What is it with these cars

[Coop]

I just don't get it. Yes Reatta's are great driving cars. But they are not so great to work on, especially when you have so many problems. We've only had our '90 Reatta for a little over a year and put about 8000 miles on since we've owned it. The car overall only has about 65000 miles on it. I have never in my life seen a car with this many problems not even cars twice as old with 3x the miles. Here's a partial list of problems, I'm sure there are more I just can't possibly remember them all:<P>Brakes: Had to replace the entire system because the dealer couldn't fix it the 3 times we had it there.<P>Power steering fluid cooler - leaked bad<P>Headlights would not come up and stay up<P>Starter died<P>Turn signals don't work<P>Rear defogger doesn't work - but when it's switched on the radio doesn't work<P>AC doesn't work<P>Neither of the chimes work<P>Headliner fell out<P>Leaks alot of water (hardtop even!!!)<P>All 4 struts are shot<P>Cruise control has never worked<P>I guess I'm just venting, sorry, but I'm tired of spending my weekends working on it instead of driving it. My good ole Chevy Celebrity with over 100,000 miles will just have to keep being as reliable as it has always been for the last 5 years I've owned it. It's good for going to the auto parts store for the Reatta.

[s.zaban]

Now you know why they were made only 4 years.

[ol' yeller]

Most older Jaguar owners would be happy to only have the problems you have listed. My '90 Reatta has under 90K and I have replaced all the struts (wear item could happen to any car, replaced all the brakes and calipers, no ABS problems (again wear item), Relaced a side mirror, (previous owner driving ability problem) and a power window motor on the passenger side. It still has a nagging turn signal problem, sometimes the indicators blink, soemtimes they don't but the lights outside always work, and one cornering lamp doesn't light which is probably due to a burned out bulb. I view all this as minor problems that could happen on any highly optioned car with 90k and 12 years on the clock. With all car makes and models, there are good ones and bad ones. I don't think that the problems of the Reatta are any better or worse than similar cars of the same vintage. Maybe I'll have a different opinion in April when I haul it out of storage and experience a new rash of problems.<P>Greg

[tcams76]

I like my '89, but I must add a few logs to the fire.<BR>I was singing your tune last week when it rained two or three days in a row. This is the first car I have owned that leaked like a rusty bucket. A hardtop with this many leaks. Both driver and passenger windows leaking, then the sunroof started...the only thing I could think was how embarrassing. Lucky I didn't have a date planned during this time.<BR>I thought hardtops stopped leaking from the windows in the sixties. <BR>Well the sunshine has returned.

[Arrallen]

In defense of the car. It is twelve years old and a heck of a lot of twelve year old cars are in the junk yard. Things are going to wear out whether it's a Reatta or a BMW and the parts for the beamer are a lot higher priced. After owning a 1965 Rustang sag-in-the-middle convt and a 1965 what-ever-you-do-don't-turn-on-the-heater Corvair my '90 coupe is heaven sent even with the chime that don't work and the brake light warning that keeps on unless I physically pull up on the pedal. Yes, I replaced the brake pads, tires, and struts and had to twice take it in for ac repair, but that turned out a lot cheaper then the three transmission repairs to my 96 Chrysler. If you want reliability buy a new Honda, if you want pazazz be ready to pay the piper.

[Don B.]

Lucky you didn't have an Austin Marina.<BR>You would have gone postal.<BR>A brief list of problems:<BR>Engine rebuilt 3 times<BR>Firing order kept changing<BR>Fuse block wire connections loosen<BR>Transmission main gear stripped<BR>Leaf spring broke<BR>Connecting rod broke<BR>Timing gear broke at a stop lite<P>And just to give you an idea on parts costs<BR>a connectiong rod $75.00 in 1980 and it was<BR>cast iron.

[Guest]

All the problems you list are a pain.I would still rather have my Reatta than an import.

[Barney Eaton]

Coop.... you are the first post that has mentioned replacing the starter...at any mileage. Also the power steering cooler is a rare problem area. <P>Headlight motors are a know maintanence area.<P>Did the flasher fix the turn signal problem?<P>The rear window defogger and radio have no apparant relationship except being in the same car. Fuse #19 feeds the rear window relay....either could be bad. Fuse #19 also feeds the A/C pressure switch and the compressor clutch.<P>The common problem with cruise control is a vacumn leak. Does the cruise light come on on the dash. Look for cracked or disconnected vacumn lines.<p>[ 01-26-2002: Message edited by: Barney Eaton ]

[Guest EDBS0]

