Younger generation outlook on AACA?

[CTW]

I guess you can say this is a follow up to a previous thread about getting younger new members which I can't find at the moment..

I was talking to my son this afternoon for quite some time on the phone. We got to talking about AACA. I mentioned Philly to him and if he wanted to go with me. He'll go as long as it doesn't interfere with his job - however - he'll only go to go with me - as he went to club events with his grandfather.

His comments about AACA was "it's a bunch of old men"

He also told me the real reson for not wanting to restore the 1930 cadillac is because it doesn't look "flashy" or drive fast. Fair enough.

He doesn't have a lack of interest in the auto hobby.. he goes to local cruise ins, he's always down englishtown, NJ where something about cars is always hgappening and he's a mechanic 9-5. However, his impression of AACA doesn't intrique him enough to get interested in AACA as a club & the events.

I should have asked him what would interest him. Whatever it is - flashy & fast should be part of it I think he speaks for a big majority as I read many other auto related message boards with users from 14 yrs old to 40+ yrs old. Fast & flashy is the theme with a little nitrous & some airbrushing.

my random babble for Sunday night

[DizzyDale]

Dear Clair,Ready for some more babble,here goes.Been down the go fast road,something changes and you get interested in the old stuff.Can not put my finger on it but i know i can put my finger on the money part.No matter what you are trying to make AS IT WAS DELIVERED TO THE DEALER it takes a lot of dough.Chrome,bodywork,interior do not know ANYBODY that can do it all by themselves,i did not get interested till i was 40 and it still takes alot of what i make and ALL my spare time to get the job done.Just a few thoughts.diz

[29 Chandler]

I hope we are not like that. I am 35 and currently working on a 1929 Chandler that is neither flashy or fast. I have been in AACA for three years now, really only to get the magazine so far. The biggest advantage I see for the club is as a conduit to pass information about these old cars. They should remain part of our culture and not merely museum pieces. With the support and help of the older members I have met I will return our car to road status.

I'll agree there are a lot of the younger generation that prefer fast and flashy, but I think that is to a great degree a result of what they are exposed to in our culture. Those that wish to look beyond the norm will find a wealth of interesting vehicles to collect and enjoy.

[DizzyDale]

Dear Chris,Tell me the part about your Mustang being a 68 1/2 fastback with a 428 Cobra jet and a 4 speed.diz

[CTW]

Diz! I love babble - I'm the queen of babble hehe.

The almighty dollar I'm sure is part of the reason for many-- even for those in their 30's & 40's with families.

My son did mention time as a factor. he's been working 60hrs a week.

I'm self employed working from home & spare time isn't always easy find. Yet, I can walk out in the garage anytime I want. I've been spending alot of time in the garage recently taking advantage of nice weather - then I wind up sitting in my office odd hrs in the evening. Works for me - cause I'm having fun! I don't envy the ones who are out of the house 8-10hrs a day and then still want to enjoy the hobby.

When I was in my teens the 1904 olds was cool but it was cool to be my fathers car. At the time I preferred racing around with my friends plymouth satellite - or my brother inlaws chevelle.

For the past 15yrs or so I've slowed down & my interests have changed. I enjoy antique anything - especially tools. I've always been interested in cars & the history.

So I can understand not being able to pinpoint how/what happens when one becomes interested in antique cars.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Dear Clair,Ready for some more babble,here goes.Been down the go fast road,something changes and you get interested in the old stuff.Can not put my finger on it but i know i can put my finger on the money part.No matter what you are trying to make AS IT WAS DELIVERED TO THE DEALER it takes a lot of dough.Chrome,bodywork,interior do not know ANYBODY that can do it all by themselves,i did not get interested till i was 40 and it still takes alot of what i make and ALL my spare time to get the job done.Just a few thoughts.diz </div></div>

[29 Chandler]

Hey Diz you were'nt supposed to bring that up!

Actually the '68 Mustang was my first car. A deluxe coupe w/ a 289 2 barrel and freeway gears. But after going to so many Mustang shows I have moved on to older cars with more distinction.

And no, the Mustang is not for sale! I'll never part with my first car, too many memories.

[Dave@Moon]

I think for a lot of younger people (I'm 45, so it's mainly an external observation by now) <span style="font-style: italic">"fast and flashy"</span> can be translated to mean <span style="font-style: italic">"moves with me in it"</span>. The guy who goes to see and be seen in the street rods and muscle cars at Englishtown is going to see collector cars that are and should be <span style="font-weight: bold">driven</span>. I'm sure it is his impression that the 1930 Cadillac's only viable future existence is as a trailer queen, as most younger people would assume.

