we will try NASCAR style slicks at Watkins Glen because they are plentiful around here and we can just borrow some from Machuga Chassis to see how they perform. The P-ZERO CORSAS are street legal and offer a wider tire with more grip than the P-ZEROs I currently have or the P-ZERO ROSSOs that I returned last week. Our champion driver, Roy Hopkins of "One Lap of America" fame, said 235s were pretty narrow for such a large car. I bumped it up to 255s on the CORSAs. The NASCAR stuff is probably on the order of 275 to over 300 mm wide which may be tough to fit on the front. We currently run 335/35/17 P-ZERO on the rear with the space for a wider tire if necessary. Thanks for your advice,

CrazyforAbby, The 400-430-455 are all the same series with some changes to each one. You may find that there are a LOT of low cost 430s around and they are good motors. My 4,700 lb Electra Convertible runs 15.35 @ 89mph with a stock 430 and duals. Some stockers are running faster, my car has 96K miles and has never been apart, just a new timing chain and gears, waterpump, good tune, and a carb rebuild. Good luck with your build up.

Nailswede, Thanks for the info on the Pilot Sports. We will be playing around with a few different combos until we get one that works for us. We need tires that can handle slight inputs at high speeds with a heavy car. The tires must be able to perform well at sustained high speeds and not loose their grip on roads that may already be 130 degrees F or hotter. Thanks! PS: How do you say hello in Sweedish?

Yes! Thats the body style that is perfect! It has really nice lines, naturally I'm partial to the Electra but the LeSabre was very similar. Can you imagine not only blowing the competition away in the straights but killing them pulling G's too! That would be too much!!! Boy would they be pissed!!! I really like the idea of a very clean stocker with a killer 430! As you know the 430 is grossly underrated and almost always gets junked! People do not realize that it has largely the same performance capability of the 427 ZL1 from the weight to torque point of view. Add aluminum heads and manifold and you are lighter than the all aluminum ZL-1 by several pounds. (Anyone know how much?) What is the combo you are going for? Good luck,

Hotrod '84 LeSabre, Now an '84 LeSabre with a 500 HP 430 IS COOL!. Its the last of the big Buicks typically not associated with performance, which make it a true super sleeper in classic Buick style! Got pictures!?! God Speed!

Thanks for posting photos of My Electra 225 "GS" This is the car that I drag race from time to time. It sure is fun to beat Mustangs and Firebirds in style! I try to avoid the water at the burnout box and just do a little burnout to "clean" the tires. I roll up and typically line up on the lights fairly easily. With a mild launch she hooks pretty well and my R/T is between .55 and .65, .49 being a red light. I usually get comments like "Oh baby!!!" at the line or some people are "Pissed" and say "I cant believe you beat on THAT car like that!" The big Buick Electra was built to do this kind of thing all day long. Back when the speedlimits could be 65 - 90, she could get onto an highway on-ramp from a standing start and get to 90 mph in under 16 seconds with 4 people and luggage! Stock 1969 Buick Electra Custom Convertible With "GS" Scripts 48400 67 C 1969 Buick Electra Custom 225 Convertible "C" Body 4,700 lb 2.5" Dual Exhaust Dynomax Mufflers 235 70R 15s Buick Rallye Wheels 2.73 Positive Traction Points 45TS Plugs Her best has been 15.35 @ 89 mph This Electra is a "Knockout!"

It looks like we are running too narrow a tire on the front, given the weight and suspension setup. Even the 235 Pirelli ROSSOs will not be quite enough. Roy likes to use 265s all the way around in his BMW road racer. He said that we should use 255s at a minimum. The Electra is a lot lighter on the front end, probably 200 - 300 lbs lighter, thanks to AC delete, trunk mounted battery, aluminum intake, and headers. Weight distribution, speed, track characteristics will all play a role in how we actually set up the suspension and tires. The balance of the car will be confirmed with scales in Dave's shop. We will give the setup our best initial try then the track will tell us the rest this spring. Machuga Chassis uses NASCAR B MODIFIED tires. Dave said he would let me try a set on to check the fit. The chassis was designed to handle these kind of slicks but front clearance may be an issue. The NASCAR slicks are probably on the order of 275 - 335 wide. If they fit ok, we will use those for local racetrack work and save our Pirellis for the Silver State Classic Challenge. Did you know the Buick Blackhawk uses 295x 18s all the way around on Corvette suspension!?!

Buickman67, I race a stock 1969 Buick Electra Custom Convertible With "GS" Scripts 48400 67 C 1969 Buick Electra Custom 225 Convertible "C" Body 4,700 lb 2.5" Dual Exhaust Dynomax Mufflers 235 70R 15s Buick Rallye Wheels 2.73 Positive Traction Points 45TS Plugs Her best has been 15.35 @ 89 mph In your last note you wrote: <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> 15.296 sec @ 91.46 mph </div></div> Your 4DR HT, either a code "69" Nothback Pillar (4 Window)Sedan has outstanding performance. How did your '71 Electra do at the track? Did the lower compression affect performance much?