Coop at least the transmission is standing up well.<BR>Many items simple wear, tear and age. Robert

[Coop]

I understand what you are all saying in defense of the car, but the point is this: it is the newest vehicle I currently own. It also is the lowest mileage vehicle I currently own and it is the most problematic vehicle (by far) that I own. My '87 Celebrity is a cheap, ugly piece of crap that I put tons of miles on and have beat up for the last 6 years and all I've ever had to do to it is brake pads and oil changes, it just won't die. I have always been A GM fan, but am not limited to just that. But I can say this - This WILL be the last Reatta I ever own. The engine / drivetrain in these cars is great, I know the Buick 3.8L GenI or GenII is an incredibly bulletproof engine for the cost. The rest of the car is just too far ahead of its time, not enough R&D in my opinion.<P>But yes, the $3 flasher did fix the problem, I just got done putting the entire dash, console, IP cluster, etc. back into the car. I still don't know why it needs to be so hard to get to. I've worked on alot of cars, and the only one I've worked on that beats this one as far as being a pain in the behind was an '84 RX-7, which I just sold for $300 and good riddance to it.<P>I'm not usually bitter about cars, but it's just that I wasted my entire day doing something that should've taken 5 minutes.<P>The power steering cooler actually wasn't as big a deal as I thought it would be, it was about $30 and a ten minute fix. And as far as the cruise goes, I could care less if it never works, we've already decided that this isn't the car for long trips.

[Guest]

I understand. . . You'd figure for the amount of money that one person at one time in their life put out just to buy one of these cars, that GM could have done a better job. I guess it all comes down to whoever had the car last or before you and what little problems it had then. The engine is indistructable, the tranny is ok. (age, and my heavy foot has taken its toll). When I bought mine the A/C was toast, and the window on the passenger side is stripped. At one time I figure the car was taken apart before I got it. Everything else works flawlessly, lucky me. I have an 89 with just over 182000km. I do admit that the windows do leak (bad seal I figure). Its the cost of owning such a pretty car. Nothing else can compare to it in the looks category. Other than being incredibly fast (the 1990 ACURA Legend LS would embarass it), it is the total package as far as having everything thats cool in a car. Even if there was such a combination out there today, it would be as affordable. More about the engine. . . it ran for a couple oil changes with a bad thermostat in the summer and a bad coil pak, and it still worked and still works today.

[Guest EDBS0]

Well Coop if you want bitter about a car, how about a 1964 Volvo P1800. My college car. Well the brake lights went out. So simple fix? The switch is an hydraulic switch, costs $5.00 at the time but the whole job ended up costing $500. Why. Should have been simple. Remove and install switch. Well switch sheared off as did more parts than I care to think about. Including Power brake booster I think certainly the master cylinder. Back in the early to mid 70s that was a great deal of money, a very great deal of money. Sold right after that. Still makes me burn when I think about it Robert

[Coop]

Well, I must say this is the lowest mileage used vehicle I've ever owned or worked on with this many problems in this short a period of time. I realize some of the problems are wear items, but I just spent the last 5 hours just getting to the turn signal flasher which is a $3 item and should just plug right into a fuse center somewhere. <P>I've also got an older GTA Trans Am with twice the miles and T-tops and it doesn't leak nearly as bad as this thing.<P>I will admit, when the car is running it is a very fun motoring car, and it is fun to drive. I'm just debating whether it's worth it.

[Rawja]

Regarding the leaks some are experiencing around the side windows:<BR> <A HREF="http://www.aaca.org/ubb/Forum3/HTML/000783.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.aaca.org/ubb/Forum3/HTML/000783.html</A>

[Guest]

Coop,<P>I've owned three, and while they've each had their share of "maintenance issues", I haven't found them to be any worse than other cars I've owned.<P>Maybe you simply bought yourself a bum steer!

[Guest]

Coop, I'll give you $5.00 for it and I'll come and get it! lol

[Guest]

Mine worked fine this morning, always does.

[Guest]

When I look at my experiences so far with my 89, I think I could very well feel the way you do if not for this web site. <BR>This site and the Reatta.net site have allowed me to fairly quickly and cheaply address the most common problems. If I would have taken my car to the local Buick dealer to fix all the problem I had, I'd be broke and pissed.<BR>My advice is to search this database and Reatta.net when you have a problem. I think the car has a split personality. Many parts of the car are simply outstanding and bullet-proof, while it has many well identified "bugs". Many of the contributers have found better and cheaper ways to fix these bugs that the dealer. All in all, I still love my little quirky car.