Otherwise I fail to see how a 1930 Caddy could be <span style="font-style: italic">anything but</span> "flashy". Even in sedan form, they shine like the sun next to 1958 Buicks!

I've been saying this for years on the forum now, but it's still true. Most young people (even those in the hobby) who don't have 6 days plus $130/night to spend on some tour or at Hershey do not "see" the AACA at all, let alone see it as an active organization. Now if the AACA (on a local basis) spent one day a year parading down this young person's street where the cars could be seen,...

...now that's an organization that'll make an impression!

[Dave@Moon]

By the way, for the younger people who read this thread: I've driven 14 second 1/4 mile runs (1970 Challenger) and I've ridden in near-12 second 1/4 mile runs (1968 tri-power Vette & 1993 Lotus Turbo). I've also busted the suspension and exhaust off of a heavy-duty off-road equipped Chevy Blazer, among many other SUV's I drove professionally (in a non-competative capacity, however).

I don't think any of them equated to the sustained excitement of riding in a 1920 Studebaker touring car or 1910 Model T. Given the choice, I'd definately re-take the old ride again!

[R W Burgess]

Claire, that son of yours needs to meet me. I'm not flashy and certainly not fast anymore after breaking my heel years ago, but I like fast cars. They don't have to be new either. I noticed some early 1900's cars at the Hershey flea market parked near Want1937hd's flea site and would like to get one in the future. Then at Rick Hoover's shop that same night, Rick related the neat tour he was on last year with the early cars and how much fun it was driving over hills backwards since that was the only way some of them could get over the hills. My kind of fun. It's a shame some of the grandkids couldn't have been on those tours. I can see me now in an early 1900's car wide open down the highway, wind blowing in my hair worrying about keeping the wheels on the beast. <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> A little paint for the flash, and at any speed, an open car certainly seems fast. Just one of the things I'm looking forward to in the future. <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Wayne

[Peter J.Heizmann]

Hi, Claire...

Appreciate your scenario with your son.

Very soon, you will see what Diz means, which, should peak the interest of your son. Diz was tame in describing his career as "been down the fast road".

Diz is one of the most interesting people I have met in a long time.

Regards, Peter J.

[R W Burgess]

Diz does a good job of holding up desperation signs too. <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I got proof. Wayne

[nearchoclatetown]

Claire, when you say fast and flashy, a little nitrous and some airbrushing, are you talking about cars or the women your son is chasing? Your son needs to take a ride in a car from the 20's. Most have no shock absorbers, stiffashell steering, and just about no brakes. 35 or 40 is plenty fast enough. I'd think that 30 Caddy would be pretty flashy too.

[rocketraider]

I have also been down the "fast and flashy" road, and some would say that with Oldsmobile Starfires, Toronados and Hursts around I'm into that scene even now, since all those can border on gaudy. I realised inadvertently that all the collector cars I own were the top-line cars for their era. It wasn't planned that way either.

A close friend who does Pontiacs was into TransAMs and GTOs in his younger years. Now, at 42, his tastes run toward 60s Grand Prix and Bonneville Broughams. He just bought a 66 Starfire (first advertised for sale on the Forums BTW). Again, flash and top line for their era.

Right now most under-30 car freaks tend toward imports or maybe Mustangs. Sporty looks and decent performance, and a lot of aftermarket support- at that age most can't stand a stock production car and want to personalise it. Though when they all make the same mods, it looks like "follow the herd" to me. Then the unmolested car looks different.

I try to take one of the cars out every weekend weather and work schedule permitting, and I make a point to stop and talk with young ones. Of course, if I drive thru a parking lot and stop to talk, the car is immediately surrounded and I'm bombarded with questions and sometimes a request for a ride. This is especially true if I'm on the Toronado- they cannot believe it is front wheel drive, and big-block V8 powered to boot.

Last Saturday night a 17 year old wanted a ride in the Toronado and while we were on the road, he confided that he can't stand imports or rap music, but it was go along with it or be alone. 60s-70s is his true interest for both cars and music. This works out good, since I now have another cruise night buddy and he's got an old car mentor- who coincidentally still understands 17 year olds. Hopefully my influence will get him into his own old car.

I treat them as adults unless they're absolutely screwing up, and I try to look out for them if they get themselves in a bind. They look at life differently than you and I, but they're full of ideas and talent. Not unlike we were at that age, eh? <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

[R W Burgess]

Good for you, Rocket. That's what I'm looking for in getting kids interested in our old cars. If they don't experience it, they can never know about it. W.

