Packard V-8 Oil System HD mods

[WCraigH]

Here's a preview of the oil system modifications I have undertaken for my Panther project. Oil pump:

(1) removed vacuum pump

(2) replaced bottom plate with 1/4-in steel plate

(3) machined bottom mating surface for 0.002 clearance with plate

(4) installed bronze bushing in pump body for driveshaft

(5) rotated stock pickup tube 1-1/2in higher than stock (not shown)

(6) replaced driveshaft with stock length plus 1-1/2in driveshaft

[WCraigH]

The next oil system modification was to machine a 1-1/2in spacer to lower the oil pump that amount into the oil pan. Lowering the oil pump emerses the driveshaft entry hole that much lower in the oil and reduces the hydraulic head pressure on the pickup side.

This spacer serves an additional purpose which is to reroute the pump output outside the engine. The purpose of this is to mount an external full flow oil filter. It could also be used as the scavenge side of a dry sump oil system!

This is an early mockup, so the -10 lines don't quite line up. I don't have the final version assembled right now, but this pic will give you the idea.

[WCraigH]

Here's a bottom view of the new oil output routing:

In the final version, the -10 fittings and lines fit inside the oil pan. I used a more compact 90-deg fitting than that shown in this picture. Also, the adapter was trimmed back and the hole was threaded a little deeper into the adapter.

The 90-deg fitting in the #4 main web is attached at the location of the stock 1/4NPT hole originally used for the steel tubing vacuum line from the vac pump. It has been drilled and retapped for 3/8NPT, which is the smallest size compatible with -10 swivel fittings. The outlet on the side of the block is likewise drilled and retapped.

Although I don't have a pic of it right now, the outlet from the remote filter (or dry sump pump) would be attached at the existing 45-deg hole into the main oil gallery by the distributor. This hole is also drilled and retapped to 3/8NPT.

[WCraigH]

Hey guys, I didn't expect this posting to be uncommented upon! Surely some of you with oil pump experience have an opinion.

As far as I know, this is an original one-off for the Packard V-8. But, this kind of modification is not that uncommon, particularly in the flat head Ford V-8 world which has an even worse problem with oiling and filtering.

[Guest Randy Berger]

Craig, I think it's really great. I had thought of using flexible lines going out through new holes in the pan but didn't like the idea/problem of pan removal/installation. I hadn't thought of coming back in the main oil gallery from above, though. You almost have to have the engine out of the car to do this properly, particularly drilling and tapping the hole by the oil pressure sending unit. Although more unsightly you could mount an elbow where the sending unit goes and run the oil return in there and mount the pressure switch at the end of that. Not enough room at distributor to just insert a T fitting. Adding a full-flow filter is a great idea. Did anyone else have that in 55??

YFAM, Randy

[WCraigH]

Redrilling the existing holes and retapping for 3/8NPT would be impossible with the engine in the car. I made up a couple of crude, but effective jigs to guide the hand drill. Here's the jig for #4 main web:

The jig bolts to two oil pan holes to hold it firmly in place. The wood spacer (meat in the sandwich, so to speak) is to get enough thickness to hold the drill bit firmly in position. Here's the one for the outlet side:

I forgot to take pics of the jig setup for the top of the block, but it bolts to the transmission holes. Also, I used a 1/2-in drill and then a 9/16-in drill for the clearance hole, so the jig gets sacrificed for the 1/2-in step. The spec'd drill for 3/8NPT is 17/64-in hole, but using 9/16-in means that there's more material left for support and it still provides adequate threads for attachment.

One [color:"red"] MIGHT be able to do these mods with the engine assembled, particularly the outlet ones, but control of metal shavings and cleanup would be critical.

[WCraigH]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> (snip) Completely immersing the oil pump in the sump looks like another way to keep air from getting into it. Do you plan on letting the "immersion" supply the bushing and driving shaft with oil, or did you also "install" the passage that <span style="font-style: italic">PackardV8</span> (<span style="font-style: italic">Keith</span>) found? </div></div>

I'll rely upon immersion to oil the top bushing.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The only problem in duplicating your work would be machining and drilling a spacer to properly fit the Packard V8 block - might be beyond the skills of most hands-on owners. Are the spacer and jig(s) something that you plan to market as part of a "kit"? </div></div>

I had the same local machinist who mods the T-L links to adjustable type make the spacer/adapter. It took four tries after throwing away the first one which had been modified twice. But, hey that was the learning curve to get it right. However, given a simple blueprint, this is something that your local machinist could duplicate given the bare block w/rear main cap, oil pump and oil pan. Therefore, I don't plan to offer these. I would also supply the P/N and vendors for the AN and remote filter adapter, so you could buy them yourself.

[Guest imported_PackardV8]

Craig wrote:

"(4) installed bronze bushing in pump body for driveshaft "

Craig, can u give us some details on the bushing that was installed????

Does it extend the full length of the ORIGINAL bearing surface or installed in t upper locating lug only???? Wall thickness of bushing. Oil grooved????

[Guest imported_PackardV8]

i learned a good short cut. I have always in the past cut and drilled (as thick as 1/2" SOLID steel plate) to make drill guides. It never occured to me to use 2wo thinner pieces of steel plate and a wood spacer. In fact, i have never seen that method used before. Slick trick Craig. At least alot easier than my 'hard-way' method. I'll have to try it next time. NOTE: that drilling cast iron is tricky so u might want to change the dril bit cutting angle (i think its 31 degrees, but double check on that). CAREFUL tapping it too.

[WCraigH]

The oil pump driveshaft bushing is on the upper part only. I had the machine shop do it and I wasn't there, so I don't know the bushing particulars.

Drilling the holes in the block in stages (1/2, then 9/16) went smoothly. Of course engine block cast iron has some carbon (graphite) in it, so it self-lubricates.

I hand tapped the 3/8NPT, "sneaking up" on the depth that I needed. I went with the minimum possible, given than the thickness in those areas is not the greatest. Here's a shot of the finished result on the #4 main web:

[Guest imported_PackardV8]

ok. here we go. It cost my $18 and 2 weeks of waiting to find this out:

I have in my possession an NOS AMC oil pump input shaft for the Packard V8 powered AMC or Hudson.

Now get this: The shaft is approximatly 3/8-1/2 inch SHORTER than a Packard shaft. The key way is OBVIOUSLY much higher on the shaft such that if the gear were installed flush with the bottom of the shaft then about 1/3 of the key would be showing above the TOP of the gear. The diameter is .493 which matches the Packard shaft diameter.

It came with a tag wired to it. On the tag is the "AM" script logo with parts number 6471013 and below it rather faintly is written either 77 or 97 follwed by a 67.

Now, the SHORTER length tells me that the flex joint must have set much closer to the shaft bearing than in the engine used in Packard. ALSO the higher set key way indicates that the shaft must have protruded from the end of the gear ALA LOWER plate bushing feature ALA no vacuum pump.

[joe kastellic]

Randy, when I met you at warren at the Packard meet, you mentioned that when you remove the oil pan there was few steps you had learned that can make the removal of the oil pan a little eaiser to remove with the engine in the car, of course its a little foggy now so could you over that again. Thanks Joe

[Guest Randy Berger]

Joe, remove the four bolts holding the sway bar and

splash shield at the front of the car, and pull the

bar out of the way and remove the shield. This allows

you to get at the front pan bolts from underneath

which is a much easier access. Good luck.

YFAM, Randy Berger