[Guest wally888]

I am not an avid fan of Reattas however I have owned 4 and currently own 2. I must be some kind of a fan.<BR> I have had no problems w/ my 91, bought last June, but anticipate some. Why? Because I have been too slow and lazy to flush the brake system, flush the cooling system, replace what seems to be a sticking thermostat, adjust a leaking passenger window....think you get the idea.<BR> Considering the car is 11 years old, I would consider the above and many other tasks routine maintenance. If I decide to sell it w/o doing/fixing the above, the next owner will probably have all kinds of problems.<BR> I bought an 89 from Dave B. that had $4000 of receipts w/ it. Only had 1 problem in the next 2 years, a Cruise Control (was broke when I got it).<BR> I think one of these things will last forever if they are given tender loving care.

[ronvb]

Coop,<BR>I agree with alot of what is said here,but unique automobiles tend to also have unique problems as things wear.<BR>What a great name for a forum though,we could call it:<BR>WHAT IS IT WITH THESE REATTAS?<BR>ronvb

[Guest]

I'm the second owner of a 1990 Reatta hardtop which now has 87K and some change. Bought the car at 35k; most major problem was the brakes, violent grab to the right on occasion. Fixed that and it's been a great car.

[Howard]

Some cars are well, lemons. Perhaps that is the problem with your car. I worked for over 20 years in automobile dealerships and have noticed that you can have two cars that are just alike. One you may never see in the service department and the owner treats it like crap, another is parked in the garage every night, waxed every month and it is always in the shop. Owning a Reatta is very much like dating a Hollywood sex symbol, she is a big pain, but you want everyone to see who you are with. Frankly I would never want to be seen in anything as mundane as for mere Chevrolet sedan. Make mine a Corvette, red please. Howard

[bigrog]

Sorry to hear of such a bad experience with this car. This is not normal for that kind of mileage. You must have bought it off of e-bay.

[ol' yeller]

Bigrog, What do you have against Ebay? I bought my '90 on Ebay and am very happy with it. Of course, I had it inspected before I bid on it. Buying on Ebay is no more no less risky than buying from Hemmings or the local used car lot. You just have to protect yourself. First have the car inspected by someone you trust, not someone the buyer recommends. Second, get pictures from all angles and interior shots. Third, don't put down a deposit you can't afford to lose. I only put down a $500 deposit, the rest due when I picked up the car. Forth, pay for the airline ticket and go get the car yourself. If you have it shipped, nothing beats your personal inspection before it is loaded onto the transport. Factor in the cost of transport and the airline ticket into the cost of the car. If it isn't a good deal don't buy it. Don't be afraid to walk away if it doesn't feel right. I really wanted one of these great little cars but they just weren't available up here in the great Northwet (SIC). Ebay, Hemmings, the BCA, and other old car publications were my only resources to find what I was looking for. That gave me the whole country as the market rather than my own little corner of the world. I'm sure you can point out many postings where people feel they got taken advantage of on Ebay but when you buy a used car, it is always "Let the Buyer Beware". If you take simple precautions you can cut down the possibility of making a bad choice.

[Guest]

Wanna know the secret to a trouble free Reatta? Take care of the problems as they arise, don't let them pile up. I think the reason why my car is in such good shape (and it really is in excellent shape for an 11 year old car with 182,000 miles) is that when something goes wrong I fix it immediately. I also stick to the GM recommended maintenance schedule religiously.<P>Everything works on my car and it drives like a dream. I realize one day it will finally wear out, but I feel like it has many more trouble free miles left.

[Guest]

i have an 89 and although i agree they are quirky, the basic powertrain is bullet proof.

[padgett]

