Can someone idenitify this car?

[clarkgray]

Hello,

I am writing a book about my great uncle and need to identify a car he is standing next to in a photo. I want to make every attempt to find accurate information instead of saying something like,

"He's seen standing next to a really big, old car". From my own best guess, I would say this is probably a 1930 Packard Sedan. I'm not a car buff and I'm under 40 years old, so it's hard for me to tell. What I would really like to know is the exact model and name of this vehicle. This particular car looks to me like it was possibly something like a chauffeured version, though I could be wrong.

Another thing I would like to find out is what owning a car like this would have meant in the days when it was fairly new. To me, it looks like it was a luxury car and cost quite a bit of money in its time. Please pass along any comments.

The photo can be seen at

http://www.beehogray.com/warren/bee-ho-ada-in-car.jpg

Thanks,

Clark Gray

[Bob McAnlis]

Clark:

It is not a Packard. I am thinking it is a 29 Studebaker. I also thought initially 29/30 Buick, but Studebaker is more likely. Perhaps with addtl magnification, you can see if the hubcap has a script S or fancy B

Bob McAnlis

[Guest aussie610]

The hubcap looks like the Huppmobile shield.. Where is our Hupp expert?. Whatever it is it is a big car probably an eight, by the look of the gap between the back of the spare wheel and the front door

[KRK Sr.]

My best guess is a 24-25 Paige-Detroit. The hub cap (see attachment) and sun-visor seem to fit. Karl

[Guest aussie610]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My best guess is a 24-25 Paige-Detroit. The hub cap (see attachment) and sun-visor seem to fit. Karl </div></div>

KRK Sr, this is a Graham Paige hubcap you have shown there (see the site in my sig for pictures).

PS. another detail against it being Studie is they had welded wires (Like a Model A) but the ones in the photo have nipples. I will stick with Hupp, I will see if I can rustle up the Hupp symbol to show what I mean (Where is our resident Hupp expert when you need him)

[Dave@Moon]

It's hard to find a constant motif used for the Hupp trademark, especially in hub caps.

Looking at photos of Hupmobiles from that era I can't find any with a hubcap, cowl, or visor that match up very well to the photo.

[Guest aussie610]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's hard to find a constant motif used for the Hupp trademark, especially in hub caps.

Looking at photos of Hupmobiles from that era I can't find any with a hubcap, cowl, or visor that match up very well to the photo. </div></div>

I was under the impression they used something like the H and the shield as in this picture

http://www.members.optusnet.com.au/neils...nning_Board.jpg

[KRK Sr.]

Looking at the hupmobile photos and the Standard Catalog I find all the sun-visors to be a continuation of the roof line after 1926. The 1926 models shown have a much flatter belt line. Attached is a hup cap photo from my collection... Karl

[KRK Sr.]

Here is a 27 Hup cap. Karl

[KRK Sr.]

Here is a hup 8 cap, When I blow up the photo of the car, it seems to have more of the tear drop look on the spare tire than the shield of the hupmobile. Karl

[Guest aussie610]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Looking at the hupmobile photos and the Standard Catalog I find all the sun-visors to be a continuation of the roof line after 1926. The 1926 models shown have a much flatter belt line. Attached is a hup cap photo from my collection... Karl </div></div>

Thats the Hubcap I was thinking, have a look at the Model S in http://clubs.hemmings.com/clubsites/hupmobile/models.htm, belt line seems to tie in and would match with the hubcap (be warned the wire wheel and wood wheel caps were often subtly different)

As for the sunvisor, looks like one of those after market jobs (With the green glass, that lasted till the first stone hit it)

[KRK Sr.]

The only other car I can find with a hub cap with a shield, cowl lights in the right place and the visor like the photo was Chandler 8. I don't have any good color photos of the car, but here is it's cap. Karl

[TG57Roadmaster]

Greetings,

I'll cast my ballot for the 1929 Lincoln Model L (maybe '30?), for four reasons. The high door hinge on the belt molding, the locking toolbox on and height of the body sill, and don't laugh, the hubcap. Let the Lincoln experts ID the Model number, but I'd guess the Model 157 Willoughby Berline (Landau). Never mind that the 1930 7-Passenger Sedan photo here doesn't have dual sidemounts and wears the still-available artillery wheels. All Lincolns rode on a 136" WB, so you were right to surmise it was a luxury car. The production was 5 (five) each for Model 157, 1929 & Model 187, 1930. Price when new was $5900-$6000, depending on year (assuming it's the Willoughby version); a standard Lincoln Model L sedan set you back a paltry $4400.

According to the Standard Catalog, in '29 Lincoln changed their former leather visor to a glass one, so aussie6 was correct, too; thanks Ned. This Lincoln probably had a division window, and could be owner or chauffeur driven. Willoughby was a Custom Coachbuilder in Utica, NY, that bodied some of the great Classics of the day. By 1940, a '30 Lincoln had a cash value of $35 or so, that's what a used car dealer would've been willing to pay. Yikes! And we complain about today's car's depreciation.

A very rare car, indeed!

Happy New Year,

Tom Gibson

[TG57Roadmaster]

Here's a grainy photo of the Lincoln-Willoughby interior from the Auto Salons in 1930.

Fur coat optional.

Tom Gibson

[TG57Roadmaster]

For the 1931 Salons, the new Lincoln K Chassis debuted on a 145" WB. This Willoughby-Lincoln made the rounds of the various shows, with the New York Salon held as usual at the Commodore Hotel. Note how the rear compartment seems larger, and how the door handles have migrated from the window sill to the door panel.

A somewhat interesting historical note is that the Commodore was bought by Donald Trump in the early 80's, and was his first big renovation job. Glitz, glamour and loads of mirrors prevailed, a portent of things to come.

Tom Gibson