1958 Limited - is this worth buying?

[iLikeBuick]

hello to forum-members!

Today I had the chance to take a look at a '58 Limited 4 Door Sedan. The overall apearance was quite good. Car was complete and all chrome in relatively good shape (i.e. no obvious rust, but some scratches here and there). Car was equipped with: wonderbar radio,AC,PS,PB,Power-windows,two tone paint (maybe not original color). I could post or mail more photos, if this helps.

I (newbe) found the following minor(???) defects: The left eyebrow was cracked. The dash was unevenly bolstered (possibly at sometime redone?). Sunvisors, seats and carpet are probably not original cloth but restored. The materials for these seemed to be a bit cheap, but professionally done. The steering wheel can be moved about 2Inches while car is parked. Is this normal or a sign of a worn out steering?

The trunk was newly carpeted. This (cheap) carpet was glued to the metal. I hope this was not done to cover up rust problems.

I could not drive the car today, but seller said it would run and all systems should be working. I'm very tempted (because I like the looks of the 1958 Buick), but unsure wheter to buy or not. The seller is asking 28,000 USD here in Germany.

[Guest Shaffer]

Hello. Any exterior photographs of the Buick? Interior looks nice.

[iLikeBuick]

ext. photos:

[iLikeBuick]

Hi there!

Here is another detail shot in this attachment. Please post your comments.

[Guest BJM]

Hhhmmm, price seems a litlle high even for a Limited. The steering issue concerns me. How does it move 2 inches - side to side or can you pull it out? The seat upholstery pattern looks correct even if material is not.

It shows very nice in the photos but the price seems high by about $10,000 US dollars at least but then we are talking a different market place and we don't know miles and how nice it does drive.

[iLikeBuick]

Hi 3Jakes!

Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this car. The steering wheel can be turned (guesstimate) 2 inches (end to end measured on the circumference of the wheel) without effort or visible tire movement. This concerns me too, but I must admit, I have very little experience with automobile technology of that era. Odometer reads 75K miles - so it has seen some roads. I've attached a photo from the underside.

The plate in the engine compartment reads as follows:

1958 MOD. 58-750

Style 58-4389X

BODY No. G 1823

TRIM 731

PAINT 53

ACC DRIN

Can someone make something out of this? So far I have been able to decode the color-code. The rest is ????

Thank you very much!

[GMPARTSMAN]

Looks like it needs rear coil springs. See the rubber spring spacers between the coils?

[Guest my3buicks]

Very nice car, but I agree it is WAY over priced - I would say the $10K over at least is being conservative. It appears to probably be a # 3 car, also keep in mind the paint scheme is incorrect for 58's. It appears to be a graet car to get a hold of, but at a reasonable amount

[Guest BJM]

That steering wheel movement, in hindsight, is normal for cars of this period. That is normal play for a 50's or 60's vehicle. I would drive the car, if serious on purchase and make sure the actual steering is responsive. I misunderstood and thought maybe you meant the steering column or the wheel up or down.

It bodes well that the company selling is allowing you to have access underneath and in all corners to look the car over. 75K and it's present condition do seem to suggest a no. 3 graded car as Keith mentions. So now it is about price.

Keep in mind we are in the states and 4 door Limiteds are more plentiful. Also, you may have already thought about this - but many a car from the U.S. is going to Europe these days so maybe you can get "more" car for the money and even including shipping come out lower then the price he is asking for this Limited.

We have members all over the country that would probably be willing to assist in personally looking a car over for you to be your eyes and ears over here.

[Guest Shaffer]

Yeah, grandpas old 55' Buick Special had a lot of play in the steering. His 55' Cadillac has very little however. Like 3jakes said, this is not uncommon for a car of this vintage. I would not fret it.

Good luck.

[Buicksplus]

It looks like a very clean car to me, at least from these few pictures.

RE the price, I lived in Germany many years ago and then the prices of American cars were very high, mainly because of tariffs that were around then. Those tariffs may have been paid on this car and are now a part of its current value.

If you were to locate a car in this condition in the US, it would probably cost 5 to 10K to get it shipped to Germany, depending on how close the car is to a port city.

