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Took delivery today on the 37 coupe...


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Pretty exciting, but with the car mostly apart, it's going to be a challenge. Was originally the Garnet Red(?), an almost burgundy color, with tan cord interior. As the owner told me, it only has part of the hot air heater assembly that came with it, so I'll have to decide whether or not I want to pony up the $$$ to put it back, or plug the hole. Any ideas where I can get more info on this?

For you numbers folks, it's body number HB 720 758, serial number H23612. The tranny and rear are original to the car as well.

I've been looking at the Authenticity manual, and it's fine for what it is, but I really need a body assembly / engine detailing source. Anyone know of any?

Finally, while I can tell where most of this stuff goes, I have bunches of little brackets, etc., that I have NO EARTHLY IDEA what their function is! Expect to see a LONG series of posts with pics, saying "What's this? How does this go together?", etc. etc. <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

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Dear Cecil,Try any of the dealers on the LZOC source page,many parts and information.I would think some of those L brackets hold some of those heater control knobs to the dash.You have just entered a new world,you just can not open a catalog ala Mustang and early Ford parts,these Lincoln parts must be hunted for,they are much more appreciated when you find em.diz <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

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I can't imagine tackling the task of reassembly without having been the one to take it apart, I did that on a 41 Ford once and nearly lost my mind. Still, what you probably need to get to begin the operation is a Lincoln Chassis Parts Catalogue that covers 36-48. It is not as inclusive and complete as one of a hundred Mustang books, but it does give you some pretty good drawings, parts numbers, etc. for almost everything and can serve as a general road map that will probably allow you to identify about 98% of the stuff. After that, who knows? You can probably guess and be right 99% of time. On the Garnet color, I have 37 paint chips and it is a 37 color as well. For 37 the Royal Maroon was very dark, while the Zephyr Garnet was almost a medium dark red. The factor lacquer # was 32169. It broke down as 70 parts Opex Deep Maroon, 93 parts Opex Crimson Red, 7 Open Bone Black and a touch of Opex Auto White. The maker of the paint was Sherwin-WIlliams. The Royal Moroon was 100 parts Deep Maroon with just a touch of Crimson Red. I have the paint numbers and the gauge readings for the four paint combinations that make up Zephyr Garnet if you need them.

Ace

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Thanks for the info, Ace. I spent tonight sorting through the interior pieces. For the most part, I was able to figure out where everything goes (and what wood pieces I'll have to reconstruct), but I figure I'll have to make a trip over to Cary, NC (about 20 miles) to see the 37 coupe used as a model for the ERTL 1:18 model car. Haven't called the owner yet, but he's a LZOC member, and when he hears what a mess I got myself into, how could he refuse? <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

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Hello... nice color guide site. I've seen and almost bought many of the color guides at auctions or flea markets. From memory I think there are at least 3 different ones... Ditzler, Sherwin Williams, etc. I wonder just how much they all vary.

What I'm really wondering is, is there a simple way to figure out the original color for a 37 Coupe?

From what I've heard, all the original build records for 36 and 37 were destroyed in a fire sometime in the 1970's.

I posted a picture of my coupe in an earlier thread, but basically I have some blue in the engine bay that might be either "Mercury Polychromatic" or "Zephyr Blue" but the car is almost virtually covered in every place with what appears to be a brushed on primer that was once perhaps red - but is now faded to a pickish color. Add to that 3 decades of surface rust showing through the primer and color - it's very hard to tell what is original. The car could also have obviously been repainted in the 40's, 50's etc a different color than original.

So is there a hidden paint code somewhere?

And I dont suppose anyone has an idea how popular each color was in the 30's.... and which color seems to be the most popular color now for restorers? I know everyone raves about the Maroon - and it is gorgeous, but I'm more concerned about historical accuracy and to try an I.D. my original color.

Thanks!

Jim Napiorkowski

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Jim,

I am fairly new to the LZ game myself, and I know that mine has been three different colors in its lifetime. I like the garnet it now wears, but it was non LZ green before that and I think it was what is called Mercury when it came from the factory. I think when the interior is pulled out I will find out more. Anyway, as a writer I have tried to dig up the numbers on popular paint choices, etc, and have been told that no one really knows. The editor of the club magazine told me that almost everything he sees nowadays is black and garnet, of that is just an observation, so those must be the most popular colors at this time. Unlike my 57 Ranchero and 65 Mustang, there are no codes anywhere that give colors and optional equipment information. It really becomes a guessing game. The good thing is that no one can frown at you painting it the color you would chosen then.

