Natureboy

Ronnie, I'll pull each wire while someones got it in drive tomorrow and check each plug to see if any changes occur with plug wires off one at a time.

Ok, I got the car warmed up and put it in total darkness and had someone put it in drive and push the accelerator. I was looking for any arching and noticed at the base of the front three plugs what could possibly be arching but it wasn't jumping around, just a slight white glow. I couldn't get a look at the back three plugs. Wondering if that's normal? The car was missing out the whole time. I'm not quite sure but it looked like the #5 plug could of possibly been arching. If my eyes weren't deceiving me it wasn't constant, just every now and then I think. You could see just a small white color where the plug wires attaches to the plugs. ?????????

Padgett, I still have the magnavox. I'll regap them to .045. Any little bit to make this engine run smoother is appreciated. To bad your not a little closer to where I live. I could bring this turd over for you to examine.

I had the O2 sensor disconnected when I got the 013 code. I had the onboard diagnostics on while driving and the O2 sensor indications were up and down but stayed within the limits per the FSM (This is with the O2 sensor reconnected). I replaced the plug wires with 8mm delco wires and gapped the plugs at 0.60. Bobby, I'll give that a shot, Hell it might actually show some arching.

Sounds good, I'll have the wife push on the gas while I check fire. That will have to be later on in the week. Wifes out of town at the moment. I'll get back with you after it's done and let you know the results.

Yes the car was still hot when I checked the spark. Now it seems to be missing pretty much when I start driving it. Used to be when I drove it about 20 minutes. Now it's right when I pull out of the driveway. I got the orginal plug wires. I'll double check the metal plug shields on the back plugs. I'm baffled. Maybe it's something internal that's failing.

Ronnie I was also reading in chapter 6E3-B-5, page 60 under cut out, misses, that a misfire could be caused by a misaligned crank sensor or a bent vane on the interrupter. Like I said, I don't think the tech did a very good job of checking for clearences. He said he replaced the replacement sensor after he heard the vanes hitting it. I wonder if the tech actually did or was just telling me he did. He also ordered two balancers from two different manufactures and said they were bent more then the orginal one, So he reinstalled the orginal balancer. One was a dorman and can't remember what brand the 2nd one was. I found a GM balancer at a local buick dealer but they want 265 bucks for it. I was tempted to buy it but am spending to much money on this car. wondering if I should buy it and also another crank sensor?

I just checked the fire on each plug and all of them are firing. The plug wires are new and they are delco wires. Yes the crank sensor has been replaced but I am very suspious about the harmonic balancer. I'll explain. Last week when it was in the shop I asked the tech to check the crank sensor. He went ahead and replaced it and used the special tool to check clearences but he didn't put the tool on the balancer to check for bent blades. When he cranked the engine, you could hear the blades of the balancer hitting the sensor. The tech took the balancer back off and then check the blades with the tool for bent blades. when he spun the tool on the balancer you could here it hitting several blades. He tried to straighten the blades out best he could. When he rechecked the clearence on the balancer, You could hear the tool barely nicking one of the blades. I didn't think that was right but he thought it would be no problem, Reinstalled the balancer and it was still missing. I noticed on the orginal crank sensor a groove where some of the bent blades had been hitting the sensor. I really don't think he did a very good job of installing the crank sensor or straighting out the blades.

Not sure about anything anymore. I could go out to the garage and pull the plug wires and check again. So is 026 a normal code with the EGR disconnected? I did have the car in scan mode while I was driving it.

Ok Ronnie, I disconnected the EGR and it's still missing. The only code I got was 026. Seems to be missing during accelleration and when it goes into over drive it really starts bucking and kicking badly.

Ok will do, And I'll double check the codes again and get back to you.

Ok Ronnie, I disconnected the O2 sensor and was still having the same problem. I got a 013 code for the O2 sensor. Next step?

The O2 sensor disconnected? As soon as I get it put back together, It will be done. It's just when I saw the O2 sensor wire exposed, I thought it could possibly be the culprit. I just got the car back out of the shop yesterday.