If this car were for sale in the US, I would expect it to be advertised at 15 to 20K, assuming it drives as nicely as it looks. There has been much more interest in '58 Buicks in the last few years, collectors have finally noticed how outrageous and collectible these cars are! The BCA shows now have many examples, but in the past you saw just a few.

Good luck! If you have been looking for an American car in Germany, you already have a better idea than us about what American collector cars cost in Europe.

Bill.

[iLikeBuick]

Thank you all for your comments. I've decided against that car. In my opinion it has too many flaws. It is lacking originality and I have come to the conclusion that it would be better to look for another opportunity.

Even though the 58 Limited is very rare. A (classic) Cadillac dealer was surprised that these appear to be more rare than some classic Cadillacs. But he promised to contact me, if something turns up. So I will watch Hemmings, ebay and all the Internet sites and maybe.....

BTW: Did you know that gas has climbed to 6,50 US$ per gallon now? At least here in Germany. Driving around has become a costly hobby.

Greetings!

[55PackardGuy]

It has been interesting to watch your decision-making process on the car. Patience is a virtue in buying (and selling), and it sounds like you're willing to be patient. Depending on the seller's circumstances, you might keep an eye on the car. The longer it's up for sale, the better chance you can "deal" on it, and maybe save enough to make it a worthwhile purchase. Good luck!

[59 98]

If I remember correctly, a BCA member was trying to sell his awesome original Limited 4 door, silver with blue interior, for about the same money. This was a few months ago, so I am not sure if the car is still available or not. This would be a great car to buy if a Limited is what you are seeking.

Here's the ad, might be worth tracking the car down.

' Gary Rimer BCA # 25982 has put his 1958 Buick Limited 4 Dr. hardtop up for sale it has 85k original miles full power (no a/c)and is Silver Mist with light Blue interior it is a concorse ready strong #2 car a picture can be found at southeast michigan chapters link on the bca main page go to the photo gallery then to Gary's 1958 Buick Limited... Gary can be contacted at matickoeglass@matickchevy.com or by phone at 734 261 2524 days or 248 345 3778 eves the car is in the Detroit Mich. area '

Matt

[NTX5467]

Re: Play in Steering . . .

Steering gearboxes have come a good ways since the 1950s, BUT there are a few things that should be remembered . . .

Then, just as now, there are clearances between the gears that need to be "optimum" for the least amount of steering wheel movement before steering linkage movement. Therefore, when the adjustments are "right", the steering wheel should be reasonably tight in its free play when "on center". It might be common to find them "loose" now, but they didn't come that way from the factory. There should be no reason for a Buick steering gearbox to have a different adjustment than a Cadillac gearbox or a Chevy gearbox (power steering or not), I suspect.

Remember, too, that many things that we read about and do now were things that only a select few mechanics would touch back then. Adjusting a steering gear box for less free play was one of them. Most would check for underbody steering linkage issues rather than consider the steering gear might need a little adjustment for wear. Plus, it was somewhat common for the car to be ready for the salvage yard at 80K+ miles, so that can play into the assessment of getting something done about "loose steering" too.

For several reasons, rebuilding an engine was something that typicallly was not done. It was easier to buy a "good" engine from a salvage yard than rebuild what you had. One reason was that many of the machining operations were done "in chassis", which were still somewhat "black magic" to many people. For example, the cowl overhung the rear of the engine, making the mounting of a boring bar to the surface of the block for that rear cylinder (of many inline engines) impossible. To get to the engine, you basically removed the front sheetmetal of the vehicle (more room for problems during removal, storage, and reassembly!), on many cars, but you still had the cowl overhang issue to deal with. All things considered, many people decided to get another vehicle rather than try to find someone to do a good job fixing their old one. A situation that probably led to the orientation that once somebody did something to the car, it would never be the same afterward (including, but not limited too, engine work, body work, windshield replacement). For economic reasons, some people had to fix what they had, as the more well-to-do got different vehicles with no problems (at that time).

In using the steering wheel movement vs. tire movement as the determiner of "looseness", which is a valid way of looking at things, the condition of the total amount of rubber bushings in the front suspension should be considered too, plus the condition of the steering linkage and such. If there is much wear in those linkage items, it can increase the amount the steering wheel must be turned to start the tire to move.

