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Kevin,

And when you do see this car, take plenty of photos and especially good photos of the engine from both sides.  I will be able to tell you if it is a 1916 or 1917 chassis from the photos.  Buick exported completed chassis to McLaughlin and they built their own bodies for their cars.  Also, try and get clear photos of the frame tag (under the left headlight on top of the frame) and engine number (stamped into the aluminum crankcase at the number 1 cylinder location on the manifold side.  The car can be identified from these two numbers rather quickly.

 

Terry Wiegand

South Hutchinson, Kansas

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Hello Terry

 

Finally got out to see the car today.  The emblem in the rad shell identifies the car as a "McLaughlin" only.  

 

The chassis number on the end of the left frame rail is 362509.  The engine number is 350405.

 

Also found a McLaughlin tag on the toe board immediately ahead of the shift and parking brake levers.

 

It indicates the model number as E45.  It also lists the engine serial number 350405 (so it appears to have its original engine) and shows a serial number of 22527.

 

It does not mention the chassis number at all.

 

Is 22527 the serial number of the body?  Or would McLaughlin have considered it to be the serial number of the car itself?

 

Not sure how many files I can attach to this note, so I may post more replies.

 

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.

 

One last question:  Is it possible to get a photocopy of the owner's manual for the car?  There was no documentation with the car and the new owner (not me) is anxious to learn what's required to bring the car back to life.

 

The original vacuum tank is still present but has been bypassed and an elderly looking electric pump seems to supply gasoline to the carb.  The rear wood spoke wheels appear to have been newly replaced with much sturdier spoke that those on the front wheels.  The rear wheel hubcaps say "McLaughlin Buick" while the front only say "Buick".

 

Kevin

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Hi Kevin

 

I am looking through the data in the back of "Cars of Canada". It lists "E" series cars as 1918 models.There is an E-6-45 and an E-6-45 Special.The Special had natural wood top bows,nickle trim,and a walnut dash with a special storage compartment. The wheelbase on 1917 cars is 115 " and 1918 cars 118 ". Horsepower rating went from 45 in 1917 to 60 in 1918. The book only gives serial numbers starting in 1923.

Hope this is helpful.

Jim

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Kevin

Looks like yours is a 1918,  Serial numbers for 1918 E models ran from 343783 to 480995.  Yours having serial number 362509 would have been built in late 1917 as Buick started building their 1918 models in August 1917.

Edited by Rod Wise (see edit history)
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Kevin,

Thanks for the photos.  As the others have said, the car is a 1918 model.  In looking at the engine photo I have this to say - for being over 100 years old the engine is in remarkably clean condition.  I have looked at engines in this era that were so junked up and caked with dirt and grease that it was almost impossible to tell just what was what.  The thing that just stands out like a sore thumb is that water return tube on top of the block.  That tube is in wonderful condition.  No rusted out holes, not big dents, not patches to close up leaks.  I would love to see more photos of the rest of the car.  The frame number of 362509 is in the first lot numbers of 358787 - 375786.  These lot numbers were specific for the model 45.  The engine numbers for the 1918 6-Cylinder models were 343896 - up.

Here is an interesting tidbit about the engine numbers - the model E-49 had engine numbers of 320782 - up.  Haven't figured that one out yet.  There was an EX-45 (the x denoted export) also.  However, this frame tag does not include the 'x', so, this means that the chassis that were sent up to McLaughlin were not considered exported as were the cars that were sold in the rest of the world.  My longtime friend, the late Terry Dunham, imparted that bit of information to me many years ago.  My opinion of the engine serial numbers for the model 49 being earlier than the rest is due to the fact that the model 49 was introduced at the beginning of the 1917 models production but was designated as a 1918 model.  I think that this had something to do with materials allocation during World War 1.  Terry and I talked about that at length several times.  This was an extremely complicated time in the automobile industry and the U.S. war effort.

 

Terry Wiegand

South Hutchinson, Kansas

Edited by Terry Wiegand
GRAMMAR (see edit history)
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4 hours ago, Kevin McCabe said:

Don't seem to be allowed to upload additional photos?

When you upload photos to a post, they forum software downsizes the files upon upload. Even though it will not allow you to upload additional photos, you can go back and edit the post and attach additional photos without a problem. As soon as you reach the limit again, save the edited post, and after the software downsizes those photos, you can edit it again and upload more photos to the same post.

