38' Buick Pedal Went Dead Car Won't Start

[TK3295]

I have been driving my 1938 Buick Special this summer and all has been well -- that was until today. With only 4 miles left of my drive, 25 miles total of just 30-40mph cruising, the gas pedal began to almost lose pressure and rapidly went dead. I was very confused as I was in third gear driving along and it was almost like it lost pressure. I had a few more "spurts" of power when easing the gas, but then there was nothing. The engine turned off in gear but the car was still coasting. I heard no bad transmission noises nevertheless I quickly put her in neutral coasting down the quiet road before pulling off. I immediately assumed the gas line failed; however, there were no visible leaks (at least from the outside nothing seemed awry with the pump either). The pedal felt less resistance when being pushed, but the arm that connects to the carb still moved. I was under the car for a bit, yet I couldn't track the problem. I tried to start her a handful of times, but the gas was not getting pushed in the car all that was heard was the "whirr" of the starter and no following engine roar. Luckily, I wasn't far from home and a tow place I know well helped me out and brought her back. Once off the bed, before pushing her in, I attempted one final start. It actually sputtered for a short while and sounded as though she tried to turn over then nothing. I assume this is from how the gas was pushed around because of the angle the car it had been on as we rolled it off the lift. (I was weary to keep trying though as I don't want to flood the car)

I can send photos in the near future. Unfortunately, as a college student, I don't always get the most time with her. I'm assuming this is a problem with either the fuel pump or the pedals connector to the carb. I honestly haven't an idea. Sorry for this long chunk of text -- I just haven't had any maintenance issues like this that I couldn't figure out so far.

Any ideas?

Thanks a million!

[37_Roadmaster_C]

Ok, I am having a bit of a hard time understanding exactly what you are saying. I will assume for right now that you are saying the pressure you have to apply to the gas pedal with your foot has gone way down. Now this seems strange in general as there is a return spring that causes the pedal pressure. Anyway, the first thing to check is the action of the throttle plate in the carburetor.  Get a friend to help. Now with the ignition OFF and the air cleaner removed, hold the choke plate open and look down the carb air horn. Look past the choke plate and you will see the throttle plate. While looking, have your friend slowly press the gas pedal to the floor. Confirm that the throttle plate rotated to full open. If it did not then you will have to trace back from the throttle shaft toward the pedal to find what is slipping. From your above description I am thinking the clamp assembly right at the carb may be loose. If the throttle plates rotate to full open with the test, then I do not know what to tell you as I am now not understanding what you were saying.

[MCHinson]

From your description, it is difficult to be sure what happened. When you try to start the car, what happens? Does the starter motor turn the engine over or not? If it does, please pull the air cleaner off of the engine and have someone pump the accelerator a couple of times while you look down into the carburetor throad. Do you see fuel squirting into the carburetor? If you have fuel and the starter turns the engine over, the problem is likely to be electrical. The number one suspect would probably be a failed condensor in the distributor. There are other possible sources of electical problems both inside the distributor and elsewhere.

 

If no fuel is being squirted into the carburetor, the mostly likely suspects would be an empty fuel tank, a clogged fuel line, a plugged fuel filter, a failed fuel pump, or a problem with the carburetor. 

 

Do you have a factory shop manual? You should be able to follow the troubleshooting and repair instructions in the manual as soon as the problem is diagnosed.

 

I would also suggest you consider joining the 36-38 Buick Club. https://3638buickclub.org/ The club has technical advisors who are happy to help club members with issues with their Straight 8 era Buicks. If you contact me via the contact the webmaster link on the club website, I will be happy to send you a free .pdf sample issue of the club newsletter. 

[Oldtech]

Follow MCHinsons advice. If it quit while driving down the road it could be a fuel pump or filter  problem but don't rule out spark.   If you can find someone that can help you diagnose the problem and understands point ignition that would be VERY helpful . Otherwise post your findings back here and we will try to help. 

[IFDPete]

When is the last time you changed your fuel filter?

[TK3295]

The car cranks but no sputter is heard its just the battery power turning the crank. I took off the air filter and checked down the carb and saw it squirted gas whenever I pushed the pedal. Would this would rule out the fuel pump? Im thinking this might be a spark issue now. Sorry for the unclear message before, im not great at explaining this.