My other frustration is not being able to trace my 4-Door back to a date earlier than 1988. It was sold in California at that time and issued a Nebraska title. Yet as all California records of titles are kept only five years, then destroyed, I can't get it back beyond that. And as the California owner had a very common name -- Donald Wallace Smith, Stockton, CA -- it makes it hard to trace him too. Yet because it has no obvious signs of rust, I would assume that it was a western car throughout its driving years, but I can't find a thread that would prove that for me.

I would love to pictures of your car. If you get a chance, email me some at ace@acecollins.com

Ace

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Jim -

George Trickett from Lincoln Motorcar Supply in Vermont (802-948-2121) told me that, although the VIN records for 36-37 were lost in a fire, you can still get info on your car (options, where it was delivered, etc, and I'm assuming color too) by going to the Ford archives and searching under a ledger that lists *body numbers* until you find your car. You might give George a call and ask him about it -- and let us know what you find out.

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To Ace, Cecil and all other Zephyrists reading this:

I too once heard that although the build data was lost in the fire, the invoicing records of some sort (referenced according to the body number) still existed for 36's and 37's.

I would be more than happy to research your vehicle numbers for you when I go to do my own. I can only assume these are the archives maintained at the Henry Ford Museum in Dearborn. I will be there for next weeks meet, but given the traffic flow anticipated it might be better for me to return another day after the 100 year Ford celebrations have concluded - especially since I am located only 15min away from Dearborn, it's not much of a trip for me!

I have no problem helping other Zephyrists so long as the favor is returned to another club member who might someday help me. We should all remember our ultimate goal is to preserve each and every Zephyr that can still be located and resurrected. Each restoration to an extent should be a community effort.

I am sadened that with nearly every delivery of "The Way of the Zephyr" I read of the passing of a longtime, and much-loved club member. At only 30 years of age, I consider myself to be among the "next-generation" of Zephyrists - young with much to learn about these cars. And to an extent entrusted to carry on these fine cars legacy onto the next generation. I cringe everytime I see a Zephyr which has been "rodded-out" even to a mild extent such as the one currently offered for sale by Legendary Motor Car. It still puzzles me why some people place geater value on a car once it has been butchered. The value should lie in the time, effort and resources it took to obtain or reproduce the components it took to get the car back to it's original glory. That is true history. The rodding should be saved for the fiberglass copies!

Sorry to get a bit off topic there. But basically I hope we can all work together as a group to get these beautiful cars restored. And if my part is to assist my new friends with researching their body plate and VIN numbers, then broing on those VIN and body numbers!

As for the requested photos of my Zephyr, try this URL - the photo's are of the car just prior to my purchase 2 years ago at the previous owners residence in Washington state. Car is virtually in same condition now, just had new tires put on to assist with moving it around:

Jim's Zephyr pics

If the hyperlink doesn't work for whatever reason, just notify me via email I can try to get them uploaded (but at 56k dial-up, it's a pain!).

Good luck to all of you, I'll try to do some preliminary checking on exact office location of those records and try to schedule some time for a visit to the archives!

Speaking of records - I just happened to acquire off of Ebay a few months back an original sales invoice for a 37 Sedan from Kayser Motors in Wisconsin dated 6/14/37 for a Lincoln-Zephyr Four Door Sedan - Maroon "Motor # H-35.120". If by some miracle the current owner is reading this, please contact me - I have your original sales slip!

Jim Napiorkowski

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Jim -

I absolutely agree with everything you say. I'm 40, so slightly older than you, but we are both in the same boat in that we don't remember ever seeing Zephyrs on the road. So our interest is probably less one of personal nostalgia than the fact that they are beautiful, historically interesting cars that should be preserved.

I go back and forth on my opinion about rodding. All I can say is that I really enjoy the challenge of figuring out how cars used to be built and how much technology has changed. To me, the funky oil filler float on the Zephyr is far more interesting than any blown Chevy 350!

If you do go by Dearborn, I'll take you up on your offer (my body number is listed in the first message). Now I'll go look at your pics...