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14 hours ago, J.H.Boland said:

Hi Kevin

 

I am looking through the data in the back of "Cars of Canada". It lists "E" series cars as 1918 models.There is an E-6-45 and an E-6-45 Special.The Special had natural wood top bows,nickle trim,and a walnut dash with a special storage compartment. The wheelbase on 1917 cars is 115 " and 1918 cars 118 ". Horsepower rating went from 45 in 1917 to 60 in 1918. The book only gives serial numbers starting in 1923.

Hope this is helpful.

Jim

To all of you who have responded to my inquiry,  thank you VERY much.  I will attempt to upload more pictures so keep your fingers crossed.  Based on the equipment found on an E-6-45 Special, I can provide the following additional details.  The car has a front bumper but the front vertical face appears to be painted silver. The remainder of it is black.  The headlamp bezels appear to be nickle.  The rad shell is painted black.  There is what I took to be an accessory spotlight mounted to the left end of the windshield frame.  The switch for this lamp is mounted to the lamp housing and the rear of the lamp body has a round rearview mirror mounted in it.  There is also a second panoramic mirror mounted inboard of the lamp.  This lamp, its fittings and the pan mirror are all nickle.  The soft top has natural wood bows.  The rear flexible three section window in the top has a nearly square center section with the two outer sections having the upper outboard corners radiused.   The top material looked to be white at one time and is now quite yellowed.  The owner is going to try and clean the top to see if it can be brought back closer to white.  A second complete top was also included with the car.  It is fitted with material that to me, is a very early version of vinyl.  Quite thick but still having some flex.  The window in this top is an elongated hexagon with the top and bottom sections curving inwards towards each other.   The steering wheel rim is wood and in good shape for its age.  The throttle and spark levers as well as the quadrant appear  to be nickle.  A small rectangular plate appears to have been added to the center switch area of the I/P.  It contains an ammeter as well as two toggle switches which may be ignition and the starter.  There were no keys with the car so this may be a workaround.  The I/P does seem to have a woodgrain panel affixed to it.  There is also a small wooden compartment in the lower center portion of the front seat back.  There is a key for the lock on the compartment door, stamped "4".  The key seems to operate the lock, but the compartment door does not open.  There is a rim wind clock mounted in the "gauge" area, central to the I/P.  The speedometer/odometer/trip odometer is also present and in the bottom center section is some sort of sight glass that is rather oily.  Is this something to indicate oil flow through the engine?  

 

Along with the elderly electric fuel pump supplying gasoline to the carburetor in place of the vacuum tank, I could not find a port on the engine that would have been the original vacuum source for the tank.  Other than that, I was confused by the mounting system for the manifolds.  A stud mounted in the cylinder head carries a fingered clamp that holds the exhaust manifold in place and there is a further piece that seems to hold the intake manifold to the head via the exhaust manifold.  Finally, at the curve from the exhaust manifold to the exhaust pipe, there is a round hole in the manifold casting which provides a small view of the manifold inner details.  Should this hole be plugged?  No attempt yet has been made to start the car so how this hole will affect engine operation is not yet known.

 

There is no rear bumper on the car and from the looks of the framework immediately behind the fuel tank there would either have been rear bumper brackets attached or the mounts for (one or two?) spare rims.

 

More pictures to follow

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13 hours ago, Terry Wiegand said:

Kevin,

Thanks for the photos.  As the others have said, the car is a 1918 model.  In looking at the engine photo I have this to say - for being over 100 years old the engine is in remarkably clean condition.  I have looked at engines in this era that were so junked up and caked with dirt and grease that it was almost impossible to tell just what was what.  The thing that just stands out like a sore thumb is that water return tube on top of the block.  That tube is in wonderful condition.  No rusted out holes, not big dents, not patches to close up leaks.  I would love to see more photos of the rest of the car.  The frame number of 362509 is in the first lot numbers of 358787 - 375786.  These lot numbers were specific for the model 45.  The engine numbers for the 1918 6-Cylinder models were 343896 - up.

Here is an interesting tidbit about the engine numbers - the model E-49 had engine numbers of 320782 - up.  Haven't figured that one out yet.  There was an EX-45 (the x denoted export) also.  However, this frame tag does not include the 'x', so, this means that the chassis that were sent up to McLaughlin were not considered exported as were the cars that were sold in the rest of the world.  My longtime friend, the late Terry Dunham, imparted that bit of information to me many years ago.  My opinion of the engine serial numbers for the model 49 being earlier than the rest is due to the fact that the model 49 was introduced at the beginning of the 1917 models production but was designated as a 1918 model.  I think that this had something to do with materials allocation during World War 1.  Terry and I talked about that at length several times.  This was an extremely complicated time in the automobile industry and the U.S. war effort.

