Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Here we go again.This morning temp.27 made 4 attempts to start 89 reatta, and when it did start rough idle AGAIN <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />Friend that works at gm dealership, and he checked the fuel rail pressure with the ignition in the run position had 10psi.Then engine was started checked again 39psi.Shut engine off waited about 10 min. turned ignition to run position again showing 10psiSince i have already changed the fuel pressure regulator, and noticed very little gas when dis-connecting the line his suggestion regarding the low psi change the fuel pump in the gas tank.Any comments would be appreciated. Already replaced every thing else including ecm. Just money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonlabree Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Have you replaced the fuel filter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex_houston Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Shouldn't have to do it but turning the key to the run position, wait a few seconds, then turn off. A couple times and it should start with no hesitation. This builds up the leaking down fuel pressure before cranking away wasting battery and starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 fuel filter, plugs, plug wires, oxygen sensor, ecm, manifold gaskets,PVC valve, egr, and gaskets, thermostat, IAC valve, maf, cleaned tb replaced gaskets, injectors sent to cruzin performance for cleaning and leak down test. this is what has been replaced last 2 months.Yes the key was turned to run position several times before trying to start. would not start till i continued to crank and when it did start rough idle, and had to feather the gas pedal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mongeonman Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 water in gas tank??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mongeonman Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Pintched gas line??durty maybe?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonlabree Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 With the key on you should have 35 to 40 lbs of fuel pressure before starting.Check lines for dents and kinks near fuel tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 with the key in the run position I only had 10PSI not once but 2 times. That's telling me the pum is going bad? right or wrong??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadster90 Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 Make sure you have the appropriate gauge/adapters.....pressure should be approx 40 or above when keyed and then drop a few pounds when started .... (need to check the manual for exact specs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 This was a Buick dealership, and mechanic that checked the pressure. Free of charge. Only would read 10 PSI with the key in the run position.So here goes more money, and time removing the gas tank. Going to find this problem even if have to replace the hole engine.Also have a 94 impala ss with 58,000 miles but rather drive my reatta. So love for my reatta continues, with the idle problems. Thanks All. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 same thing this morning. Tried turning ign. to run position 6 times, and then tried to start engine would not start. After 7 attempts finally started.Can anyone advise me if they think could be the fuel pump? Only had 10psi with ignition turned to the run position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest crtnrds Posted February 2, 2007 Share Posted February 2, 2007 I had a similar problem with one of my Reattas. Turned out to be the cam magnet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex_houston Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 My 2 cents:The fuel pump is the only pressure into the injectors. It is my understanding very few cars can run under 25psi. I would think with 10psi your car would never run. If you don't have 35+, you should probably replace the pump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 Maybe not making myself clear. when I said only have 10psi is when the engine will not start. When it does start shows 39psi.Shut the engine down turn the ignition to run back to 10psi.After the car finally starts from then on thru out the day start fine. Let set over night have to crank, and crank before it starts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonlabree Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 Have you checked the lines for dents and kinks all the way to the tank???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadster90 Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 I have been in problematic situations as you before and understand your pain....just trying to help....as suggested before and not confirmed...replaced the ICM? New, not used? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 used Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadster90 Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 Blazer....I just read something possibly suspicious in a post of yours .........check your VIN....if you have a late 89 or a early 90 your condition may be pointing at a specific and unusal repair...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 Vin# 1G4EC11C2KB904205 89 buick reatta.Hope this good info you have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadster90 Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 First you need to ascertain what prom or mem cal you have...GO TO AND READ THE ENTIRE THREAD REFERENCED BELOW: nic walker Member >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> #408553 - 09/15/06 04:08 PM(GM Bulletin 90-6f-a , Feb '90 , ref 90 06 GE ,, Cold engine extended start) Provided by Padgett Peterson <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 01/1989 date on the door. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadster90 Posted February 3, 2007 Share Posted February 3, 2007 This may not apply to you from what I was told, BUT write Padgett and ask his opinion....may still be worth checking your prom and even replacing.....check with Jim Finn and see if he can set you up with a used prom/mem cal.