[TK3295]

I do have the factory shop manual-- I just have to find it. (Shouldnt be hard.) Where do you think I should look in it?

[Oldtech]

 Check the section on troubleshooting the ignition system, if there is one. Yes, you must check for spark.  Pull the coil wire out of the center of the distributor and hold it, Preferably with insulated pliers, about 1/4 inch from grounded metal and have someone run the starter. You should get a regular, nice spark. If you do not the first things to check are 1. power at the + terminal of the coil. 2. points opening and closing properly and making contact. 3. Wires. not touching what they shouldn't and good connections where they should.  If nothing appears out of place , try replacing the condenser. They can cause bizarre issues.  

[MCHinson]

If you are getting fuel at the carburetor, I would check the distributor first. The most common electrical problem would be a failed condensor. Unless you see something else seriously amiss in the distributor, I would personally change out the condensor with a known good one before any further testing. (Some modern imported ones are bad out of the box when new.) If you don't have access to a known good one, I would suggest you buy one from NAPA Auto parts. Theirs are a bit more likely to be good than the imported ones typically sold by the Buick specific parts suppliers. Other than that, test for voltages using the troubleshooting information in the shop manual.

[EmTee]

Also check that the breaker plate in the distributor is grounded.

[TK3295]

So any old condenser would work from NAPA? Also, this may be a dumb question, but how would I go about checking if the breaker plate was grounded?

Thanks so much

[MCHinson]

11 hours ago, TK3295 said:

So any old condenser would work from NAPA? Also, this may be a dumb question, but how would I go about checking if the breaker plate was grounded?

Thanks so much

No, but NAPA sells two different ones that will fit a 1938 Buick Special.

 

https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/MPERR174SB  and https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/ECHRR174

 

Either should be OK, but if one of them is US made and the other is imported, I would buy the US made one. 

 

Do you have a volt-ohm meter? You will need one of those for troubleshooting the electrical system. You can use it to see if the breaker plate is grounded as well as the other testing that you will need to effectively troubleshoot the electrical system. 

[EmTee]

Or, get a test light and with the clip grounded probe the wire connected to the points.  With the points open (put a folded piece of paper or thin cardboard between the contacts) and ignition ON the light should be lit.

 

 

Edited Thursday at 10:40 AM by EmTee (see edit history)

[TK3295]

14 hours ago, MCHinson said:

No, but NAPA sells two different ones that will fit a 1938 Buick Special.

 

https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/MPERR174SB  and https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/ECHRR174

 

Either should be OK, but if one of them is US made and the other is imported, I would buy the US made one. 

 

Do you have a volt-ohm meter? You will need one of those for troubleshooting the electrical system. You can use it to see if the breaker plate is grounded as well as the other testing that you will need to effectively troubleshoot the electrical system. 

I do have a hand held volt ohm meter

[TK3295]

6 hours ago, EmTee said:

Or, get a test light and with the clip grounded probe the wire connected to the points.  With the points open (put a folded piece of paper or thin cardboard between the contacts) and ignition ON the light should be lit.

 

 

Would this be easier than the volt meter you think?

[TK3295]

Also, I remembered shortly before the car turned off (3-5mins)-- a guy cut in front of the car forcing me stop short. I really doubt this, but could this quick stop have knocked the distributor cap loose or caused something else to shift.

[MCHinson]

8 hours ago, TK3295 said:

Also, I remembered shortly before the car turned off (3-5mins)-- a guy cut in front of the car forcing me stop short. I really doubt this, but could this quick stop have knocked the distributor cap loose or caused something else to shift.

That is probably not related. If something went wrong with the electical system, it would have stopped immediately. If the sudden stop caused an issue with fuel delivery, that might have taken a short time to show up, but if that happened, you probably would not be seeing fuel in the carburetor when you tested it later.

[TK3295]

19 hours ago, MCHinson said:

That is probably not related. If something went wrong with the electical system, it would have stopped immediately. If the sudden stop caused an issue with fuel delivery, that might have taken a short time to show up, but if that happened, you probably would not be seeing fuel in the carburetor when you tested it later.

Thank you! I'll be trying to fix the car when I can will send updates when able to.