Not sure of anything on this car. I got it in the garage and going to take my time and try and check out as much as I can. I was thinking maybe because of the open wire on the O2 sensor, it was giving the ECM all kinds of crazy readings? From what I could tell though, The wire was not touching anything. It was up in the wire bundle.

Yea I threw a couple bottles of injector cleaner in it. Padgett what do you think of the O2 sensor line open showing bare wire in two spots? Could that cause it to run lean and miss? The wiring on this care is in pretty sad shape. found quite a few wires with missing insulation, exposing bare wires.

Ronnie, Might of found something. Was looking at the wiring from the ignition module up to the ECM, I found the O2 sensor had two places where the insulation was cracked and missing, exposing bare wire. Wonder if that is the problem, Bare wire showing in the hot engine compartment and when it got hot, it started messing up?

Ronnie, The BLM is 140 when warmed up and goes up to 150 when coming to a stop. I just got a ECM with prom chip from Jim Finn and put it in last week. I will give the O2 test a try and get back with you.

Ronnie, It's so inconsistant but: 1. It misses at idle after it warms up sometimes. Idles fine when cold. 2. Yes it seems worse during acceleration after warming up. Accelerates fine when cold. 3. No it doesn't feel like it is completely shutting down when miss is occuring. 4. Possibly but not sure if it's a cylinder never running. 5. The engine never dies when depressing the accelerator. 6. Sometimes the car seem to jerk and jump when at cruise and the car shifts into overdrive. 7. The engine has never backfired. 8. No it doesn't surge at cruise doing 50 mph.

I'll do that Ronnie, but what do you think about the post I just made concerning the crankshaft sensor and balancer blades. The car is a 1990 Reatta.

Sorry it's taken me so long to respond to posts. Ronnie the compression readings were all around 145. I have the car in the shop and ask a mechanic to check the crankshaft sensor and replace if necessary. He went ahead and replaced it, but while replacing the sensor didn't check for bent blades on the harmonic balancer. He reinstalled the balancer and you could hear the blades contacting the new sensor when the car was started. He took the balancer back off and using the special tool, found a couple blades bent and making contact with the sensor. I took a quick glance at the new sensor while the balancer was off and could'nt tell if it had been damaged. It didn't look like any damage was done. We looked at the old sensor and it had been damaged and had a grove in it from the bent balancer blades. He straighten the blades out and put the special tool back on the balancer and you could hear a slight contact of the tool rubbing on one of the blades. He seemed to think this was not a problem and reinstalled the balancer. Started the car and couldn't hear any contact between blades and sensor. Test drove the car and same problem. Could this of been the problem and still is and should the balancer and sensor be replaced?

It's a magnavox and it's a known good one off my 89 reatta . No help. Seems to be something else other then a ignition module. Compression check turned out ok. Thanks Dave.

Can anyone tell me where the ECM ground wire is located at the ignition module bracket? I looked all over the ignition module bracket area and could not find a ground wire. Only a cable coming from the negative post of the battery to the bracket. Is that the ECM ground? Noticed a notation on the bottom of several pages in the manual that says, "A poor ECM ground at the iginition module mounting bracket to engine could cause fuel integ and block lean to read around 150; Make a careful physical inspection of this critical connection"

Warmed car up and took ED readings, Everything was in normal range except ED20 BLM Fuel Block learn multipier was reading 144 and would hop to 150 every now and then. ED19 INT Fuel (Fuel Integrator) was hovering around 128 +- 3. Any suggestions?

Well think I found the problem. After replacing alot of parts, I reinstalled the orginal igniton module and it smoothed out the car and it drives just fine but then starts to have a slight miss after warming up. The problem is I think the orginal module is heating up and causing the miss. Replaced the ignition module twice but replaced it with two cheap O'reilly house brand modules. Both of them turned out to be bad. Word of advise, don't skimp on electrical parts, Buy OEM electrical parts if possible even if you have to spend more money. It sure saves alot of grief.

Will do Ronnie, I'm also gonna change out the solenoid on the purge cannister. Keep the ideas and suggestions coming, I appreciate any help.