Kevin_S

Hi Jeff, I just came across the three 1909 sales brochures at NYPL yesterday, definitely confirming that the vehicles I have pictures of are a Peerless Model 19. I've checked NYPL before, these must have just gone online. The images 1163180 and 1163773 are clearly the same car as the image that my grandmother gave me (which I haven't yet shared here, I'll digitize and do so soon.) Any sales records on how many Model 19's we built? K

Hi Jeff, I have three images of the cars that were owned by the Logans, one of which came from my grandmother, and two of which came from a Logan descendant I have been in touch with. Two images clearly show my g'grandfather at the wheel, and one has a driver but it is too hard to tell. The image I posted above is from the Logan descendant and is clearly my relative driving. The other two I will try to post later. I looked at each one very closely, and at the images of the 09 and am finding small descepencies in each. CAR 1 (not pictured, but my g'grandfather at the wheel) 1) Front and rear fenders do not wrap down, they terminate horizontal to the ground 2) Square cowl lights 3) Right Hand drive 4) Rear step into back seat has interesting curve to it 5) 10 spoke wheels 6) louvered hood Differences compared to the one for sale: 1) I can't see if the Peerless script is on the grill of my photograph 2) Headlights are different (look larger in my photograph) Car 2 (as pictured above, my relative at the wheel) 1)Same in most respects as Car 1, including some initials painted on a door Differences from Car 1: 1) Front fender is curved down in the front 2) no hood strap Differences compared to the one for sale: 1) Front fender is curved down in the front 2)running board has a canvas storage sack, not a metal box 3) no canisters on the left running board 4) square tail light Car 3 not pictured, unidentified man at wheel) It is definitely a Peerless, as the brass plate is in an identical location and size as the Peerless for sale. Also Similar to car 1 1) Front and rear fenders do not wrap down, they terminate horizontal to the ground 2) Almost everything else Different to Car 1 & 2 1) the cowl lights are round, trumpet style 2) hard to see, but look like smaller headlights Similar to car for sale: 1) Headlights and taillight 2) running board boxes and canisters The difference in lights could have taken place over time, but the for the chronology to work the fenders would have been flat, then round, then flat, so perhaps I am looking at two cars. With this information in hand I got in touch with the seller of the 09. We shared some correspondence and discovers that his 09's earliest known registration was in 1938 in a town not 20 minutes from where the Logans and my g'grandfather lived. We can only assume that his car, and the car in image 3 are in fact the same one. This has been an incredibly fun research project!

Hi Jeff, Thank you for the replies. I did take a look at the 1909 Model 19 that didn't sell. There are great pics at: http://www.conceptcarz.com/vehicle/default.aspx?carID=14611&eventID=187&catID=1435&whichpage=1 I have another view of the car my g'grandfather drove, (which I don’t have scanned) and besides the missing Peerless script on the grill, its spot on. What an amazing, huge car, and envisioning my g'grandfather driving it from Brooklyn to Vermont is impressive. If you could pass along my info to Richard, it would be appreciated, I’d be interested in reading his update, or even helping out. I can see the point of Bryan Moran’s comments in a different post: “It would be a major undertaking for many reasons, not the least of which is time since they were last made, a prospective publishers reticence at underwriting such a book, what with limited possible purchasers, getting the facts straight (there are as many Peerless tales as their are facts) getting adequate photos (you can only paint so good a "picture" with words - people want to see the CARS)” To the point of ‘limited purchasers” it may be more sellable, and interesting, to frame an assessment of the Peerless in context (popular culture, advertising, wealth, early automobility, technology, Cleveland?) so that it may have a broader appeal. I also wonder if there are alternative publishing avenues that may be more receptive? Perhaps the Society of Automobile Historians could assist? Anyway, I am sure I am preaching to the choir, and I am also sure you all have been down these roads before, so feel free to slap the wrist of a newbie. Kevin

Sorry, keep forgetting I do have some more pieces to the puzzle. My great grandfather, who is in the drivers seat, drove for the FJ Logan and Family of Brooklyn, I assume the man in the passenger seat is FJ. In a New York Times Article dated July, 31, 1910 in the society pages it says FJ Logan arrived at the Equinox House in VT in a Peerless 40....funny how back then they announced the type of car! Thanks again for your indulgence. Kevin

Think I figured out how to add an image:

Hi all, I'm new to this group, and have recently become interested in Peerless as I am doing research on my great-grandfather who was a chauffeur and in two photographs looks like he is driving a 1909 Peerless. I am having trouble finding much information on Peerless, and have checked out http://www.peerlessmotorcar.com/history.htm and am trying to hunt down the Auto Quarterly article. So I am happy to stumble across this groups which has so many interested people. I was wondering two things: 1) Is there a way I could post my image to this groups so I could verify my great-grandfather drove a Peerless 2) Does anyone know if an archive of primary source Peerless material exist in any library/museum/archive, etc. Wat happened to all their business records. correspondence, etc? I am an exhibition developer with a history background and would love to work on something about Peerless (I read with great interest the other post about the fact that there is no Peerless dedicated books), and have begun seeing if there are Grants for writing such a book, or some other project. Any info would be great, thanks, Kevin