***Sorry, I may have been a little vague...reson I wrote it may not apply is you have an early build 89 .... I think the the effected models were late 89 to early 90 (however it could be specific 89 models...I have looked for the bulletin again and can't find it...need the bulletin...Padgett) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 4, 2007 Share Posted February 4, 2007 Does anyone know how to contact Padgett? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonlabree Posted February 4, 2007 Share Posted February 4, 2007 Send him PM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 4, 2007 Share Posted February 4, 2007 Tomorrow morning call to vandevere buick order the followingICM 88999198Prom 16138872Fuel Pump 25163468Fuel Screen 25121637Throttle Sensor 25532800Oil Level sensor 12603784 & gasket 25531045Then see what happens <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Greg Ross Posted February 4, 2007 Share Posted February 4, 2007 Have you replaced the Fuel Pump Relay on the Firewall? A Relay going sour could be intermittant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 5, 2007 Share Posted February 5, 2007 relay has been replaced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mongeonman Posted February 5, 2007 Share Posted February 5, 2007 did you try it with the gas cap off or unscrewed,last time you canged it seem like everyting was fine,maybe you should try it if you did not already do it,a bad cap can cause alot of bizzar troubles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 5, 2007 Share Posted February 5, 2007 Replaced the old cap same problem, and put new cap back on same no change. I really believe the pump not sending enough fuel to the injectors. After 6 to 8 times turning the key off and trying again it start after about the 7th time.after the initial start up it will start first time every time for rest of the day. Setting over night when the problem occurs. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 This what I have found. Purchased a fuel pressure tester kit. Car overnight in heated garage hooked up tester to fuel rail, and with everything off turned the ignition on and waited 1 min. reading was 0.Turned key off and tried 6 more times still 0Then started cranking engine for 6 sec at time reading still 0After the 7th attempt engine started and reading on gauge was 37psi.So thinking without a doubt that the fuel pump is not priming and sending fuel to the injectors.Any comments or suggestions. Please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 Sorry for all the post. Gauge was left on the fuel rail engine not running. Psi was holding at 39psi, and after 15 minutes now at 25psi so fuel pressure is leaking or bleeding off.Could fuel pump in the tank loose pressure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wally888 Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 When it comes to electrical problems I am almost limited to "got power!" But am wondering if the Fuel Pump is always getting enough voltage (your problem seems to be somewhat similar to the yellow brake light on sometimes usually the cause being the Main Relay). Wonder if you have intermittant low voltage at the fuel pump. Maybe it is possible to test for voltage when pressure is low, 1 st. at relay then down the line? Exactly where down the line I don't know, maybe others will chime in, but sounds much easier than replacing Pump! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jcc3inc Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 Sir,It sounds like you have either intermittent fuel pump operation, or that it runs sometimes at too low a speed. Is it possible, on a fresh start, to have someone get near the fuel tank to listen to the fuel pump, and see if it is running slow on initial startup? Could there be something which, after you have started the engine, causes the fuel pump to come up to full pressure? A voltage change to the pump? A funny grounding problem?I would expect the pressure to bleed off after a while after the power is switched off.Regards,Jack C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 Thanks for the suggestions, and advise. But after the initial start it will start first time every time all day. This problem of 0 PSI is when the car sits overnight only. Relay is new, and have 3 more that I have changed. Not the relay, and showing no codes at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wally888 Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 My little mind still thinks you should check the voltage at the pump or as near as possible, when pressure is low! If pressure is low and voltage is O.K.......................bad pump or a partial open to ground If " " low.........................Why? Find open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonlabree Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 Zero pressure in the morning is normal. The pump will not hold the pressure over night. But when you turn on the key the pressure should come up to around 40 lbs before you start the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie1 Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 Their was a service bulletin to correct this problem on the 1989. I had a problem with my 1989 Riviera almost from the day it was purchased new. They came out with a different Prom to correct it.Perhaps someone else can chime in on this subject. I can look at my old work orders and pull out the part number, but The prom is very specific to the car.Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_blazer1997 Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 I would appreciate the number very much. Monday morning calling vandevere buick and going to order the following parts. 1. fuel pump, and screen the number I have for the reatta prom is 16138872 or 16122765.Vandevere buick has best prices.Thanks Larry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
padgett Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 The TSB I recall was on the prime function not the fuel pump. When you turn the key on two things happen:1) Power is made through the fuel pump relay to run the pump for two seconds then2) The injectors are turned on for a few seconds to prime the engine (not sure for how long but could check with a noid.)The TSB extended #2This is why in the morning it is a good idea to turn the key on, wait for a few seconds, then crank.OTOH our 3800s usually start in the first half turn reguardless but are garaged in a mild climate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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