[Ron Green]

I just received some flyers from the various local suppliers that handle aftermarket accessories / parts, stock parts, etc. I thought to myself these are the same suppliers that I have been using for years to keep my 6 vehicles running. It was very clear as to which way the market is heading as 90% of everything in these flyers was geared towards sport compact vehicles such as the Honda, Nissen, Toyota, etc.

You will convert some of the younger generation over to the older stuff but my guess is the majority will continue to have a strong interest in the sport compact cars. These vehicles are also strongly supported by the manufactures who will keep their interest going as they are always developing newer and faster parts. At one of the sport compact national events this past summer they had to turn away over 2,400 cars as the show was full.

I don't see the old car hobby fading away by any means however I do envision it as being greatly reduced in the amount of people that are involved. We are getting older, dying off, dealing with sickness, etc. This past weekend I thought about all the effort it takes to work a full time job and the amount of money involved and having justed turned 50 it may be time to reduce the amount of vehicles. My 2 cents.

[RVAnderson]

I think you're largely correct. As the older AACA members (who own prewar cars because they grew up with them) pass on or are forced by age/health to the sidelines, they must be replaced by younger members with a strong interest IN and cognizance OF history. (As an aside: how many high school students HAVE that intense interest??) Otherwise, if the whippersnappers' interest is purely mechanical or leans strongly to rodding, the antiques won't survive either.

This isn't a judgement, just an observation.

[6219_Rules]

In my humble opinion, the only way to impress the young people with our love of these cars is to expose them by driving the car out where everyone can see it. Interest is something generated within, and outside of outright solicitation or advertising, the best way to stimulate interest is to show the car in normal, day to day, mundane applications.

You do not compete with the rice rockets, simply show off what the past has to offer and that anyone with the desire, the discipline and the commitment to spend the time and money necessary can achieve. Praise for a modified car is just as important as pushing originality.

No one likes to be dismissed or put off because their vision and hard work do not coincide with a righteous mission. Just my thoughts on the matter.

By the way, my son is 19 (Nov. 28th) and has had the car bug a while. He loves hot, muscle cars...in fact he just bought a 1970 Dodge Charger...but from a very early age I have instilled in him an appreciation for the Automobile...all automobiles. He had a 1960 Cadillac sedan he was restoring to original, which burned in a garage fire. And now he is in process of restoring a 1972 Cadillac FLeetwood Eldorado convertible. He loves cars of every era, and while he likes customs and hotrods, he is slowly starting to admire a fresh from the showroom restoration, or better, an untouch original. I never pushed him to this, I simply included him in my love of cars, from models when he was very young (I made them) to going to shows and dealers to just look. Instruction by example and practice rather than preaching. It worked. But he still isn't interested in clubs. That comes, I think, in general with age and experience.

[rocketraider]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You do not compete with the rice rockets</div></div>

Unless one has a big bad FWD car <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

At risk to my tires and wallet (since the city has a specific ordinance against spinning tires and exercises it, whereas the Commonwealth largely ignores it), I sometimes have to show the ricerockets how a FWD burnout is properly done...

It's always a hoot to watch the dropped jaws when the BFG smoke has cleared. <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

[Terry Bond]

Well stated Randall! I also think it's important not to be critical of youth just because they are interested in something that might not be exactly what "we" had in mind. Many of us ended up here because it was a natural extension of our interest in anything with wheels. Everyone participates according to their own level of interest, ability, finances, etc. Just step back, give them room to grow and if you show them how much fun this can be, then they'll come onboard eventually. My three year old grandson came over yesterday and brought his plastic screw-driver with him to help me work on something out in the barn. In fact the first words he ever spoke were "Model T" and once his feet reach the pedals, watch out!

Terry

[DizzyDale]

Dear Terry,I am SURE Momma and Dada were PLEASED with Model T coming out of juniors mouth first.Suprised they did not re-po him from his Grandpa.diz

[1937hd45]

Claire, I think I joined AACA in 1970,an Argo elerctric on the cover of my first issue of Antique Automobile, I was 19 years old, and everyone in the club was "an old guy". I'll be 53 next month and I'm still the kid in the local group. I've never spent any time wondering about younger people getting into the hobby. This is not something you can force on people. You either have a love for it or you don't. There are so many different clubs and publications now that the need for an umbrella car club is not neeed to have a good time. The late model stuff just doesn't mix with the pre WWII era vehicles. The only young car people I can relate to are building Rat Rods. I always cut them a deal on parts at a flea market,they are building low buck cars and having FUN.