My wife and I were busy re-arranging things in our 16 year olds room this morning. He is away at a Christian retreat for the weekend and she thought "Lets move his bed to a different place". Needless to say, we were vacuuming, removing tons of junk, candy wrappers, dishes, etc. etc. I happened to look out the window to our fenced in back yard and to my surprise, in the middle of the yard were a stack of new tires! To my greater surprise, they were the coveted 189 MPH "ROSSO" Pirelli P-ZEROS by Pirelli. Cal Hardy and his people sent a fine set of new tires for the front of our heavy race Buick. I gave him a wish list of about 10 things 8 or so months ago and ever since then, things have been showing up unexpectedly! The last time it was a dry cell race battery! The Faithful Pursuit needs very expensive "Y" rated tires. We currently run on an older version of Pirelli P-Zeros and a replacement set will be needed this year. Any racing effort requires people who unselfishly give support. Spare tires, batteries, welding services, polyurethane bushings, and their time. We have received all of these things through the generosity of people who have said "I just want to see this thing go!" & "We have never done anything like this before so we will not charge you for the R&D!" Some people Like Cal are not looking for recognition and do not have products or services to market! They just love cars! Thanks Cal and friends, God Speed! http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Pirelli&tireModel=PZero+Rosso+Asimmetrico

Swede, The Electra GSX is up on the stands with the suspension out and 50% of it blasted, prepped, and painted. Holes were drilled into the trunk for the 1969 "GS" swing away emblem. The spoiler will have to be removed to get access for the necessary bolt holes. ...Talked to the owner of "Trackmasters" on Wednesday WHO RACES AN AWESOME PANOZ! The Trackmasters organization arranges training at Watkins Glen International Raceway. We will get the spring schedule of the track openings so we can get some time in April/May. We are planning to upgrade the Electra GS Convertible prototype to do some short hauling. Looking at tires, hitches, suspension options. Meeting the president of the Experimental Aircraft Association at Corning Elmira Airport to discuss sponsorship of our "Tuskegee Airmen" themed racecar. We can use it to draw kids who are interested in aviation to EAA event. There is still so much to do and little time! Grenada relief still is a high priority as we send supplied up to twice a month to collection centers in NYC. I bought a huge 5' x 7' Grenadian flag that I intend to fly behind the car at some point. We can perhaps raise awareness this way since a late Tuskegee Airman relative of mine was an American of Grenadian descent like me. Best regards,

1970 Electra, despite the "1975" misprint! This car has the 2nd most powerful GM motor of the period, the Buick 455. Nice car. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=4501739009&category=80732

Kool! A new Buick Electra site by "Detroitwheeliedog". He is building an Electra and has good ideas. http://www.detroitwheeliedog.com/page5.html May God Speed you on your way in a Buick! -------------------- BqUICK

Kool! A new Buick Electra site by "Detroitwheeliedog". He is building an Electra and has good ideas. http://www.detroitwheeliedog.com/page5.html May God Speed you on your way in a Buick!

Smartin, Thanks for posting these. The 430 STAGE 2 sticker is available from Osborn. The photo features a STAGE 2 "Head" motor in the foreground. The '70 GS is the old Reynolds Buick racer. The late great "Pop" Kennedy of Kenne-Bell Buick fame is in the center. It is possible that the motors on the stands are 1967 - 69 430s. The valve covers are difficult to see as the photo was really small. Another photo, not pictured, shows the dual quad motor with 400/430 valve covers. The sticker says Kenne-Bell so I do not know if the motor is a pre 1970 430 STAGE 1 or 2. (From the BUICK POWER BOOK, by Marty Schoor, 1979) What is a Riviera doing there among the racer guys? Is it a STAGE test car? Pop used to trounce much smaller cars with his 4,400 lb, switch pitch, nail head, 4.44 geared, Invicta back in the 60s! He loved to race with big Buicks! If anyone has any more info about this photo, please share it. Thanks!

Smartin, For some reason I cannot pull up your link. Here are some details that might help others interested. Please post the scan of my valve cover sticker so that people could see what one looks like. Thanks man! Jim Osborn Reproductions, Inc. http://www.osborn-reproduction.com/ Look under "A" body VALVE COVER DECALS. ITEM NUMBER: DB0325 1967-69 430-4 STAGE 2 V.C.D. God Speed,

hotrod 84 lesabre, The 430 STAGE 2 Decals were nice quality reproductions but do not have the bumpy NOS type surface, if you know what I mean. They were kinda special and I never saw them in a catalog. I went to Hershy, PA and saw them on display and almost had a heart attack! After 30 years I never knew there were 430 STAGE 2s and I thought they were "one-off" fakes for some 430 nut! They represent the actual 430 STAGE 2 motor! God Speed, http://www.osborn-reproduction.com/

Guy, It was good to see this thread come alive again. You can send your 70 Stg2 Pops/KenneBell car photos to SMartin and he can post them. You have uncovered a lot of good information about when STAGE 2 heads were first developed, pre-1969. As a mechanical engineer, I know it takes years to develop parts at the GM corporate engineering level. Your car is quite a find! I race 1969 & 1970 Buick Electras, good for low 15s stock with duals. There are unofficial reports of STAGE 1 SS coded Electras that were sold by dealers. We now know there were STAGE 2 430s built for racing, sans the STAGE 2 heads only the STAGE 2 cam. STAGE 2 heads MAY have been tested on a 430 initially with disappointing results due to Bore/valve "shrouding" hurting flow. The larger 4.312" 455 bore helped! There was a "PX" Code AC delete 3.91 Positraction option as well for the Electra. If those options did coexist in one car, with dual exhaust or dealer MT Super Scavenger headers, a 12-13 second factory Electra would gave been possible! I can tell you however, from first hand experience, adapting headers to a 1969 Electra requires chassis and transmission cross member changes! http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=138419&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1 I have tried to re-create a PX Code 1969 Buick Electra 430 STAGE 2 using a NOS 1997 Pee Gee Performance 455 STAGE I "INTIMIDATOR" block and Ford 9". The Buick 9-3/8" 3.91 rear is very rare and I would put that in a lighter duty drag car and not a high speed rally racer like my 1969 Electra GSX. There are a few people out there who know their STAGE 2 history pretty well. Perhaps you can contact Jim Bell, he is still kicking and may talk to you if you tell him what you have! God Speed,