 

Terry Wiegand

South Hutchinson, Kansas

Hello All

 

One other question I should have asked.  The "serial number" on the plate on the toe board indicates the serial number of the car as 22527 and not the six digit number on the plate on the end of the left frame rail.  22527 is also shown as the vehicle serial number on the ownership.  Is 22527 the serial number of the BODY?   If so, was it common practise to use the body number to register the car rather than the chassis serial number?

 

Thanks,

 

Kevin   

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12 hours ago, Kevin McCabe said:

 

 

Along with the elderly electric fuel pump supplying gasoline to the carburetor in place of the vacuum tank, I could not find a port on the engine that would have been the original vacuum source for the tank.  Other than that,

 

Finally, at the curve from the exhaust manifold to the exhaust pipe, there is a round hole in the manifold casting which provides a small view of the manifold inner details.  Should this hole be plugged?  No attempt yet has been made to start the car so how this hole will affect engine operation is not yet known.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I have a spare vacuum tank for this car I can sell you, from a 1918 E-49. I don't know if you want to strive for originality but if you do, the electric fuel pump should be removed if you can fix your vacuum tank or want to use mine. You say you can't find the port on your engine where the vacuum source would be, but I can see in your photo that the vacuum line from the engine is already attached to the vacuum tank, in your photo it goes from the very top of the vacuum tank to the intake manifold right above the carb. That's where it's supposed to be! The other fitting at the top of the vacuum tank, with no tube coming up, goes to atmosphere. I have a tube coming up on mine but it doesn't go anywhere, it doesn't need to, it just goes to the atmosphere. When the vacuum valve opens the atmosphere valve closes, and when the vacuum valve closes, the atmosphere valve opens, all depending on the float inside the vacuum tank. You should put a short piece of the thin tube to that atmosphere fitting, and bend it back down, so dust doesn't settle into it.

 

As for your second point above, I have a round hole in my exhaust manifold just like yours. There was originally a pipe leading hot air from the manifold surround at that point, to the carburetor surround, to heat up the outside of the carb to help evaporate the stuff they called gasoline in those days but was part kerosene and harder to evaporate. Almost everybody with these cars today has removed the pipe, because modern gasoline doesn't need that. Your hole doesn't need to be plugged because it doesn't conduct any exhaust gas, just heat. It was like a heat riser. I have the same hole and drive my car around and no exhaust gas comes out that hole.

.

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Edited by Morgan Wright (see edit history)
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The oil flow gage was there so one could see the oil moving. Really it is no more than basically an oil pressure gage. There were a lot of these cars around and I think the oil pumps were very reliable. One thing that could cause a problem however would be if somehow water got into the oil pan and froze in cold weather. That could result in a broken pump shaft. Always good to know that you have oil flow/pressure. Dandy Dave! 

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On 12/4/2019 at 9:58 PM, Terry Wiegand said:

Kevin,

Thanks for the photos.  As the others have said, the car is a 1918 model.  In looking at the engine photo I have this to say - for being over 100 years old the engine is in remarkably clean condition.  I have looked at engines in this era that were so junked up and caked with dirt and grease that it was almost impossible to tell just what was what.  The thing that just stands out like a sore thumb is that water return tube on top of the block.  That tube is in wonderful condition.  No rusted out holes, not big dents, not patches to close up leaks.  I would love to see more photos of the rest of the car.  The frame number of 362509 is in the first lot numbers of 358787 - 375786.  These lot numbers were specific for the model 45.  The engine numbers for the 1918 6-Cylinder models were 343896 - up.

Here is an interesting tidbit about the engine numbers - the model E-49 had engine numbers of 320782 - up.  Haven't figured that one out yet.  There was an EX-45 (the x denoted export) also.  However, this frame tag does not include the 'x', so, this means that the chassis that were sent up to McLaughlin were not considered exported as were the cars that were sold in the rest of the world.  My longtime friend, the late Terry Dunham, imparted that bit of information to me many years ago.  My opinion of the engine serial numbers for the model 49 being earlier than the rest is due to the fact that the model 49 was introduced at the beginning of the 1917 models production but was designated as a 1918 model.  I think that this had something to do with materials allocation during World War 1.  Terry and I talked about that at length several times.  This was an extremely complicated time in the automobile industry and the U.S. war effort.