[Guest]

My brother and I discuss this endlessly. I also have a brother-in-law and a couple of nephews and nieces who are also into old cars. None of us belongs to a club and our ages range from mid-thirties to early sixties. Between us we own eight old cars. Ok I did belong to a local club for one unsatifying year, that may have been more my fault than theirs.

One of the nephews has been painstakingly rebuilding a 66 Mustang for about 10 years.

The other nephew finally got one of his Dads cars a couple years ago. Prior to that he hadn't shown any interest in old cars, his mother owned a Model A Ford. Now he and his wife just bought another sixties car. Maybe actually getting to experience the fun of owning and driving an old car had something to do with that.

So I asked most of the gang why they didn't join a club. The first thing they all said was "Time". Next was that they didn't see the benefit.

I've known a couple of teenagers in the last few years whose idea of a good "first car" was a fifties or sixties "anything". Sure, they really wanted a flashy, powerful car, but anything old and servicable would do. They didn't come from "old car" families, so who knows where they got the bug.

I agree that encouraging a young persons interest in just about any car is a wise thing to do as far as extending the life of the hobby goes.

The young Sports Compact folks are often dropping a pile of money on their cars, so money isn't always the issue. A real disappoinying experience was a year or so ago at a open show where the local Sports Compact club had several cars on display. They were pretty much ignored by the "old car" crowd.

That's not good. Even if these are not ones personal choice for a hobby interest car, it costs nothing to walk over and chat about the cars for a few minutes. If we show interest in their cars, it's a lot more likely that they'll show some interest in ours.

Some of it may be more to do with the need for immediate gratification. My Mustang nephew is obviously not to concerned with that. But the nephew and niece that just bought a second car went for one that was nearly perfect already, they wanted to be able to buy and go right now.

While not every collector car may fit well on an AACA show field, they still have value and bring pride to their owners.

Perhaps we need to focus on wht we have in common more than our differences if we want to encourage vintage automotive enthusiasism let alone club memeberships.

[Team Hudson]

I have been involved with AACA through my family since I was a little girl. My parents involvement with the local/national events (shows and tours) gave me a wide variety of experiences with antique autos. This early appreciation of antique cars has kept me an active life member of AACA. I know for a fact that a twenty-something adult who works +50 hours a week can make time for a hobby they love. I do not own an antique myself. Too much $$$ for me. But I have access to friends and family who allow me the opportunity to enjoy their vehicles. I have had the pleasure to drive a range of vehicles from a 1911 Hudson (at the age of 17) which I cranked by myself to a 1970 Buick Skylark. Let me also say this if I had a choice of driving my parents'1970 Dodge Challenger 426 Hemi or the 1913 Buick I helped restore... the Buick would win hands down. I also judge at shows when I can and love to car hop on tours! I have also started as a volunteer to drive vehicles to AACA events. AACA is a wonderful way to meet new people no matter what age. In fact just this past weekend in Tallahassee I had a great conversation about early Buicks with someone my own age showing a 1924 Buick. At the same time I have many "older" friends through the AACA who I have known for +20 years! Anyone who complains about the AACA being a bunch of "old men" should really try to invite their younger friends to events and extend their social boundaries a bit and talk to the older members, not only do they know a lot about these historic vehicles but they have a lot of heart too!

PS-Converting a car to a flashy modified with a custom paint job and exhaust system can be expensive too.

[rocketraider]

My own take on club membership isn't so much being part of the crowd so to speak, but for parts and information support. That's why I have maintained membership in the Oldsmobile Club of America for 20 years, and also the NAOC, Toronado and Hurst clubs. I laid groundwork for the local OCA chapter because I wanted some Oldsmobile company at shows and cruises.

I'm a relative latecomer to AACA, joining in 1994 when the Toro became eligible. I've never participated in a large AACA event because the cars are simply not the quality I think they should be to compete there- they're nice, but they are driven frequently and are more survivors than anything. I've been to the Richmond Region and General Greene shows, and enjoyed the camaraderie I found at both. There are rarely any <span style="font-style: italic">Antique Automobile</span> parts leads or stories about my cars or even my automotive interests, but I learn from every issue I get, and I believe an AACA membership lends some credibility to any old car enthusiast's persona.