Bought mine because wanted a bigger Fiero & the Reatta suits me. At the same time it is more of a pet than a car and I make my living with computers so the electronics do not bother me (at least won't after I amass a spare everything).<P>At the same time, the car was only produced for four years and has some quirks that would drive any general mechanic batty.<P>The drivetrain is one of the most reliable GM has ever made with the caveat that the electronics takes someone who really understands it. However, with the exception of the seats & dash which are straight out of the Riviera, just about all of the coach work & interior is unique. (e.g. $$$$). Just be glad that the plastic does not seem to crumble like the GM interiors of the 70's.<P>Water leaks have a simple answer - RTV. Might say that mine only has a minor one above the driver's window but then I do not leave mine out a lot.<P>Some things you are going to have to repair using "alternative methods" (have repaired the vaccuum booster on an E-Jag with an inner tube and two hose clamps when the bellows developed a leak. Would consider replacing a hydraulic brake switch with a conventional one to cite an incident above).<P>Am often astounded by the prices charged for what should be a simple job, suspect that there is one doubling for "we don't really know how to do this" and another for "if we do it rong, it will come back for free" so a $150 job can become $600 quickly that way. Often a shop will quote a high price because they really do not want to do the work.<P>So keep in mind that while the tail may say "Buick", to anyone trying to work on it, the sign might as well say "Ferrari" or "Aston Martin" because it is an exotic.<P>At the same time, you seem to have had an exceptional number of problems that do not usually occur. Some are inevitable (you do not mention the water pump - perhaps it was already replaced when you bought it but is a very common replacement) but many mentioned in your long list are not.<P>Is it possible that yours is just one of those cars that has problems ? So far most of my work has been cosmetic or "playing". At 10 years/65k miles, plugs, plug wires, O2 sensors, brake pads, serpentine belt, & coolant hoses will be probably needing replacement. (Part of the reason I run a 180 degree thermostat is to lower the underhood temp - high temperatures accellerate rubber deterioration).<P>I would not expect power steering leaks (maybe a hose) or stuts to be needed unless the car was stored for a long period of time which may permit drying out of seals or exposed to corrosive materials e.g. road salt.<P>On thing we are seeing is that exceptionally low milage cars seem to have more than their share of problems, probably from lack of use & condensation that is never boiled off. This is not unique to the Reatta.<P>Another factor is that it is one of the first real computer cars - through the 70's, power door locks were directly activated and switches were designed for 20 amp loads. The Reatta OTOH has myriad relays and very small currents - easily disrupted (relays are one of the most common failure points mentioned here).<P>In counterpoint, little fails on my '70 Judge simply because it is really a very crude automobile - pushing on the brake operates a switch directly connected with heavy wires to the stop lamps, it doesn't go through switchblocks, computers, and relays to do so, each with its own MTBF (mean time before failure).<P>For example the entire schematic for my Judge is on one fold-out page including the dash differences with and without gauges. My 88 FSM (section 8A) contains three hundred multipage <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">sections</span></span> - almost an inch thick - of electrical circuits.<P>Add this to the fact that all of this is crammed into about 1/3 less space than on the Riviera that was the original design platform and maintenance becomes "interesting".<P>Is it worth it ? For me it is but then I have the facilities to both replace the engine and reprogram a computer at home if necessary. Can see that if you had to pay someone to keep it running right, the cost would be astronomical & is reflected in the depressed market (can buy a nice Reatta for $3k today if the e-bay completed sales are any indication).<P>For someone else, well, you may get lucky.<p>[ 02-03-2002: Message edited by: padgett ]

[Guest]

...i thought my '88 had a bad leak....but it was fixed with a door adjustment...had nothing to do with the weather stripping...i think something began to shift in the frame. Since then i've replaced the six frame bushings and the car is solid like new. I also replaced the sway bar bushings with Heavy Duty Perfect Circle available at Pep Boys. This vehical has 150077 miles and everything but the rear defroster works flawlessly (knock on wood) and the interior is like new....?. Got some nose paint chips that got to get fixed.

[padgett]

Nose chips seem very common for some reason. I touched up lightly and then applied a LeBra.<P>Downside is that the marginal air flow is reduced further and even with the license plate flap opened it still runs a little warmer than I like on a hot day - expect the reprogrammed (lowered) fan turn on settings may cure that.

[Guest C.F.Massie]

Hey padgett, my 89 coupe has never run hotter than 160 F no matter how I drive it, on the highway or in town traffic. That goes for summer and winter, though winter driving in Texas isn't that cold. Restricted air flow? If these cars have that problem I've never encountered it and I've had my 89 since new and now it has 149,500 miles on her. I too have a LeBra front bra and use it when on the highway, still 160 F. I know it should run at about 195 consistantly but it never has and I and my dealer can't figure it out. Anyone have any answers?

[padgett]

a) if really 160, don't mess with it !<P> would suspect the temperature sensor.

[Guest]

Our 89 had the problem that the temp. wouldn't get high enough for good heater operation. I found that the rubber gasket that seals the thermostat to housing had flopped up on one side and wasn't sealing. I put a new thermostat in and the replacement gasket was an o-ring. It now controls at 195 degrees.<BR>I think part of the problem is that the thermostat housing has only one bolt holding it and it is difficult to get the housing to tighten down evenly. It was the unbolted side of my seal that had blown out.

[Guest cdoersom]

Mine was running cold, getting poor gas mileage, and I found it had "no" thermostat. Ran ok in summer, but in winter (even in Texas) it would never go into lockup or provide much heat.