How do judges really know?

[Rick Hoover]

Wayne ~ It was never said that only experienced judges should be on the field. If you want to jump in, re-read what was said. The point was, if you as a judge, don't know if a certain item on the vehicle is correct or not, you ask. What David experienced was a rare circumstance. Least I would think so.

As far as Shop Rat goes, nobody on here said she had a thing to do with that '12 Ford in the first place. She came on here and gave bad information about the point deduction the car was given and then tried to back peddle out of it when she was shown she was wrong. She then went on to blame the situation of that Ford on everyone else but the people that judged it. She's done this before. Explain to me how in the world is this judging section of the forum going to hold any credit with the membership if incorrect answers are to be repeatedly given by some that just like to see themselves talk on here and don't research the questions being asked? Is that the type of forum you want Wayne? I would hope not. Our membership comes on here to ask serious questions about their vehicles being judged and they deserve the respect of having the right people to give them the answers they seek. Not hip shots.

[ex98thdrill]

Rick,

As a novice judge, the thing that I have problems with involves the judging sheet. They tell us to "judge the car to the sheet, not the sheet to the car" and I'm afraid from time to time I overlook things because I make it a point not to even look at the judging sheet until I'm done.

Do do things more accurately, I would feel more comfortable looking at the sheet while the judging is taking place and then taking the points off after I walk away from the vehicle. I'm sure as time goes on, I will develop those skills, but in the meantime, I'm still in the learning process.

[1937hd45]

Pat, Pretend the car is a soldier in dress uniforn inspection, bet you don't need a sheet to judge him. If something is wrong or out of place it should pop out right away to someone with a trained eye, then note it on the sheet.

[novaman]

I understand where you're coming from. As a "newer" judge, it is hard to remember every thing that is on the sheet in your category. Since I mainly do chassis, I basically have the thing memorized. But don't ask me to quote the sheet because I can't. I know what areas are considered "mine" like the bumpers & bumper guards, which you would think would be exterior. Plus everything under the car except the crankcase (which I usually let the engine judge know about any problems I see from the underside). At the show I'll usually make two trips around the car. First looking at bumpers, guards, tires, hubcaps, etc., making mental notes of defects I see. Then I usually look from one front corner and the opposite rear corner, noting any defects. As 1937hd45 said the problems will be noticeable (if you have to hunt for that point deduction you're nitpicking the car). Then I step aside and work my way down the list: axle, front-0 axle rear (dirty & pitting) 2pts and so on.

When I was at Roanoke I get stuck doing engines. Before judging I read over the engine section in the manual for the dates on things and also read over the list on the judging sheet a couple of times so I was familiar with it.

[ex98thdrill]

The chassis is easy, it is the small stuff with exterior trim, engine stuff, and interior.

[Terry Bond]

Im impressed - everyone is concerned about doing the right thing and thats a big part of judging in my book! I felt obligated to address the '12 T issue anyway. If you'd ever attended one of my CJE's on Model T Fords you would have received the info on the "Fore Doors" that have been discussed. We're trying.

Terry

[ex98thdrill]

Well Terry, when we've taken cars to the AGNM and won, I want to make sure that I judge things in the same manner that I want our cars judged. I don't want to wrongfully deduct on something that is right, nor do I want to see something given that isn't deserved.

There are certain points in the judging process that are better understood when you've done a restoration yourself. I know I have harped in the past about online CJE's, and my reason is to expand the pool of availability to obtain knowledge. Saturday I took a CJE on tires. It was a good CJE, but when I've done the chassis CJE on an annual basis, I don't feel the need to do mid 50's Chevies, Mustangs, and late 60's Mopars. At this point in my tenure as a judge, I don't see any point in taking the CJE class for team captain. I think before I get to that point, I need to learn how to master the CJE's that pertain to basic judging. I'm a firm believer that you need to be a good judge before you can even think of being a Team Captain.

[rgshafto]

Wow, go away for 10 days and lots of things happen. Interesting reading all your posts. Thanks for the feedback/information. Not sure I will go the judging route myself, but find it an interesting subject.