I'm as guilty as anyone about walking past cars that don't interest me at shows and cruises, though I try to talk to owners of cars that are obviously being ignored by everyone. The sport compact crowd can't or won't understand that their thumping bass and foul mouths aren't welcome at a general car show, and I've had to get after them more than once about cleaning up the area their cars were in- asked their local club president once if his mama still changed his diaper and wiped his ass, because it was obvious he'd never been taught to clean up after himself. Embarrassed him and he got a little mad over it for a while, but they got the message. 'Course, the fact that four of us blocked them in so they couldn't leave might have helped <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />.

[Guest imported_PackardV8]

The younger generation (under 35) do NOT seem to be interested in 'fast and flashy' but rather more interested in small and techno. I mean geez, what could be faster and flashier than a '30 Cadillac except maybe a 56 Packard Caribbean.

The younger set (including myself at 50) are more interested in a little bit of action rather than setting around in a lawn chair hoping for a dash plaque. I don't have the answer BUT, the lawn chair and dash plaque thing just doesn't get it. Recently there was a 'work meeting' at one of the regional Packard clubs involving a transmission removal process. This is something i really wanted to attend but was unable due to schedule conflict. We need to get some action with these cars we own. Some kind of meet where we can drive the cars and maybe put them up on a rack and look at them or something like that. Something that is more Demonstration oriented rather than just Display. I realize this idea is difficult. The younger set wants to move and shake NOT sit and plaque.

[D Binger]

You want action? AACA has a number of tours each year. These tours are not sitting around in your lawn chairs - - -they are a driving event with no judging. Try the chalange of driving a pre 1927 vehicle five hundred miles or more with out mechanical problems. The tours I have been on have had a number of the younger folks on them. Another thing, Team Hudson is probably one of the better navigators around.

Dan

[Guest imported_PWN]

I am 38 years old and have recently become an active "old car" buff. I have a 1992 Chandler Royal Dispatch (from my grandfathers collection) and am thinking of acquiring a 1910 Metz or possilby a 1907 Franklin Barrel hood as well. In the family we have a 1902 curved dash Olds and a 1928 Ford A Phaeton.

The problem is I really hate what cars have done to our society. They basically suck. They have destroyed our society (sprawl, pollution, etc.)

I love the old cars though and am having a hard time with the thought of collecting cars.

My daily drivers include Volkswagon TDI's that run on BioDiesel and vegetable oil www.biodiesel.org

Say NO to the devils tea and get rid of your gassers! Burn the Bean!!!!!!

My grandfather had some great cars and even owned the only Adams Farwell at one point, among many other significant cars.

I really hate the modern car industry and the conservative repulican PIGS that now "run" our country. The oil industry sucks and is repsonsible for our military presence in the oil producing nations, etc.

We need alternative fuels and to cut our dependance on foreign oil, continued groundwater contamination and huge bloated military budget required to "maintain" oil production and our dependance on oil.

Gas needs to reflect the TRUE cost per gallon (miltary and pollution costs) and needs to be at least 5$ per gallon.

Hard things to reconcile when collecting old cars.

My two cents worth.

Peter

[1937hd45]

PWN, Did your grandfater own the Frayer-Miller and Compound at one time?

[DizzyDale]

Dear PWN,You have recently become an old car buff?What exactly does that mean?Gramps LEFT you his pride and joy!BOY i would HATE to be forced into starting a car collection.Sounds like you despise ANYTHING with an internal combustion engine.As for your comment about cars sucking,COULDN't run if they didn't.In regards to burning the BEAN,i had some bean burritos last night,thought i smelled something BURNING.You speak of 5.00 a gallon gas and bean power,with these two on the horizon i might as well raise the white flag and turn my Zephyr into a planter.I cannot imagine where this country would be without Mr.Henry Ford.Now if you will excuse me i have to go to the stables to brush the polo ponies.diz

[Guest imported_PWN]

I have always LOVED the old cars. I have worked with my Grandfather on the cars since I was old enough to walk. The Chandler was sold by my Grandfather in 1922 new (the year he was married)in Wauchula Florida, and bought back by him in the 1950's for a ground up restoration. It was featured in a 1963 (June?) AA magazine.

Don't get me wrong - I was not forced into the "business" so to speak.

My Grandfather passed away in the early 1980's and my Grandmother kept the cars until she passed away and an uncle, despite objections by all, sold the entire collection. I was fortunate enought to buy the Chandler, as the fellow that bought the colletion realized the story, knew my Grandfather and was happy for me to keep the car in the family.

I just think that cars have really screwed the American society and environment. I am a Botanist/Plant Ecologist and value the environment, clean air and water, etc. more than anything. Cars and the demise of public transpo (trains, etc.) have really screwed us as far as sprawl, etc.

