Perpoff

I need information on the engineering of the 1926 all steel Hudson sedans. What did the structural framework of the body look like? Was it a steel framework with attached panels or were the panels themselves part of the stress bearing structure? How big were the pressed panels? Is there any information available on difficulties in the assembly of the all steel bodies? What wood parts were still used in the all steel bodies? The 1923 Hudson sedans were advertised as “all steel on wooden frame”, which indicates a somewhat loose use of the term “all steel”. Does this also indicate that the 1926 Hudson sedans were less all steel than advertised? My questions apply to both bodies from suppliers and bodies produced in house by Hudson. When did all Hudson models have all steel bodies? I am also grateful for all tips about literature and newspaper articles from the time that describe the body engineering of mass produced bodies from 1920 to 1940.

What is the thickness of the metal in the frame? Can you describe how the body is attached to the frame? As I understand it the frame doubles as the threshold of the body and that the body is set into the frame rather than on top of it. Is that correct? I am trying to write an article on the Dodge 1928, digging deeper into the engineering of the body and chassis than in the article I got published in Hemmings. It would be great if I could use your excellent pictures of the frame, especially the one with the frame painted in base coat. It makes the design very clear.

As far as I know the first all steel body was the 1912 Hupmobile. The bodies were engineered and built by Edward G Budd, Joseph Ledwinka and their team at Hale & Kilburn in Philadelphia. The Hupp manager Emil Nelson came to Hale & Kilburn in 1909 because no shop in Detroit would take on the job. When Hupp got new management they went back to composite bodies for the 1913 models. According to Coachbuilt the first major contract Budd got for his all steel bodies was an order for 2000 bodies for Oakland. I don’t know that led to follow up orders from Oakland. John Willys ordered 2500 bodies for Garfield, which was building trucks. Willys thought a passenger car would be good addition. It wasn’t. Garfield went bankrupt and I don’t know how many, if any, actually were sold. The Dodge Brothers were the only ones that went all in (almost) for all steel bodies. The development of welding and paints are of course important, but the focus of this article was on the new thinking and engineering that went into the Dodge Victory Six. It is possible that Wolseley in England were using this technology before Dodge did, but only about 500 Wolseleys if this type were built over a period of six years, which was far from the numbers necessary to make all steel sedans profitable. The Wolseley bodies were made by the English subsidiary of Budd’s, Pressed Steel. A fun fact is that a modified version of the Wolseley body was used for the Ruxton.

I just had an article on the importance of the Victory Six published by Hemmings. https://www.hemmings.com/stories/2020/12/31/it-may-not-look-like-much-but-the-1928-dodge-victory-six-could-be-the-most-important-car-in-the-history-of-coachbuilding I hope you enjoy the read. Comments and corrections are most welcome. I am working on an expanded version of the article. Any information or pictures you have would be much appreciated. I am particularly interested in pictures if cars under restoration, and even more particularly in pictures of the bare frame, the design of the thresholds and the way the body is joined with the chassis.

For some reason I can only see the pictures in the alert mail and not in the forum. Even though the car is not original any more, the pictures show a critical detail - the rounded corners of the door frames. This design was patented by Joseph Ledwinka, chief engineer at Budd, and is a sign that the whole side of the body is pressed in one piece, an advancement that changed the course of automotive history.

Thank you! A trip to Hershey is in the plans!

I am writing an article on the body engineering on the 1928Dodge Victory Six, and I need pictures showing the body structure (no interior). I am particularly interested in pictures that show the door frames. I would also be grateful for any lead to the whereabouts of the prints made for the book published by the Dodge Club with pictures from the Budd photo archives,