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Pulled the head on my 27 today


Slawnski

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I am finally getting back to work on the 27 Buick Roadmaster. I have very low compression all cylinders.  A earlier scope found seeds in one so I knew there had been visitors. Anyway- pulled the head and found no cylinder had 2 good looking valves- one reason for the compression readings I had. My questions:

 

1) valve springs as shown on the tray are oriented exactly how they came off the head- some had the tighter coils of the springs up- some were down - in no particular order -not all intake were one way or exhaust one way just willy-nilly. What is the correct orientation?

 

2) What is the tolerance of the valve stems / valve guides? They all feel relatively tight with the exception of 1- but even that one could be borderline acceptable. 
 

I can grind seats and lap valves myself but if the valve guides are out of spec I’d just as soon take the head to a machine shop. 
 

I bought the car as a non runner and have begun the process of bringing this up to snuff mechanically. Been a bit since I’ve had the time to work on it- Thanks for any help/advice/suggestions- much appreciated. 

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From what I can tell it looks pretty fair.  The valve springs  are s'posed to go on with the tight coils to the head. My question is...  these originally had dual valve springs so am wondering if the springs are not original. . If they are the original outers they won't be strong enough by themselves.  Spring pressure is supposed to be 49 to 61 lbs closed, 120-136 open. 

Edited by Oldtech (see edit history)
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Dual valve springs? This could explain it if the valve springs aren’t strong enough the seats/ seal wouldn’t stand a chance. does anybody have photos of the dual valve springs?

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Usual way to check the valve guides is use a new, unworn valve stem and see if there is any sideways motion. Usual fix for worn guides is to knurl the guide or replace it with a new guide.

 

About the valve springs. The inners are 3 X 1 X 1 inch. Available here , this is a random site I found with a web search, no endorsement implied. https://bobsautomobilia.com/shop/engine1628937744/1924-27-master-inner-valve-spring-ivs-124/

 

Here is what they look like                                           

 

IVS-124.jpg.a4d0579e13e47af933cc7fa3cfcfa288.jpg

VS-142.jpg.9ba02b086336062361e5dcd9171a07b8.jpg

Outer 3 X 1 1/2 X 1 1/2

Edited by Rusty_OToole (see edit history)
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11 minutes ago, Slawnski said:

Oldtech: 2 at the valve keepers- 1 under a head bolt. 

Broken lock washers on old engines is standard equipment.  

 

5 minutes ago, Slawnski said:

Dual valve springs? This could explain it if the valve springs aren’t strong enough the seats/ seal wouldn’t stand a chance. does anybody have photos of the dual valve springs?

Exactly.  I don;t have a picture but they are just a smaller coil that fits inside the big spring. 

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Oh. Original post says Roadmaster so assumed Master. 27 is a standard series but they still have dual springs.  Made MANY miles in our 27-27 when a kid. Still have the remains. 

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10 minutes ago, Oldtech said:

Oh. Original post says Roadmaster so assumed Master. 27 is a standard series but they still have dual springs.  Made MANY miles in our 27-27 when a kid. Still have the remains. 

My mistake. My 39 is an 80 series Roadmaster. This 27 is a standard. 

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50 minutes ago, Slawnski said:

So dual springs are in order! Odd that they are not on this engine…. 

Being a lot of the springs were upside down I suspect someone threw this head together just to make it run. 

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From the 1927 Buick Standard book of parts, inner springs were added after engine number 1653067.  Very common to see broken lock washers in Buick engines.  Replace all of them regardless of condition.  Given the look of the thick oil on the removed parts, I would consider dropping the pan as well.  

 

IMG_0011.jpg.0a432c686aa56ecbb0441316d8ab72f4.jpgIMG_0012.jpg.fd4b64bf8b2b8842d52d9d0340b0d324.jpg 

 

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Learn something new every day. Thought they always had double springs.  It would appear though that the intake valves had a pin ? instead of a keeper to that number. 

Edited by Oldtech (see edit history)
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I do plan on dropping the pan- most likely will pull the engine to get it throughly cleaned and painted. Always starts with a simple task and ends up just going one more step… until the project is in pieces… better this way than just looking the other way any hoping things work out. 
 

The previous owner passed and his family parked all his cars ( stored inside a heated building) in a family members pasture so they could sell the house- bought this car and the 39 Roadmaster from that field 16 months later. It’s a shame it sat for over a year in the elements. 
 

a bit of hodge-podgery in some of the linkages and some things were certainly done just to keep the cars running. I was told this car was used up to the owners passing- driving the grandkids around the property. 
 

I’ll swap out all the washers and cotter pins, clean as much of the engine as I can inside and out, paint and reassemble. I’ll need to address some bad wood as well. I figure if it’s running and driving it’ll be inspiration enough to dive into the carpentry aspect of the rebuild. 
 

 

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