Cars known by me to have been in my Grandfathers collection at one time include. 1903 Ford A (oldest Ford in FL), several T's 1913,1914, 1907 Barrel Hooded Franklin roadster (although I do not think they had a roadster - just a cut down 7 passenger touring sedan, 1926 Franklin Boattail Speedster, 1914 Caddilac, 1910 Metz, early 1920 Rolls, 1905 Queen (what a beauty), and the car I own and my brother 2 cars (Ford Phaeton and 02 Olds).

We are currently going through LOTS of old pics etc. He owned several dealerships in Wauchula and sold Overland/Willys, and some other brands. He also owned many cars that he sold and traded.

The Adams Farwell was the one he let slip away (did pay for my moms, aunts and uncles college though). Rotary engine, rear drive, fuel injection, front and rear interchangeable controls. Really ahead of its time.

I have a bunch of old stuff related to the old car industry. A letter dated 1920, from the sales manager of the Chandler Co, urging my Grandfather to encourage local bankers to finance "pleasure" cars as they are no longer for pleasure but a requirement of the modern age (1920 heh heh). Even goes as far to say that cars supplement the health and well being of man. Great old letter on Chandler letter head.

I LOVE THE HISTORY and TECHNOLOGY of old cars - just feel that we have lost site of the forest for the trees with the modern SUV gas guzzlers, Ford Excursions, etc. I truly beleive that the car has contributed greatly to loss of quality of life as much as it has contributed to the gain in quality.

I believe Europeans have a better handle on modern transportation and "quality" of life. They also have a true appreciation of old cars and there history.

I believe that the true cost of GAS is important to pay for. As a result our military expansion to ensure foreign oil and pollution problems would be greatly reduced. NOT TO MENTION the fact that alternative fuel costs, when compared to the true cost of gas, would benefit greatly and become much more widely used.

That is why I drive VW TDI's that run on clean renewable and American produced BIODIESEL. Check out www.biodieselnow.com www.greasecar.com www.tdiclub.com

I can run my 5 passenger 1996 Passat station wagon on a 55 gallon drum of biodiesel for 1.5 months at over 40 mpg in the city. My wife drives a Jetta TDI and my daugher a 96 Passat sedan TDI. Diesels RULE.

OK what would you do as far as the brass era car. 07 Frankling "roadster", 1914 T, or 1910 air cooled friction drive Metz??????????????????????

The Chandler is a beaut - how do you post pics?

I am a member of the Chandler/Cleveland Club but not AACA, yet.

Peter

Not meaning to offend anyone - just two cent on WHY I have been hesitant to completely embrace the old gas guzzlers.

Anyone know what the first diesel passenger cars were? I could go that route, burn the biodiesel and be TRULY HAPPY and GREEN.

PS - My wife and I are REALLY looking forward to getting the Chandler in condition to TOUR. Afraid a connecting rod babbit is bad as well as water pump. My barn will be finished in weeks then the car can be diagnosed and fixed. We plan on aquireing 1920's period gear (clothing, etc.) and really doing it up. Some local Bed-n-Breafasts have expressed interest in using us to chaufer folks around in (wedding parties, anniversaries and the like) and we are really excited abouted getting the car on the road again. 1922 with less than 9,000 miles total. Hope the rod just needs some shims removed and not anything more serious.

I also badly need a Bosh American starter #901 and some other odds and ends - manual, etc.

NO TRAILER QUEEN HERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Dave@Moon]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> You want action? AACA has a number of tours each year. These tours are not sitting around in your lawn chairs - - -they are a driving event with no judging. Try the chalange of driving a pre 1927 vehicle five hundred miles or more with out mechanical problems. The tours I have been on have had a number of the younger folks on them. </div></div>

I think even the most jaded car fan would agree with Dan. My point was that the problem is that not everyone who has an afternnon to spend running around cones at the airpost parking lot or doing 1/4 mile runs has the time to drive 500 miles at 30 mph. If the AACA wants ti involve more poeple who still work 48 hours a week to keep their teenagers in in <span style="font-style: italic">Gecko Wear</span>, let alone the teenagers, they're going to HAVE to do that on the local level. Say 50 miles at a time.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The problem is I really hate what cars have done to our society. They basically suck. They have destroyed our society (sprawl, pollution, etc.) </div></div>

Peter,

I am literally the resident environmentalist here on the forum. And yes you're right, the <span style="font-style: italic">abuse</span> of our automotive inventions have become ruinous to the earth. Global warming <span style="font-style: italic">(Bush fans can plug their ears until the next sentence here, remember--SCIENCE DOESN'T EXIST!)</span> <span style="font-weight: bold">alone</span> has been conclusively proven to have resulted in the total loss/death of nearly 1/3 of the world's coral reefs <span style="font-weight: bold">so far!</span> And that's to say nothing of the incidence of lung disease in L.A., etc.