Just some thoughts,

NTX5467

[Glassesguy]

Original Color Code is 5 Polar Mist on the top with 3 Laurel Mist on the main body. Limiteds never used painted inserts on the sides surrounding the louvers, although some restorers have painted as such. I've not been able to yet decipher your option codes of DP1N. Your interior code 731 is grey nylon cloth inserts surrounded by silver leather so it looks like someone tried to stay close when redoing the interior. If you are looking for a car restored to original this car has too much to do on it and I agree with your decision. Good luck in your search.

[Glassesguy]

Although you have passed on this car I found one of my 1958 order sheets to try and decode your accessories codes. The first letter"D" is for the radio. Eight different combinations were available; so the wiring would have to installed in the body. The second letter confuses me. I believe it to be a "B". "B" is for the heater and defroster. If it was an "R" it would represent a divided rear seat and obviously that refers to a wagon. The "I" represents the tinted glass. It is not a "1". The "N" is for the air conditioner. These codes would appear on the Body tag as they would have to either be installed by or to have had provision made for their installation by Fisher Body before being delivered to the Final Assembly point. Judging by your pictures, these accessories are present on the car. Just thought I'd finish my reply to your question in case other 58 people are having the same question on their codes.

[MartyWorld]

By viewing the photo, the vehicle is equipped with

the "Flight Pitch Dynaflow". Very rare and very

few shops that can repair it......limited parts

availability.

Marty

[iLikeBuick]

The Flight Pitch Dynaflow would be just one reason to buy a Limited. Yes I know that the Roadmaster too had the FP as standard equipment.

Typically a transmission would need to be rebuild just once. Then the car doesn't get driven so much to need another rebuild ever. Parts could be an issue, but thats a typical risk of owning a rare classic car.

BTW: My daily driver is a Audi equipped with Multitronic (i.e. continuously variable)transmission. A Buick with Flight Pitch trans would suit very well I suppose...

[Centurion]

I agree that Flight Pitch is one of the attractions of the '58 Limited. When set up correctly, the Flight Pitch is a pleasure to drive, and I have been pleasantly surprised regarding the availability of Flight Pitch parts on Ebay. In my area, there are at least four excellent transmission shops who would not hesitate to tackle a Flight Pitch rebuild if it became necessary.

A '58 Limited without Flight Pitch just wouldn't seem right!

[Glassesguy]

Brian:

Well said! Driving a Flight Pitch is unique especially when you realize it is pushing around 5000 pounds of American iron. I have driven 58 Limiteds converted to Variable Pitch Dynaflow as well. Mr. Jim Hughes of Jim's Dynaflow Service and a member our chapter just rebuilt a Flight Pitch for another chapter member and included all the upgrades per the many Service Bulletins issued by Buick for this transmission. That member completed a 200 mile round trip tour our chapter just did and he was all smiles and amazed at the smoothness. Jim says hard parts for the Flight Pitch are getting a little harder to find but not impossible. Throttle and gearshift linkage and stator adjustments are critical. Just had to share your sentiments on this transmission.

[Centurion]

Dave, in the seven years that I've owned my '59 Buick with Flight Pitch (known as "Triple Turbine" in '59), I've driven the car nearly 20,000 miles on various Buick Club tours. The transmission has performed flawlessly, and the guys whose cars were long-ago converted to Variable Pitch ("Twin Turbine") are wishing that their cars had retained the unique feel of the Flight Pitch. The transmission is truly one of the features I most enjoy about the car.

[MartyWorld]

I agree that a vehicle with the flight pitch dynaflow

for myself would be more desirable......didn't know

others felt the same.

This passed weekend (Mothers Day) I saw a 1958 Buick

Century with a flight pitch dynaflow. The guy selling

the car didn't know what I was talking about when I

mentioned the car was equipped with flight pitch trans.........

He said it shifted very well...........fascinating.

It shifted?????????????????????

My first car was a 59 Buick Invicta with the twin turbine

dynaflow. The car did perform very well, but I was intrigued

with the triple turbine trans....maybe one day I will

own one.

Marty