turn signal law?

[Joe Werner]

is there a law saying u need to have turn signals on a car that didnt orginally have turn signal? if not is there a law saying u have to use hand signals?

[Dave@Moon]

Although I've never seen it I've been told several times that this law does exist in Pennsylvania. I'm sure if it exists in a given state it's not one that is heavily enforced or known to most patrol officers.

[Amphicar BUYER]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">is there a law saying u need to have turn signals on a car that didnt orginally have turn signal? if not is there a law saying u have to use hand signals? </div></div>

They do not and can not make you retroactivly add any equipment that was not required by law at the time of manufacture. We would all have seatbelts, safety glass, 2 tail lights, turn signals, ABS brakes, air bags etc. if they could do that.

[Guest sixpack2639]

I know the original question was about turn signals but since they were also brought up here is what SC law says about signals, stop lamps, and seat belts...

"SECTION 56-5-2180. Signals shall be given by hand and arm or signal lamps. [sC ST SEC 56-5-2180]

(a) Any stop or turn signal when required herein shall be given either by means of the hand and arm or by signal lamps except as otherwise provided in subsection (.

( Any motor vehicle in use on a highway shall be equipped with, and required signal shall be given by, signal lamps when the distance from the center of the top of the steering post to the left outside limit of the body, cab or load of such motor vehicle exceeds twenty-four inches or when the distance from the center of the top of the steering post to the rear limit of the body or load thereof exceeds fourteen feet. The latter measurement shall apply to any single vehicle or to any combination of vehicles."

This basically tells me that if you can't reach out the window to use hand signals the vehicle must be equiped with them.

"SECTION 56-5-4560. Stop lamps required on motor vehicles. [sC ST SEC 56-5-4560]

From and after July 1, 1949 it shall be unlawful for any person to sell any new motor vehicle, including any motorcycle or motor-driven cycle, in this State or for any person to drive such vehicle on the highways unless it is equipped with a stop lamp meeting the requirements of § 56-5-4730."

I would gather from the way this is written that after July 1, 1949 stop lamps were standard equipment on all motor vehicles and therefore must have them. Prior to July 1, 1949 they do not have to have stop lamps.

"SECTION 56-5-6530. Exceptions to seat belt laws. [sC ST SEC 56-5-6530]

The provisions of this article do not apply to:

(1) a driver or occupant who possesses a written verification from a physician that he is unable to wear a safety belt for physical or medical reasons;

(2) medical or rescue personnel attending to injured or sick individuals in an emergency vehicle when operating in an emergency situation as well as the injured or sick individuals;

(3) school, church, or day care buses;

(4) public transportation vehicles except taxis;

(5) occupants of vehicles in parades;

(6) United States mail carriers;

(7) an occupant for which no safety belt is available because all belts are being used by other occupants;

(8) a driver or occupant frequently stopping or leaving a motor vehicle for pick up or delivery purposes;

(9) occupants of the back seat of a motor vehicle unless the vehicle is equipped with a shoulder harness in addition to the lap belt;

(10) children under six years of age who must be properly restrained as provided by Article 47, Chapter 5 of Title 56.

(11) a driver or occupants in a vehicle not originally equipped with safety belts."

The only one of these exceptions that directly applies to our antique cars is # 11 as I see it.

[Guest De Soto Frank]

Best to check the motor vehicle code of the state in which you reside...

Most have theirs on-line.

As far as my personal experience goes (MD and PA), a vehicle must have any and all safety equipment (turnsignals, stop lights, saftey belts, four-way flashers) that were on it when it left the factory, and said equipment must be in working order.

However, that does not mean you will not necessarily go un-questioned by local law enforcement who are too young to know any different; in 1985, when I was driving my Grandad's 1954 Chevy pick-up (all-stock), I was pulled over by a county cop and given a written warning because my truck did not have a stop & tail lamp on the passenger side. He did not want to hear my valid explanation that the truck never had a passenger-side stop & tail lamp; he went on to point out what he felt were other "Deficiencies" in the vehicle, and that if he wanted to "he could pull it off the road right then and there, and it would probably never be legal again"...

Even though I was only 18, I had enough sense to realize that I was in a losing battle with this policeman, and bit my tongue ,took my written warning, and went along my way.

Most state vehicle codes require a driver to "signal intention to turn", so if your ride doesn't have turn signals, that means you must give a hand signal (though I have to wonder how many motorists under the age of 60 have any idea what hand signals (related to turns) mean these days...).

What may be of greater importance is what your insurance carrier requires your vehicle to have, in terms of safety equipment...

Then there's the issue of kids in car seats...kiddos love to go for rides in old cars, but many states now have safety-seat laws, which (I would think) trump any grandfathering about what safety equipment your car did or did not have at time of manufacture...

So much to think about these days...

[Dave@Moon]

When I posted I didn't think that the original inquiry was about retrofitting. I was referring to the use of hand signals, which must be done if the car is not equipped with electrical signals (or brake lights for that matter). Sorry for any confusion!

[Guest De Soto Frank]

I think it was a two-part question regarding both, wasn't it ?

(At any rate, it's best to check out the law of your particular land...)

Some states limit what kind of tags they will issue a vehicle, based on how it is equipped. When I was hot & heavy to get a Model T the other year, I discovered that for a car to wear a regular PA plate, it must have "service brakes acting on all four wheels"...which rules-out a stock Model T, plus many other per-1930 cars...

I don't know if abscence of turn signals would limit someone to Historic Tag only in some states...

Today's vintage ride (1960 Chrysler) has turn signals, which I use, but I still found myself using some hand signals as I was driving to work today...mostly the "thumb-on-nose" variety...

( I find it amazing that you can be clipping along at 75 mph or more, and STILL be in someone else's way... Some folks were following so closely, that I was worried "they'd put an eye out" on one of Virgil Exner's Flite-Sweep tail fins ! )

[Guest rbl2]

Some years back I was pulled over in my '46 Plymouth coupe. The state trooper was young and in a bad mood for reasons unknown to me.

He questioned me about turn signals and safety belts.

I informed him they weren't required. He said they were and that I'd had more than enough time to retrofit them.

I, nicely mind you, told him I wasn't going to do that.

He threatened me with tickets and I told him to start writing. He said something about me having a bad attitude. I said no, I just wanted to share a good laugh with the judge and inform his supervisor about getting a ticket because he didn't know his job.

I got a warning and that was it.

[Terry Bond]

Great story-good info. The advice to check the laws in your own state is solid in fact I recommend going one better and printing a copy and carrying it with you. Our region publishes registration/licensure/usage laws once per year in our club newsletter and encourages people to copy it and carry in their vehicles for just such occasions. Many regions/chapters also have links on their websites to state vehicle codes.

Only trouble with hand signals is nobody knows what they mean today. I use them all the time when riding in my 14 T but anytime I stick my hand out people just wave back or give me a "thumbs up" (at least I think it's a thumb?)

Terry

[Guest De Soto Frank]

Terry,

I'm not sure they even know what the "five-fingered salute "(w/ thumb on nose) means anymore....

(Didn't J.C. Whitney used to sell radiator mascots called the "Jester" with above-mentioned greeting?)

[Guest tin knocker]

I havn't checked turn signal laws recently but it appears that in Wisconsin if you are using a cell phone you are not required to use your turn signals.

Rollie