However, to ignore the benefits of transportation freedom that the invention of the car has bestowed on us (which you must do to say that it "destroyed our society") is foolish. I've yet to claw my way above the U.S. median household income, as in fact most have yet to do (hence the term). Never the less, I've seen the Hamptons, the redwoods, both oceans, Malibu and Deal (NJ) beaches, palmtrees, snow in July, Niagara and Yosemite Falls, and more than a few fancy ballrooms and mountain log cabins. If I were below the median income in a country without such open access to transportation, I'd only be able to see what the owners of the railroad companies wanted me to be able to see.

Also, time will heal the ignorance of society's current adoration of vehicular gluttony. Yesterday I got my first good look at the new 2004 Toyota Prius. Not much to look at for styling, but <span style="font-weight: bold">WOW!!!!</span> As soon as all the Trailblazer/Explorer fans realize that at 60 mpg it is <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">MORE</span></span> comfortable and <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-style: italic">BIGGER</span></span> inside than their 16 mpg compact station wagons, those wasteful busses will go away (even if they use the same technology to eventually squeeze 20-25 mpg out of SUVs--which is all that's technically possible for heavy, high rolling resistance trucks).

Just wait for the resale values to plummet.

Soon!

[Dynaflash8]

I know that Cummins put the first or one of the first display deisel engines into a 1935/6 Auburn automobile. This was in MoTor magazine somewhere around 1937/38. I at one time had a large collection of MoTor magazines which I donated to the AACA Library & Research Center. That was in 1985, so I'm answering your question on shakey memory. Explain one thing to me, please, that I've never understood? How is it that all of the black smoke coming from a deisel engine does not pollute? It must be true since the government doesn't worry over deisel engines as they do gasoline engines. But it all looks the same to my eyes.

The AACA Club here in Sebring (Florida) is making a strong effort to improve its size and activities and will be making a strong effort to be a fun club in this area. I can easily give you an AACA application and get you a local Region application if you are interested. Wachula is just over the hill (what hill ) from Sebring you know.

Try not to paint the old car with the same broad brush you use on the new cars. As for SUV's, they are bought for a lot of strange purposes I don't understand, but I do like them as a tow car for a big trailer. As for "trailer queen", there are some trailers used for short distances no doubt, but for long distances to National Meets and Tours, it is only the very occasional person who can do it without a trailer. We did meet a gentleman in Huntsville, AL on the Glidden Tour this year, driving a 1910 Rambler, that drove it, using back roads, all the way from Michigan or Indiana, but it's not an easy thing to do.

Thanks for your comments. Some of us with white hair (I resemble that remark )need to understand that it is a different world today and we have to look at all views.

[Guest imported_PWN]

As far as modern diesel technology goes - they black smoke you see is NOT IT.

The TDI's (Turbo Direct Injection) uses a technology vastly different that the old Mercedes diesels, offroad earth movers and semis.

The use of BIODIESEL (derived from waste vegetable oil, or virgin oils as a by product of - say the soy protein industry) reduces CO2 exhaust by nearly 100%, sulfur emissions by up to 80% (however there can be a slight change or no chance in N emissions). The dangerous unburned hydrocarbons (polycyclics, and many others) are reduced as well. Burning the BioD can reduce overal harmfull emissions by up to 80% in comparison to a GAS engine.

The intercooled turbos produce LOTS of driveable torque (no reduction in drivability) and get upwards of 40 mpg city and 50 highway. A biodiesel burning TDI is MUCH greener than a hybrid with better towing power, no toxic batteries and superior drivability.

For more info please check out www.tdiclub.com and www.biodiesel.org for FAQ's and loads of very cool info.

Downsides to BioD include availability, cost (approx 2$ per gallon) and ?????

I guess my trailer queen reference is to cars that NEVER are really driven (reference a fella on this forum that posted something about not wanting to unload a 1960 muscle car in a dirt field) and are scared to hit a grain of sand.

I understand the need to trailer distances very much.

Any input as to the 07 Franklin, 10 Metz or 14 T. I really would like to add one brass era car from my Grandfathers collection. I am leaning towards the Metz ($ and small size) and the fact that it appears the Franklin "roadster" may be a cut down passenger sedan.

OOOpppps do not want to derail the thread.

Younger folks I beleive are inhibited by "percieved" high cost, lack of knowledge and MOST IMPORTANTLY lack of exposure to the grand ole vehicles of a "better time".

Cheers,

Peter

PS - My Grandparents and Mom are from Wauchula (dad from Nocatee); however, I was born and raised and still reside in Gainesville. I am interested in the club for sure and am planning on joining.

[Dynaflash8]

AACA really has something for almost everybody; whether you like to tour, or display high quality show cars in competition, or show an old original, unmolested car, or a car done to a degree limited by the owners personal taste (we call that a "driver" which isn't to imply that you can't drive a high quality show car as I often have), or whether you just like to read books or stand around and kick tires with another old car person.

You say that some make the statement that they don't see what the value in joining a Club is? Well, think about it. Had there not been for an AACA back in the 1940s and 1950s and 1960s this link wouldn't be here; the hobby might never have progressed as it did over the last 35 years. Would parts have been saved, bought and resold at swap meets and flea markets? Would tires have become reavialble for the oldest cars and motorcycles? Almost nobody talked about old car collecting in 1956 except Bob Gottlieb in MOTOR TREND, and all he wrote about was Classic Cars. I never could own one, but I enjoyed his articles. His writing spurred my interest in old cars before I was 20. Most older people thought I was crazy for being interested in old cars when one of the most important reasons to work was to get a new car. Inexpensive auto liability insurance became available in 1964 or so as a result of AACA efforts. AACA has led the way, don't miss that fact. Marque Clubs have been spawned and have grown large, but there were few of them around when I joined AACA.

Well this isn't the end of time. If the old car hobby is to survive for many years to come; if reproductions parts will continue to be made as old stock dries up, there will have to be a strong demand. If we are never to be forced to park our old cars by legislation attacking their use, or by the demise of fuel to run them, we have to represent a strong force. Marque Clubs are fun and have their place, but at the same time there has to be a place where all old car lovers join together to make a force.

And so to all of you who are today in your upper 20s, 30s, 40s, the bottom line is that if you want to enjoy the old car hobby when you are 65 or 75, you need to become an active part of it now, and work and support it with your time and intelligence, so it will be here then like it is now. If you're a young adult with an interest in cars you are encouraged to join now. Even if you like Rallye wheels on your '55 Chevy, the day may come when you see the value in having two sets of wheels and tires as your car ages and becomes more significantly a historical object, then you might think of it today.

"Ya'all come, we'll be glad to see ya". And by the way, I've still got some "Flash" left in my "Dyna"

[Dynaflash8]

Send your address to me at Vabuickman@aol.com, and I will mail you an application, postage paid. Okay ?

[DizzyDale]

Dear PWN,Regarding the guy with the 60s muscle car,YOU have to understand how much cash and SWEAT equity one has invested in a project like that.TONS of both,PLEASE walk a mile in his shoes before blowing him off as some kind of nut case.WE really ALL can get along ,afterall WE all love old iron.diz

[R W Burgess]

The man says,"even if it had rallye wheels?" He's been picking on me for 3 years about my chrome wheels on the '56 Sedan Delivery, and now this. I'll give him credit though, Earl did tell me to get another set of stock wheels. Guess I'll have to for next year's Sentimental Tour. By the way Earl, All new Heavy Diesels now have a combination of catalytic converters, multible turbochargers, and computerized adjustable camshafts to meet the new smog laws that cam into effect in October of 2002. Prices went up about $4000.00 per truck. Isn't progress wonderful, or should I say expensive. Wayne

[jw24spec6]

Dave, global warming? I thought that was from the planet being over populated with irritating humans. As for the price of suvs coming down, i hope so id like to buy the wife an escalade for christmas. Please explain the proof of global warming that you will now post. jim

[Guest imported_PackardV8]

$5/gallon gasoline suits ME just fine. I get less than 16 mpg from a 56 Packard but i dont care!!! Maybe $5/gal gas would get alot of people off the roads so i can get out and enjoy something without standing in line behind soccer moms, rednecks, 3rd generation welfare recipients.... Might even get some of the work-a-day 9-to-5'ers out of my way too. I mean, its getting to the point to where even the local Iraqui owned restaurant (belive it or not its one of my favorites) is crowded at lunch time.

I dont care about pollution, i'm an air conditioned gypsy, just want to be able to go somewhere without all of the hassle.

[Team Hudson]

Dan, very well put! These cars are fun to drive even if it just around the neighborhood block or on a 5 day tour. I hope the other team members are doing well. I saw our fearless captain in Tallahassee.