64 Riviera Glove Box Lock

[atencioee]

Anyone have experience repairing one of these or good experience having them repaired by another? 

[RivNut]

Any competent locksmith should be able to fix you up.

[EmTee]

As long as the casting isn't broken I'd do a YouTube search.  There's probably a video out there.  I had a 'Tip-Toe' tub stopper come unscrewed and fly apart a couple years ago.  After 3 or 4 failed assembly attempts I finally gave up and did a Google search.  Sure enough - someone had a video on it!  Five minutes later I was back in business. 

[atencioee]

5 hours ago, EmTee said:

As long as the casting isn't broken I'd do a YouTube search.  There's probably a video out there.  I had a 'Tip-Toe' tub stopper come unscrewed and fly apart a couple years ago.  After 3 or 4 failed assembly attempts I finally gave up and did a Google search.  Sure enough - someone had a video on it!  Five minutes later I was back in business. 

I will look for it!

[atencioee]

It appears I might be missing a piece... I'm guessing there is something like a small cap or cover that goes on top of this outer ring on the door lock case where I'm pointing.

Also I can't seem to get the cylinder to lock in the case as it slides out. 

I may just have to have a locksmith do the job.

Edited November 28 by atencioee (see edit history)

[Frank DuVal]

There should be a bezel (escutcheon) as you noted. This is what keeps the cylinder in. See the small groove in the case in your picture at the latch area, that is where the extra keep in tumbler fits to keep the cylinder in the case. Pin rests against the bezel there.

 

Did a local locksmith that did not understand how to take it apart work on it first?  Is it supposed to look like this bezel, round?

 

https://www.opgi.com/keys-locks/interior-locks-hardware/1959-77-glove-box-lock/lock-set-glove-box-1963-64-gp-bonn-cat-riv-with-late-style-round-keys-KK26206.html

 

Note, this is a replacement lock that does NOT use a B-10, B-11 groove 15 B&S key.  It may be possible to buy this lock and replace the incorrect cylinder with your old cylinder to keep the same key. 

 

People, if a local locksmith ever says the bezel needs to come off a GM glove box lock of this era to get the cylinder out, take it back before they ruin it!😮

 

OOps, I just compared the picture of your lock to the OPGI lock. The latch portion is very different. Is this a glove box or console lock?

 

I can replace the tumblers in these cylinders to match your existing keys. 

[atencioee]

12 minutes ago, Frank DuVal said:

There should be a bezel (escutcheon) as you noted. This is what keeps the cylinder in. See the small groove in the case in your picture at the latch area, that is where the extra keep in tumbler fits to keep the cylinder in the case. Pin rests against the bezel there.

 

Did a local locksmith that did not understand how to take it apart work on it first?  Is it supposed to look like this bezel, round?

 

https://www.opgi.com/keys-locks/interior-locks-hardware/1959-77-glove-box-lock/lock-set-glove-box-1963-64-gp-bonn-cat-riv-with-late-style-round-keys-KK26206.html

 

Note, this is a replacement lock that does NOT use a B-10, B-11 groove 15 B&S key.  It may be possible to buy this lock and replace the incorrect cylinder with your old cylinder to keep the same key. 

 

People, if a local locksmith ever says the bezel needs to come off a GM glove box lock of this era to get the cylinder out, take it back before they ruin it!😮

 

OOps, I just compared the picture of your lock to the OPGI lock. The latch portion is very different. Is this a glove box or console lock?

 

I can replace the tumblers in these cylinders to match your existing keys. 

I've not yet had the opportunity to take it to a locksmith. The bezel, which you speak of, was already missing. This explains why I've had issues with it and why my cylinder had come out a long time ago. 

[gungeey]

PM me you can have this for 5 bucks

[atencioee]

11 hours ago, gungeey said:

PM me you can have this for 5 bucks

I wished I had seen this post sooner! I ordered an NOS one last night from Buick Farm.

[EmTee]

Take both the new and old ones to a locksmith to have it keyed to match the original.  (Or do it yourself...).

[1965rivgs]

 The bezel which surrounds the push button/lock cylinder is part of the dash fascia and not afixed to the lock assembly or have anything to do with retaining the lock cylinder.  If my memory serves me well, there is a "lock wafer" at the front of the cylinder that looks very similar to the tumblers and keeps the cylinder from coming out of the lock body/case. Depressing this spring loaded lock wafer will release the cylinder from the lock body.

 

Tom Mooney

Edited Saturday at 05:34 PM by 1965rivgs (see edit history)

[RivNut]

5 hours ago, EmTee said:

Take both the new and old ones to a locksmith to have it keyed to match the original.  (Or do it yourself...).

Just did that recently with two door lock cylinders. Easy peasy. 

[1965rivgs]

4 hours ago, RivNut said:

Just did that recently with two door lock cylinders. Easy peasy. 

  The glovebox cylinders cannot be as easily serviced as the door locks cylinders. There is no retainer for the tumblers in the glovebox cylinders, therefore the tumblers cannot be as easily arranged as in the other lock cylinders.

Tom

Edited Saturday at 05:31 PM by 1965rivgs (see edit history)

[1965rivgs]

4 hours ago, 1965rivgs said:

  If my memory serves me well there is a "lock wafer" at the front of the cylinder that looks very similar to the tumblers and keeps the cylinder from coming out of the lock body/case. Depressing this spring loaded lock wafer will release the cylinder from the lock body.

 

Tom Mooney

  I decided to break out a couple of glovebox lock assemblies to refresh my memory. In the photo below you will see a pic of the glovebox cylinder as it appears when removed from the lock case.

  The "lock wafer" at the front of the cylinder is what retains the cylinder in the case and prevents it from coming out of the lock assembly as the key is removed.

  The other 4 brass wafers are the tumblers which retract from the lock slot when the correct key is inserted and enables the cylinder to be turned and unlock the push button.

  If someone wants a key made for their lock/locks, wants to change their key blanks to the original style, or wants to eliminate a mismatched set of keys/locks, etc, I am capable of providing that service. Just send a message.

  I taught myself how to service the locks and bought the necessary tools decades ago. The price for said service varies depending on the individual`s needs/circumstances.

 

Tom Mooney

 

[atencioee]

13 hours ago, EmTee said:

Take both the new and old ones to a locksmith to have it keyed to match the original.  (Or do it yourself...).

I only needed the latch/case bc it was missing that piece... Thankfully, my cylinder is good and the key goes right in. Once that comes in, it should work...I hope, haha!

[Frank DuVal]

On 11/30/2024 at 9:51 AM, 1965rivgs said:

The bezel which surrounds the push button/lock cylinder is part of the dash fascia and not afixed to the lock assembly or have anything to do with retaining the lock cylinder. 

You are correct! This lock has the bezel on the lock that just holds the cylinder in and the decorative bezel/escutcheon is part of the dash. This un-decorative bezel is missing from Gene's lock.

 

On 11/30/2024 at 2:26 PM, 1965rivgs said:

The glovebox cylinders cannot be as easily serviced as the door locks cylinders. There is no retainer for the tumblers in the glovebox cylinders, therefore the tumblers cannot be as easily arranged as in the other lock cylinders.

The tumblers are held in place by retainers. I have rekeying kits with tumblers to interchange as needed to match new cylinders to existing key codes for glove boxes (I also have the h shaped for the doors, trunk and ignition 😉). 

Edited Monday at 01:08 AM by Frank DuVal (see edit history)

[1965rivgs]

On 12/2/2024 at 12:03 AM, Frank DuVal said:

You are correct! This lock has the bezel on the lock that just holds the cylinder in and the decorative bezel/escutcheon is part of the dash. This un-decorative bezel is missing from Gene's lock.

 

The tumblers are held in place by retainers. I have rekeying kits with tumblers to interchange as needed to match new cylinders to existing key codes for glove boxes (I also have the h shaped for the doors, trunk and ignition 😉). 

  I also have several re-pinning assortment kits and have done many, many pre `67 lock sets. So I am hands-on familiar with the typical process. But as manufactured, the original tumblers are held into the GLOVEBOX cylinder body by peening or distorting the cylinder body. There is no distinct retainer which is easily removable and replaced after arranging the tumblers as in the door lock cylinders.

  The replacement glovebox cylinders, both OEM and aftermarket, which are described as "uncoded", are manufactured with uncut ( no numerical designation) tumblers which are filed to correct size, thus creating "sized" tumblers, after the desired key is inserted. The reason the glovebox cylinders are supplied with universal tumblers, unlike the uncoded door lock cylinders which have no tumblers, is because, as I stated, the tumblers are held in place by a peening process obviously done with a special tool by the manufacturer and not easily replicated in the field. Again, the method of retention for the tumblers for the glovebox cylinder is not like the method of retention for the door lock cylinders.

  Is it possible to rearrange the tumblers in the glovebox cylinder? Yes, it is possible...after all, it was initially assembled...but the peening process would need to be reversed to remove and replace the tumblers and re-peened. There is not much material in that location of the glovebox lock cylinder to manipulate so it would be tricky to re-peen the lock cylinder body. A different tumbler retention method like epoxy, etc may need to be employed to retain the newly arranged tumblers.. As I stated above, the glovebox cylinders cannot be "as easily serviced" as the door locks cylinders.....but it is possible depending on one`s skill set.

  I`ll post a pic of the peened retaining method today if I can find the time.

 

Tom Mooney

 

P.S. Took a couple of pics of the glovebox lock cylinder. As seen in these pics the body of the lock cylinder is distorted by a press/special tool to provide a stop/retainer for the spring loaded tumblers. There is no distinct retainer which is easily serviceable/ R and R`ed as in other cylinders. 

Edited Tuesday at 03:48 PM by 1965rivgs (see edit history)

[EmTee]

5 hours ago, 1965rivgs said:

The replacement glovebox cylinders, both OEM and aftermarket, which are described as "uncoded", are manufactured with uncut ( no numerical designation) which are filed to correct size, this creating "sized" tumblers, after the desired key is inserted.

Not 'correct', but I suppose one could do likewise with a used replacement cylinder.  Insert your key and then file the pins so that it will allow the cylinder to turn.  The lock will just not be using all of the pins; but it's just the glovebox after all... 

[Turbinator]

On 11/28/2024 at 6:30 PM, atencioee said:

may just have to have a locksmith do the job.

Tom Mooney, rebuilds these locks. When you have more time than money your approach is right on. You could buy one those licks for about $20. Should you take another approach.

Turbinator

[atencioee]

4 hours ago, Turbinator said:

Tom Mooney, rebuilds these locks. When you have more time than money your approach is right on. You could buy one those licks for about $20. Should you take another approach.

Turbinator

I didn't know. Thank you for sharing that info. All I needed was that one part and I didn't have to pay too much for it... Also, it's an NOS part. 

[Turbinator]

7 hours ago, atencioee said:

I didn't know. Thank you for sharing that info. All I needed was that one part and I didn't have to pay too much for it... Also, it's an NOS part. 

Well, hopefully you have what you needed.
Folks use NOS as a guide. NOS is not an automotive term. NOS is an internet term that means new old stock in the box with tags. NOS in car parts is not specific. How many NOS. car parts have you received in the box with tags? Gene, these are my comments meant to be informational that may be of some help.

Turbinator

[atencioee]

8 hours ago, Turbinator said:

Well, hopefully you have what you needed.
Folks use NOS as a guide. NOS is not an automotive term. NOS is an internet term that means new old stock in the box with tags. NOS in car parts is not specific. How many NOS. car parts have you received in the box with tags? Gene, these are my comments meant to be informational that may be of some help.

Turbinator

Haha, I wasn't born yesterday! Thanks anyways!

[Chasander]

A lot of NOS parts found today were blems returned to dealers and sat on shelf’s in the parts department for years. 
I have several NOS parts on my cars and they all have blemishes. (Mostly only I can see). 

[Turbinator]

38 minutes ago, Chasander said:

Mostly only I can see). 

Observant buyers can separate the wheat from the chaff. I criticize the term NOS for lack of complete product description. NOS is like the word “ nice”. What does “nice” mean?
Using words to describe the condition of an item goes further to than an acronym. For instance, Reproduction 64 Riviera “ R” turbine emblem direct fit in two bar spinner. Wrapped in clear plastic bag to protect from scratches in handling.” So, its all in an effort to shine a light on NOS as a weak product description. Caveat Emptor 

Turbinator

[Pat Curran]

I have seen plenty of “NOS” over the years, some good, some bad.  If nothing else, when an item is listed as NOS, it deserves more scrutiny.

Sometimes there’s a reason why a part  is still in stock and sometimes it is because it didn’t pass muster when it was manufactured new.

[RivNut]

It was also explained that sometimes a new part was installed and the replaced part looked good so it was put back in the box and put back on the shelf.  

[Frank DuVal]

On 12/2/2024 at 10:52 AM, 1965rivgs said:

the tumblers are held in place by a peening process obviously done with a special tool by the manufacturer and not easily replicated in the field.

Yes, it takes some patience and no rush attitude to get the tumblers out of the glove box cylinder without damage to the pot metal. Then carefully peening to retain them in place. But I do it. Sure, if one took my recoded lock apart you could tell the B&S peen is not the same as mine. But functional it is.😉 Later B&S used small wires to retain the wafer tumblers in glove box locks. Still these wires are retained by peening the pot metal.

[Turbinator]

12 hours ago, Pat Curran said:

it is because it didn’t pass muster when it was manufactured new.

Pat, NOS acronym has 60 some abbreviations for other than new old stock. Nos.to some is an abbreviation for “numbers”.

Sure the acronym can mean exactly what you say, but it may not mean the part did not pass muster at time of manufacture. The use of NOS is not a hanging offense. There are other ways we can describe what it is we have for sale.

[EmTee]

Just don't confuse "NOS" with "NORS"... 

[RivNut]

15 hours ago, EmTee said:

Just don't confuse "NOS" with "NORS"... 

Just think of what all the R could stand for: Returned, recycled, reproduction, reused, replacement.  Any others?

[atencioee]

Haha, I don't see NOS (new old stock) as something so complicated! NOS parts are NOS parts... I'm not aware of any variations. NOS parts are simply an old original part that is still new... It's never been used. It's like being able to go back in time and get the original part... only difference between "back in time" and now, is that it's been on the shelf a much looonger time! It's certainly not something that has been broken, refurbished, etc. 

I've come across NOS parts... Not only for my Rivi, but also for the 1940s and 1950s Schwinn bicycles that I've restored. 

[Pat Curran]

8 hours ago, RivNut said:

Just think of what all the R could stand for: Returned, recycled, reproduction, reused, replacement.  Any others?

Rejected!😁