Oh man, does that ever look familiar. I've got a feeling you and I are going to be exchanging alot of pics and notes.

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I would love to have you research my old girl as well. I noted the pictures and what a job you have in front of you. I am almost fifty, I had only seen Zephyr in museums. I want to drive history so that others can see this car. I drive my 57 Ranchero a couple of times a week and in our local monthly cruise nights. I plan on doing the same to the LZ. These cars, along with the 36-37 Cords, were the ultimate in Art-Deco styling, years ahead of their time. Of cars that normal folks could afford, the LZ's were in a league of their own. Every line of the car is perfect. And of what character! Jim, email me at ace@acecollins.com and I will give you the information I have on my 37. Anything you need to see, I have already sent some pictures of certain parts to Cecil, just let me know. I can't wait to see yours on the road. History is to be shared. Hey, three weeks ago I drove mine to shop to have the engine pulled and redone and those three miles were simply incredible!

Ace Collins

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  • 11 months later...

Well my fellow Zephyrists, I've finally arranged for a day off work next week and I'm determined to swing by The Henry Ford archives on Monday.

So, I thought I'd resurrect this old posting and ask again if anyone would like me to check into their VIN's and I'll do the best I can to see what I can find.

My time will be limited, I expect I'll have only 4 hours to spend there Monday morning before a dental appointment, so I won't be able to research 50 cars, but I hope to do what I can.

I already have Cecil's numbers; Ace - I looked back through the old thread but didn't see yours. Let me know if you want me to look yours up too.

That goes for everyone else too. Please get your requests in soon - I'll do what I can first come first serve!

Looking forward to hearing from all of you,

Jim N.

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Jim,

Yes, yes, yes please! My Zephyr-engined Jensen (see latest TWOTZ) bears No.H47116 which was almost certainly a right hand drive car, but it may have been a spare engine, not actually fitted to a car and that's what I'd like to know if you get a chance, please.

Are these archives open to the public?

Thanks,

Mike Williams

(UK)

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As I understand it, yes the archives are open to the public - sort of a public library - only you can't check things out!

I am pretty sure they let you photocopy articles of interest, with most of the archives stored on microfiche or CD-ROM.

I've never been, I'll let you know more after my trip Monday (I live local to Dearborn, MI in nearby Romulus).

The problem is they are not staffed to do the research for you unless you inquire and are willing to pay a "research fee".

If anyone on this list has been to the archives before, I'd be interested in hearing how the process there works before I visit there Monday.

Jim N.

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Hey Jim -

I sent for copies of stuff last fall, and recieved the only surviving document they could find -- the production ledger listing my car for 3/1/37, with the only options being the heater and defroster. But if you do come across more by accident, let me know.

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The research department in Dearborn tries to help. I sent in my serial number, they were only able to tell me the key number and final assembly date. They felt bad and refunded my $15.00 fee. I'd think there has to be SOMETHING out there somewhere. Since my 36 was sold through Kruse in 1980, (one owner since, in Michigan) I suspect that going through Kruse will be a dead end.

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Guest imported_V12Bill

I was in Dearborn in l973 and I got information verbally on my l948 Lincoln. When I got back I sent them a letter with a small fee and received a copy of the build sheet. For Ford at that time a build sheet was a small form with pertinent data written in the blanks.

WhenI got my 48 convertible in l999 the fee was up to $l5.00.

I am now writing to get a copy of the build sheet on my newest Lincoln a 46 LC. the address for anyone who cares to get information is;

Ford Motor Company Archives

%Greenfield Village and Henry Ford Museum

Dearborn, MI 48121

Attn Archivist

Include a check for $l5.oo and a copy of the build sheet should arrive within two weeks.

Bill

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  • 2 weeks later...
Guest imported_V12Bill

NEW ADDRESS AND FEE FOR COPY OF BUILD SHEET.

Just had my request for a copy of the build sheet returned for wrong amount and wrong payee. The amount is now $20.00 and the payee should be The Henry Ford.

Slight change in address;

Benson Ford Research Center

Henry Ford Museum & Greenfield Village

PO Box l970

Dearborn, MI 48121-9843

Hope my previous information didn't hold you up.

Bill

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  • 1 month later...

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