 

Terry Wiegand

South Hutchinson, Kansas

 

 

Probably due to materials shortage for the war, the big D-55 was dropped for the model year 1917, meaning that there would be no 7 passenger touring car that year, even though it sold fairly well in 1916 (B-55 sold 2,045 in 1914, C-55 sold 3,449 in 1915, but the D-55 sold 9,866 in 1916).  A 4-cylinder engine was introduced in 1916 for the 1917 model year that was much more efficient than previous 4 cylinder engines, making much more horsepower than similar-sized ones, or making the same horsepower as much larger ones. Buick engineers quickly started to work on an engine that would carry this increase in efficiency to 6 cylinders as well, for the 7-passenger car that was to replace the D-55. It would have 60 brake horsepower with only 242 cubic inches, instead of only 55 brake horsepower from 331 cubic inches for the D-55. During the design phase in 1916 it was called the 49 engine, to be put into the later model 49 (not E-49 yet, just 49 for now). After working models of the engine were built and tested in 1916, the model E-49 was designed and a few were built at the end of 1916, and the model was announced on January 21, 1917 in the Detroit newspapers, to be shown for the first time at the Detroit Auto Show. But there were problems with the engine, and a great turnover of management at that time because Billy Durant had returned to run GM, led to difficulty in production at first. Charlie Nash had left for Wisconsin to buy Rambler, Walter Chrysler was now head of Buick, Walter Marr retired as chief engineer, but stayed on as consulting engineer, the new chief engineer was Enos DeWaters. A telegram was sent April 3, 1917 from Flint by Harry Bassett, Buick's assistant general manager, to Walter Marr at Signal Mountain, saying problems with the model 49 engine were holding up production. Marr went with Buick's draftsman Leo Goosen to Flint, to fix the design problem, but in late June, early E-49's were being dispatched to branch managers and distributors, and many were complaining that there was noise in the engine. Walter Chrysler sent a memo to Marr, DeWaters, and Basset: "We should endeavor to drop everything else in the engineering department and clean up this motor immediately, as I think this is one of the most serious things we have to contend with right now."  A team of 9 branch managers and distributors who had complained about the noise went to Flint, staying in the Hotel Dresden. Walter Marr returned to Flint to fix the noise problem in the design. This went well and production of the E-49 continued in earnest. I cannot find anywhere how many E-49's were produced in the model year 1917, but it couldn't have been very many in those 2 or 3 months because in August, 1917, the 1918 models were announced, and the new models E-44, E-45, E-46, E-47 and E-50 would all be fitted with the E-49 engine, while the E-49 itself was increased in price from $1,385 for the 1917 model year to $1,495 for the 1918 model year, with a few minor changes to it as well, such as toe tags, grease cups, etc.
.

In the ad below, the E-49 was displayed with other 1917 cars D-44, D-45, D-46 and D-47 as well as the 4 cylinder D-34 and D-35. They were considered 1917 cars at that time, but history was re-written since then, and now everybody thinks E-49 was only 1918. 

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Edited by Morgan Wright (see edit history)
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Guys:

 

Thanks very much for all of the info on this car and some of the background to go with it.

 

I should point out again that I do not own this car and am merely doing some investigation on his behalf.  The car was purchased locally to the current owner and other than having the interior reupholstered, appears quite original.  The rear tire mount and rear bumper appear to be missing.  A non original toggle switch plate is mounted in the instrument panel.  There are two switches in the panel as well as an ammeter gauge.  Also present is what appears to be an aftermarket rim-wind clock.  Pulling up on the outer rim of the dial allows the time to be set, but the rim does not appear willing to turn in either direction to actually wind the clock.  I believe the owner will take the clock to a local clockmaker to see if can be made to work again.

 

One question as to registration.  In addition to the model year on the vehicle ownership being incorrect (the car is identified as a 1916), the serial number shown on the ownership is that of the tag on the toe board of the body, which I take to be the serial number of the McLaughlin built body.  The frame serial number plate is present at the front of the left frame rail below the headlamp.  Was it common to register cars by their body serial number as opposed to their chassis serial number?   From the discussion thus far, I take it that the chassis, running gear and powertrain were all built by Buick in Flint?  Or would there have been some sort of rudimentary knock-down assembly done by McLaughlin in Oshawa?

