alternate v8 oil filter setup

[Guest imported_PackardV8]

The oil dip stick tube is THREADED in to the pan. It is 3/8 ID. It is within 8 inches of the worthless vacuum pump port in the side of the block.

Using an EXTERNAL pump (maybe an elec fuel pump) and a 3/8 pipe "y" (street "y" ???) an external oil filter and pump can be rather easily plumbed between the dip stick pan flange and vac pump block port.

[WCraigH]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">(snip) an external oil filter and pump can be rather easily plumbed between the dip stick pan flange and vac pump block port. </div></div>

When you're all done with this setup, you still have a by-pass type oil filter. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> The only "advantage" I see to this is that you don't have the "controlled leak" of the OEM end-of-line bypass filter.

[Guest imported_PackardV8]

To All. The idea is to FILTER THE OIL! The method i describe IN NO WAY compromises, changes, effects not interacts with the original lubrication system. It does NOT by-pass ANYTHING. It is not a controled leak but rather an independent and short run oil circuit with NO PRESSURE.

Look at the dip stick tube flange on the oil pan. If a "Y" fitting is screwed into it then the "Y" fitting will dump directly and imediatly into a large volumn namely the oil pan. The dip stick tube can then be screwed into the "Y" fitting and the dip stick installed as usual. Since it dumps directly to a large volumn there should be no feed back up the tube. If an elec pump is used it could quite possibly out pace the flow of the engine pump thereby filtering more oil faster than the engine pump could ever accomplish. If so inclined a battery charger could be connected to the battery and let the filter pump run 24-7. WHO SAYS and why does the oil have to pass thru part of the original oiling sytem to be filtered????

[WCraigH]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">(snip) WHO SAYS and why does the oil have to pass thru part of the original oiling sytem to be filtered???? </div></div>

Uh Keith, would you put dirty, unfiltered oil into all the delicate bearings and other moving parts of your engine?

With a bypass system, that's what happens. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

[Tom M]

Setup like attachment?

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Don't understand the need for second filter? Is it that the full flow filter may not be filtering properly? Second filter looks like another controled Leak, to me, which will Reduce pressure and volume, where needed?

[WCraigH]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Don't understand the need for second filter? Is it that the full flow filter may not be filtering properly? Second filter looks like another controled Leak, to me, which will reduce pressure and volume? </div></div>

100% agree. Where'd this diagram come from???

[55PackardGuy]

Packin31

That looks like an Amsoil diagram for their proprietary auxiliary oil filter system. It seems to be a partial-flow filter that provides extra filtering in addition to an existing full-flow system. By itself, it it doesn't look like it would improve on the pressure drop (and maybe aeration) that has been identified as a possible problem with the Packard partial flow filter.

However, the plumbing looks kind of ingenious to me. Would it be possible to adapt this system as a stand-alone full-flow filter?

[Tom M]

Was reading this thread with interest and remember that

I found a picture 2 years ago when I was trying to understand Full Flow versus By-Pass filtration.

I guess my '31 would be a by-pass filter setup. Mine is setup similar to the attach picture.

[Guest imported_PackardV8]

TO all:

It is true that the auxillary filter circuit does NOT filter the oil prior to entering the engine oil galleries. BUT SUPPOSE the auxillary pump can flow 3 to 8 times the volumn that the engine pump flows. THAT MEANS that the oil is getting filtered 3 to 8 times MORE OFTEN than the engine pump can pump the oil.

OR to put it another way, As the engine pump pumps 1 gallon of oil then it is pumping oil that has already been filtered at least 3 times.

[Guest imported_PackardV8]

Furthermore: The Packard V8 float sets directly to the left of the dip stick. In fact, the float sets so close to the dip stick that they can hit each other. If the oil is returned directly at the float then it must be mighty clean oil picked up by the float.

[55PackardGuy]

Went to wrench on the '47 Dodge yesterday and looked at the oil filter system. It has the "bypass" setup and there's not much to photograph with the filter in place. The Shop Manual had almost nothing on the oil filter, and only covered the bypass system. (The "full flow" system was available as a factory or dealer installed option.) There was NO diagram.

At the P15-D24 site, there was info only on the bypass system. It was pretty thorough, though, and this portion about the operation of the system might be of some interest:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When the oil pressure relief valve is closed the oil pump fills the oil passages and oil filter. The relief valve blocks oil flow FROM the filter to the crankcase. When the oil pressure is greater than relief valve spring tension, the valve starts to open. Excess (clean) oil then returns to crankcase. The relief valve opens a passage for the oil to flow from the filter to crankcase.</div></div>

If this is similar to how the Packard system works, it would appear to be VERY IMPORTANT that the pressure relief system is working properly, as it is the "control" part of the "controlled leak." It would appear to be especially prone to creating low oil pressure if it sticks open or opens at too low of a pressure. If it sticks shut or doesn't open at a low enough pressure, little or no oil gets filtered.

I will keep looking for a diagram of the full flow conversion.

On a more successful note, the Dodge runs! <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

[WCraigH]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">At the P15-D24 site, there was info only on the bypass system. It was pretty thorough, though, and this portion about the operation of the system might be of some interest (snip)</div></div>

What was described is a bypass system that [color:"red"] ONLY filters oil whenever the oil pressure exceeds the regulator spring pressure. Who knows how much is actually filtered, anymore than who knows how much oil is at the end of the Packard V-8 bypass filter. IMO, neither system has much to commend it.

P.S. Glad your '47 Dodge is running! With or without much filtered oil.

[55PackardGuy]

Craig,

Thanks! The car sounds terrible now, but improvements are on the way. At least on the Dodge it's pretty easy to retrofit for full flow oil filtering! <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> That's why I'm continuing to look into the Dodge setup for this thread--not to recommend anything good about the bypass system, but maybe it'll give us a clue on how to retrofit for full flow on the Packard V8 without a major tear-down. That's not too likely, but maybe worth a look. (BTW, according to the gauge, the oil pressure is good on the Dodge. But who knows if the relief valve is opening?)

It also seems to me that, given that the bypass system is already on the Packard, it would be a good idea to know something about how to maintain the relief valve and inlet/outlet passages to original specs. Especially if the pump is upgraded WITHOUT changing the filter set-up--at least for initial testing. That gives the correct baseline of a properly functioning bypass system with a different pump.

This should yield more trouble-shooting "scattergram" information. The more variables that are controlled for the better for gathering useful statistical data. I think when dealing with such a complex set of variables, statistical analysis will be the way to determine what the outcome data indicate are the most likely solution(s). Just please don't ask me to get out my dusty old books. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />