What is the correct color of the plastic washer jar?

[Guest Brianziggy64]

Ok guys this ought to stir a little debate out there. I have an 89,000 mile 64 GTO with Tripower and a 4 speed. When I bought the car it had a "white" washer jar. I've been around different shows and judges and found different opinions on this subject. Some insist that it came from the factory with a "black" washer jar. I'ver won gold awards at both the GTOAA and the POCI Nationals. I was also awarded a junior award at the POCI. I am now going to attend a AACA National meet and I don't want to lose points on something so easy to fix.

I have seen alot of GTO's from all around the country over the last ten years. This is an ongoing debate that I think people are losing points over this issue. Here's my take on it. I know for a fact that GTO's made in different plants did different things on the assembly line. Such as I've seen body color overspray on the top of the firewall on GTO's made in Detroit and Kansas plants, but not on the cars made in Freemont Ca. The fan pulleys on the Kansas cars were gold irridated not black like most other plants. Some plants painted them engine color blue. Some firewalls were glossier than others depending on where they came from.

So I think that mine did come with a white washer jar and not a black one. We know that the quality standard was not what it should have been on the assembly line. We have all heard of some weird stuff comming off the line as "factory". My point here is that I think judging should take into account some of these small "oddities" and not be set in their ways as one thing fits all. One thing doesn't fit all, they did things different at all plants at one time or another.

So my question is: Which washer jar is correct by the AACA standard on a 1964 GTO? Black or White????? Thanks for your opinions!

[1937hd45]

And some people wonder why I walk past post 1941 cars so fast.

[nearchoclatetown]

Ease up there 37, these things are important. Could this be a "early-late" issue or a differant supplier issue?? Are there good GTO sites with true documentation, like the early Camaro sites? At the risk of getting hornschwagled, I doubt it would make a differance in AACA.

[1937hd45]

Doug, Back in the day I think most GTO guys were wondering why a Ford product beat them not what the color their water bottle was.

[Guest Brianziggy64]

If you have nothing positive to add here don't post! I thought most car guys here were of the same creed , I guess not. Stick to your pre war cars if that your passion and we'll be fine, everyone is not like you. I do not disrespect other car club members simply because they are not into GTO's. There are other interest out there. This was a serious question that I needed an answer to before I show my car at an AACA National meet this summer. It may trivial to you but not to me and maybe others who do read these posts to get valuable information. In case you have forgotten that's what these boards are for , to exchange information to make our cars better and "correct".

Anybody else who has useful info please respond. Thank You!

[nearchoclatetown]

BZ64, don't take it personally, those old guys don't know the value of a good muscle car. As I said, could it be a early-late thing. A friend has a '64 Lemans, I can check when his car was made and color. Do you know your born-on date?

[Jay Wolf]

Look in any factory brochures that show the hood open, that would be acceptable to any AACA judge.

Check and see if there are any registered as HPOF. If so Contact the owner and find out what color it has. That is one of the advantages of having HPOF.

[real61ss]

Brian,

I don't know about a 64 but I restored a 65 GTO a few years ago and it got a Jr at the National meet in Carlisle than a Sr. at Hershey in 2003 with a black washer bottle. The original one was black (or at least it sure looked original) so I replaced it with another black one. No one in AACA questioned it.

The big question (in my mind)concerning my car was the color of the wheels, the car originally came with the full wire wheel covers and the original wheels were painted low gloss black. I changed to the little "dog dish" caps and some said the wheels should still be black, others said they should be body color which was Ivory. I first painted them black then changed them to ivory. It was never questioned at the AACA National Meets. I really think black was correct but they just didn't look right black.

Good luck with it which ever one you choose.

Tommy

[Shop Rat]

You might want to check with the AACA Library and they probably have the very information that you are looking for. There is a cost for copies but I don't think it is anything outrageous. And, you can use it as your documentation when you show the car that you have the correct bottle.

[nearchoclatetown]

BZ64, I looked at my neighbor's '64 Lemans and his is a June '64 car with a white "BOTTLE", not bag. The bottle is just like my '67 Camaro, I never seen a black one. It is located in the left front corner probably were your battery is. His is a sick cylinder so battery is on right side. But I still doubt AACA cares!!

[real61ss]

Brian,

I don't know if you have the Pontiac GTO Restoration Guide but if so, look on page 404. It says that the washer jars were opaque white in 64 and 65. According to this book, only the 66 came with either black or white jars. I'm sure that AACA would accept the book as documention.

[Ron Green]

I went through this same issue a few years back on my 67 GTO.

Sorry to see some make light of a important item and a excellent question. I did a lot of research via pictures, calling junkyards and looking at friends GTO's in the area, etc. White / opaque would be the correct answer from my findings.

[Guest Brianziggy64]

Thank You to all that have responded with useful information! I have requested a National officer contact some of the GTO judges to have them give their input on this question. Stay tuned for their responses I hope.

Brian

[Terry Bond]

Dittos on Tommy and Ron's posts. Im looking at a June 1964 issue of Car Life magazine right now that has a test report on the 64 GTO. It shows the engine compartment and a white opaque washer container. The car was brand new and was in their hands for a 2000 mile test. Im not sure factory literature would show that detail. Ive got a couple of 64 catalogs and the best we can find is an artist rendition of the tri-power 389 all by itself.

As far as judging that item I can tell you that not too many judges in AACA would know that level of detail on your specific car. The washer fluid jar isn't even a specific item on the judging sheet While there may be some uncertainty about it the rule of thumb in judging is "if you are not sure, don't deduct." So, chances of you loosing a point are remote. Im glad to see you are taking the right approach though and doing your own research and making sure you are correct.

Oh-almost forgot to mention, my 67 GTO lives quite happily next to my 1914 Model T, so brass and muscle can certainly co-exist.

Are you going to be attending the National/Grand National in Colorado?

Terry

[Guest Brianziggy64]

Thanks for the input and info! I think I have almost concluded that the opaque white washer jar is correct.

Yes I will be at the AACA meet in Denver at the end of July. This will be my first experience with the AACA club car show. I just found out about the club in December and I joined right away! This is the kind of car club I've wanted to join for a long time.

By the way, are you a GTO judge for AACA?

Yes I do agree that all car lovers can and should co-exist to better the hobby and preserve its history for others to enjoy. I hate to see responses such as those above. Those type of comments tend to only divide us. I for one love all types of cars and all the different years. It would be boring to me to just look at one era of cars at a car show. There's so much variety at these types of shows and so much for me to learn and to teach my two boys. This is what I love about the AACA.

Thanks again! Coming to Denver for the meet?

[Terry Bond]

We're glad to have you as a member!

Yes-will be there. Probably will be judging HPOF at the meet-not sure about what I'll judge at the AGN but I'll go wherever they need me. I'll be looking for you and the GTO there.

Terry

[Amphicar BUYER]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">We're glad to have you as a member!

Yes-will be there. Probably will be judging HPOF at the meet-not sure about what I'll judge at the AGN but I'll go wherever they need me. I'll be looking for you and the GTO there.</div></div>

The number of responses show how important the details like washer jar color is. I want my car to be correct in every way I can.

I'll have my '63 Amphicar there (Denver) too going for the HPOF. This will be my 1s judged (by a real judge) event. Is there a dress code or anything I should know about for the event?

"Excellence is in the details. Give attention to the details and excellence will come." (Perry Paxton)

[Ron Green]

John, no dress codes. At the AACA events you see people dressed in suits to casual wear at the awards dinner. Anything goes typically on show day. Go and relax, you will have a good time and meet a lot of interesting car people.

Correctly judging a Amphicar would prove to be difficult so I'm told. Just not a lot of them appear at the meets. I have been asked why I don't have mine judged. I tell them the truth that the color and interior are not correct and some state no one would ever know, as everything appears to be perfect. Except for me I tell them, it would not be right. Make us proud as I know yours is correct as you have heartburn having to drill a non-factory hole.

Sorry to see you will not be attending Celina. You will be missed by all.

[Shop Rat]

At the show the captain is supposed to greet you before they start judging your car. That is the time to let the captain know that you have documentation available if they need to see it and where you will be seated/standing.

Then step away from the car and let them do their job. Hovering will not help. Don't get nervous if you see judges making marks on the sheet. It might be a deduction but some judges cross out blocks where they do not take deductions to make sure there are no errors and you could mistake that for a deduction being taken.

Make SURE you have the proper, fully charged fire extinguisher with the car. It is usually put in the trunk, in the passenger side front floorboard or against on of the front tires. The choice is yours.

A special note. There must be an extinguisher for each car being shown. Not just one for however many each person brought.

Relax, have fun and make some new friends.

[Guest imported_jmarsicano]

Brian-

Check out http://forums.performanceyears.com/6/ubb.x

There you will find all of the pontiac muscle car info you will ever need. They have helped me a great deal.

I have a 71 pontiac, and it has a white washer bottle. And you are correct, pontiac made lots of mid year changes, the Zazerine book is a great reference.

Joe

[Terry Bond]

Brian-what a pleasure it was to meet with you, your wife, and the GTO at the Northglenn meet! Congrats again on your 1st!!! The car is absoutely fantastic and I hope you will continue to get it out to some other AACA events.

All rise for the anthem - "Little GTO, you're really lookin fine..."

Best wishes,

Terry