 

Thanks again for all of  your help and information.

 

More pictures attached.

 

Kevin

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Kevin,

 

The car should be registered using the frame number.  The engine could have been changed out and then the registration would be void.  There are quite a few things that need to be corrected on the car and then it could be a decent driver.

 

Terry Wiegand

South Hutchinson, Kansas

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My 1915 McLaughlin is registered in Ontario by the serial number plate attached to the floorboards.  I would say if it is registered do not make work for yourself, accept it as correct.  My car is registered as a 1914 and the Ministry wants a letter from a recognized authority who can verify the car is actually a 1915, before they will change the ownership.  In my case, since I have RM Restorations nearby, and a C25 car is obviously a 1915, it is a formality.  I haven't bothered yet to make the change.  BTW, my engine number is also on my brass plate attached to the floorboards.

 

My car also has the oil/ spinner sight gauge, also has a neat tool box/ foot rest for the rear tonneau and nickel plated headlamps which I think are McLaughlin features.

 

Regards, Gary

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17 hours ago, Terry Wiegand said:

Kevin,

 

The car should be registered using the frame number.  The engine could have been changed out and then the registration would be void.  There are quite a few things that need to be corrected on the car and then it could be a decent driver.

 

Terry Wiegand

South Hutchinson, Kansas

Hi Terry

 

The McLaughlin plate on the toe board also lists the engine serial number and it happens to match the serial number on the engine in the car so to me, that makes it "numbers matching".  Something else that is probably uncommon, given the amount of engine exchanges that occurred back in the day.

 

Kevin

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16 hours ago, cxgvd said:

My 1915 McLaughlin is registered in Ontario by the serial number plate attached to the floorboards.  I would say if it is registered do not make work for yourself, accept it as correct.  My car is registered as a 1914 and the Ministry wants a letter from a recognized authority who can verify the car is actually a 1915, before they will change the ownership.  In my case, since I have RM Restorations nearby, and a C25 car is obviously a 1915, it is a formality.  I haven't bothered yet to make the change.  BTW, my engine number is also on my brass plate attached to the floorboards.

 

My car also has the oil/ spinner sight gauge, also has a neat tool box/ foot rest for the rear tonneau and nickel plated headlamps which I think are McLaughlin features.

 

Regards, Gary

Hello Gary

 

I'm in Ontario as well.  I have run into a significant number of cars in the past 40 years that have some sort of mistake on the serial number.  Everything from an "S" that should be a "5", a "3" that should have been an "8" up to cars (bought new by their owners) that are the wrong model year,  a '73 PONTIAC Barracuda (don't know how that one got by) and a friend who brought a '57 Imperial back from New Jersey.  The NJ title called it a Chev Impala, and listed a serial number that we could not find anywhere on the car.  I've made up a letter for the vehicle owner(s) to take to a Ministry office to get the errors corrected and no longer have a problem with getting them corrected.   

 

In the case of the car I've been researching the model year is definitely incorrect,  and the car ownership lists the body serial number and not the frame serial number.  Unfortunately there's no one left front 1918 to ask about what Ontario's practice was at the time with regard to serial numbers, although I did talk to one man at the Ministry in Toronto who said Ontario accepted body serial numbers as the serial number of the car.  I think I'm going to call Toronto again and confirm that.

 

Even if Ontario is OK with registering the car via the body serial number, I'm hoping to have the owner get the model year corrected.  

 

Kevin

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

Nice promo for the 1917 MODEL E-49. 

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https://libwww.freelibrary.org/digital/item/29794

 

And the official photo from Buick for the 1917 model E-49.

 

It says 10,505 1917 Buick E-49's were made. The modern books say around 16,000 1918 E-49's were made, but I don't know if they made 16,000 in the 1918 model year, or whether they made 6,000 and lumped the 10,505 1917's together with it.

 

Anyway, the E-49 was clearly in both model years and was made for around 18 months. I'll look for the official photo for the 1918 E-49, I have it around here somewhere. It looks like this but the top is up.

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Edited by Morgan Wright (see edit history)
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I'm just catching up on this thread, and I'm glad to here of another early McLaughlin surfacing here in Ontario. I have a '16 D45 Touring which I bought a few months ago.

Keith

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