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A helpful hint for all you chassis judges.


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Do you by chance have a spare computer mouse pad lying around? If so they make a great kneeling pad for you while you check out that chassis. The neoprene ones are the best. They are flexible enough to roll up and fit into a back pocket when not in use, they keep your knee (remember you're only supposed to use one knee to look professional <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />) dry when it has rained and cool when the sun is out. One guy I judged with had a blistered knee after judging in shorts on a newly blacktopped lot in Greenville in the summer.

Lots of judges in the past have used their clipboard as a surface to kneel on. The down side to that is that the score sheet clipped to it is now exposed for a sharp-eyed owner or friend of the owner to read if you forget to turn it over.

So, with show season upon us, does anyone else have any helpful judging hints to share?

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I use a clipboard like they use in hospitals and nursing homes. They work nice for shows because you put your worksheet in it, then close it. Nobody can see the sheet. You can use it to kneel on. Stand back up, step away from the car, open it and fill it out. If it is nice out open it landscape style, and it helps to block your writing. If raining, open it portiat style and you have a "roof" over your nice, dry sheet.

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If I decide to use one, I can just take my citation book out of the one that I bought in 1980.

You should find it at most any office supply place. I did a quick search at the Office Max website for "forms holder" and found it there.

Saunders Redi-Rite Form Holder

Aluminum Form Holder

Item # 04014747, Style # SAU11017

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("remember you're only supposed to use one knee to look professional") <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> [color:"blue"] In the AACA, you are permitted one or two knees. Unless you are "proposing" to the automobile owner <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />, I'm not certain either looks more "professional".

John <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

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  • 2 weeks later...

How about a pit like what the older garages use to have. The chassis judge gets down in the pit and a car drives through real slow. The only bad thing about the concept is for the tall guy having to duck as the car goes over, and for the short guy who might have trouble getting out of the hole after the class has been judged.... <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

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And I think we shouldnt have to judge chassis in class 25 (sports cars). They are too close to the ground. Tried that once and ended up with sore knees and a stiff neck.

Terry

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Terry, I got stuck judging sports cars one year. Did have the best conditions to do that in. It was i believe Carilse several years ago, at any rate, the show field was in the grass and the grass was touching the chassis!! What I could see through the tire tracks looked good.

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<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Remember that it is NOT ACCEPTABLE to pick up one end of a Red Bug to look at the chassis</div></div>

That's why my mother in-law was banned from judging. She was doing the same thing with the Buicks <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

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<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Susan,

<img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />Remember that it is NOT ACCEPTABLE to pick up one end of a Red Bug to look at the chassis. </div></div>

Is it okay to have the engine judge help by lifting the other end and just flipping it over? <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

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<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's why my mother in-law was banned from judging. She was doing the same thing with the Buicks <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> </div></div>

Bet you're nice to your mother-in-law. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

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  • 6 months later...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ex98thdrill</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I use an aluminum clipboard that closes. The only time I open the clipboard is to mark on the sheet, and then close the clipboard back up. As in the case of David, it keeps the sheet out of view of the vehicle owners, and if it rains, my paperwork stays dry. $15 well spent. </div></div>

Am I understanding this thread right that the judges don't discuss the car with the owner? If not, what is the point of judging? A points sheet doesn't tell you anything but you lost points. They don't tell you what you lost points for.

I would only want my car judged to know what I need to fix to be more correct. If the judge won't talk to me, what is the point of being judged at all?

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57 Plymouth,

It is a little difficult to explain the total judging system in a few short sentences, but....

If you don't get the award that you are competing for, you can request information on what prevented you from receiving the award. You are then given a judging sheet with the areas of concern highlighted.

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I don't know anything about NCRS but I don't think I would describe the average AACA judge with the term "arrogant or snotty attitude". The system is designed to allow for the judging to be conducted in a professional manner. This does not allow for lengthy conversations or debates with the owners. The Judging Team Captain should greet the car owner and should ask the owner for documentation on any questionable item before the team would deduct significant points. Judging is not a class in restoration, or a time for debate. The system is designed to fairly evaluate cars and provide appropriate recognition for cars based on the condition of the car within the rules contained in the judging manual.

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<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MCHinson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

That is not my opinion, but it does not sound like I can explain it to you in a written format. Why don't you attend an AACA show as a spectator and see what you think of it? </div></div>

Better still, go to a Judging School and a CJE of your choice at a show nearby. Learn what we do from the inside out, and why it is done this way.

Judging teams are instructed that ten minutes per car, which amounts to a total of forty minutes with four team members, should be sufficent to properly judge a car. We honestly don't have time to go over with owners what they need to do to get better scores. Most owners know what is wrong, if anything with their cars. We hear them admit it all the time.

If you aren't sure about something with a car you don't have much knowledge of, check with the AACA Library and Research Center for information.

I was just in Hershey. I was a Team Captain. I was verifying what cars had arrived for our class when a man walked up and started asking me questions about how the cars are judged. It was VERY clear, very quickly, to me that he had an ax to grind. I don't know why, he didn't say. I answered his questions as politely as I could. I have no idea what might have happened to him at a show somewhere. Maybe not even one of our shows. But he wanted to take it out on me. Sorry, not happening. I excused myself to go check in a car that had just arrived.

It really is the best thing, if you don't get an award you were going after, to ask for a copy of the judging form with the areas where deductions were taken highlighted.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hey 57,

I have never had my car judged at an AACA event, but I got my senior award (393 out of 400 points) at a Buick National. The Buick judges are specifically told NOT to talk to the owner. The only judge who is allowed to talk to the owner is the chief judge, who will only ask you to open the doors or ask for documentation. Like I said, I don't know what the AACA rules are. The reason MY 55 scored so highly is that my mentor in the hobby ( a semi retired dude with two senior cars) helped me with my restoration. If you are serious about actually competing in national level shows, I would strongly suggest that you find somebody who has been through the process of restoring a car to a high level and making friends with him/ her. The judging sheets are helpful, but you need to have a knowledgable person go over them with you.

For example, in the Buick club, a major deduction is having your car painted with the fenders on. Body color paint on attachment bolts is a big no-no, cuz it didn't come from the factory that way. The fine details make the difference between a concours show car and a nice driver. (And it doesn't cost any more.) Make sure your car has the right hose clamps, hell, make sure you don't have a ribbed radiator or red heater hose (if yer car didn't come that way). Get your car judged once. Worry about the nitty gritty instead of orange peel paint jobs. I personally am much more inclined to "dismiss" a car with a non factory (Edelbrock) air cleaner than some wavy chrome or even unmatching panels gaps.

Stop being accusatory. These folks are here to help. If you want to be feisty, go on Geraldo, if you want to learn, ASK. (Forgive me people...PLEASE)

Old people wink.gif want to help YOU.

Have fun,

Mike

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<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: buick5563</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">These folks are here to help.</div></div>

We really are here to help. We volunteer to do this. We spend a lot of time and money to do this. Some of us show cars as well as judge which is no small task to do both.

...if you want to learn, ASK.</div></div>

Amen. All of us learned what we know from someone that will willing to take the time to teach us.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">(Forgive me people...PLEASE)</div></div>

Forgive you for what? Yours is a wonderful post.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Old people wink.gif want to help YOU.</div></div>

Yeah, while we still can. crazy.gif

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