On the road to 4wd automobiles

[James Peck]

Timeline - History, Chronology - Ford Rouge Factory Tour (thehenryford.org) does not list the date that production of the Ford 9N/2N stopped at the Rouge complex. Production was moved to Highland Park as part of the ending of the verbal partnership between Henry Ford and Harry Ferguson.

Harry Ferguson moved on. He entered into a partnership with Standard Motor Car Company of Coventry. Ferguson TE20 tractors were produced in Coventry initially using Continental gasoline engines, then with a Standard made version of the same engine. Standard designed a diesel engine, the 23C, which was fitted to the TED20. This engine did not enjoy a good reputation for cold starting. Retrofit glow plug kits were offered. The TE20 and TED20 were sold through much of the world but not the US.

Standard then started installing the 23C engine in Standard automobile models. I am assuming they used essentially the same distributor pump to injector fuel lines. I do not know if Standard sold the 23C equipped models in the US.

US Ferguson fans usually have very little to do with the UK Ferguson. The role of Standard is not well known,

In the year and month of my birth, Harry Ferguson started manufacturing Ferguson TO-20 tractors in a still standing factory in Detroit. I once went to view a late fifties Detroit built red and gray Ferguson TO-35 with a 23C engine that was advertised for sale, it would not start with ether at 30 ^oF

 

In an antique tractor email group, I learned of a TED20 located in Australia that had been through a bush fire. The original fuel lines had been bent at the fittings to match the added glow plugs. The lines were leaking there. The mechanic had located a set of fuel lines from an idle tractor in the UK and sold on eBay, and was waiting for air delivery.

 

I suggested they find a fuel injection service company in Australia to make a good fitting set of fuel lines. I believe that with tubing, fittings, and hand tools, this could be done. I suspect that the tractor was too far away from such a business. The suggestion was not appreciated.

 

I came across an advertisement for aftermarket preformed fuel lines. Classictube.com, in the Antique Automobile publication. They do not offer any preformed fuel lines for the 23C but could bet someone in the world can supply them.

 

Standard had wanted to buy Ferguson Tractor. Instead, it was sold to Massey Harris.

[James Peck]

I think this video showing the use of benders and other tools should be useful. https://youtu.be/wayKqBT7z00

 

[James Peck]

On 7/29/2023 at 10:49 PM, James Peck said:

Timeline - History, Chronology - Ford Rouge Factory Tour (thehenryford.org) does not list the date that production of the Ford 9N/2N stopped at the Rouge complex. Production was moved to Highland Park as part of the ending of the verbal partnership between Henry Ford and Harry Ferguson.

Harry Ferguson moved on. He entered into a partnership with Standard Motor Car Company of Coventry. Ferguson TE20 tractors were produced in Coventry initially using Continental gasoline engines, then with a Standard made version of the same engine. Standard designed a diesel engine, the 23C, which was fitted to the TED20. This engine did not enjoy a good reputation for cold starting. Retrofit glow plug kits were offered. The TE20 and TED20 were sold through much of the world but not the US.

Standard then started installing the 23C engine in Standard automobile models. I am assuming they used essentially the same distributor pump to injector fuel lines. I do not know if Standard sold the 23C equipped models in the US.

US Ferguson fans usually have very little to do with the UK Ferguson. The role of Standard is not well known,

In the year and month of my birth, Harry Ferguson started manufacturing Ferguson TO-20 tractors in a still standing factory in Detroit. I once went to view a late fifties Detroit built red and gray Ferguson TO-35 with a 23C engine that was advertised for sale, it would not start with ether at 30 ^oF

 

In an antique tractor email group, I learned of a TED20 located in Australia that had been through a bush fire. The original fuel lines had been bent at the fittings to match the added glow plugs. The lines were leaking there. The mechanic had located a set of fuel lines from an idle tractor in the UK and sold on eBay, and was waiting for air delivery.

 

I suggested they find a fuel injection service company in Australia to make a good fitting set of fuel lines. I believe that with tubing, fittings, and hand tools, this could be done. I suspect that the tractor was too far away from such a business. The suggestion was not appreciated.

 

I came across an advertisement for aftermarket preformed fuel lines. Classictube.com, in the Antique Automobile publication. They do not offer any preformed fuel lines for the 23C but could bet someone in the world can supply them.

 

Standard had wanted to buy Ferguson Tractor. Instead, it was sold to Massey Harris.

 

[James Peck]

The book, "The Book of the Standard Motor Company" by Graham Robson is superlative. I bought it because I was curious about the design process of the TO series Fergusons. This book peeks into the end of an era when the UK was the technical leader of the world.

     My hypothesis is the Ferguson drafting and engineering effort of the post 9N/2N era was pretty thin. They did not possess a full set of drawings with which to build a tractor. Standard developed a full set of drawings for a world class tractor as well as developed a better gasoline engine than was used in the US built gray tractors as well as a viable diesel engine. All this while continuing to bring out new auto models. Standard saved Harry's butt and he did not save theirs. Without Standard, there might not have been a post Ford Ferguson.

[James Peck]

The Detroit factory is still standing but the office building has been replaced by a new plant.

 

Discuss Detroit: Ferguson Park, tractor factory (atdetroit.net)

[James Peck]

The first Fordson Model F came complete off the Henry Ford and Sons Dearborn factory om April 23, 1918 Page 107.

It looks like the Overtime tractors were being painted for all of the pre-partition UK at Harry Fergusons dealership in Belfast. It looks like a little effort went into avoiding mention of Harry Ferguson.

Was the Overtime plowing up a London Park painted in Belfast? I doubt it.

My mother used to buy blocks of Paraffin brand wax to use in sealing jars of canned vegetables and fruit.

“The Waterloo Boy Model R Tractor built in Waterloo, Iowa, a descendant of the first successful gasoline tractor built by John Froelich in 1892, arrived in Northen Ireland in 1917. There it was repainted olive green, set off with deep red spokes, a gray engine case, and fuel tank. And rebranded as Overtime by L. J. Martin of the Overtime Tractor Company of London, England.  The tractor burned low-cost paraffin similar to American kerosene whish was preferred to petrol due to its lower cost. An estimated 3000 Overtime tractors were in use in Great Britain by the end of the year.” Page 86.

 

Tractor Wars by

Neil Dahlstrom Manager of Archives and History at John Deere

Edited September 9, 2023 by James Peck (see edit history)

[JFranklin]

My Ferguson still working.

[James Peck]

This answer comes from the Bing site. Why would they deny that Fordson tractors were first manufactured at a Dearborn location other than the Rouge Complex The sale of Ford Agriculture (as well as CaseIH) to Fiat included the history. [Bing] I think you are referring to the Ford River Rouge complex in Dearborn, Michigan, USA. The complex was built in 1917 and completed in 1928, becoming the largest integrated factory in the world at that time¹. The complex was designed by Albert Kahn and is now a National Historic Landmark District¹.

The Rouge complex measures 1.5 miles wide by 1 mile long, including 93 buildings with nearly 16 million square feet of factory floor space¹. The plant’s first products were Eagle Boats, World War I anti-submarine warfare boats produced in Building B. The original Building B, a three-story structure, is part of the legendary Dearborn Assembly Plant, which started producing Model A’s in the late 1920s and continued production of Ford full-sized coupes and sedans through 2004¹.

Edited September 10, 2023 by James Peck (see edit history)

[James Peck]

The plant where the TE20 was made was taken out of production in 2005.

Edited September 9, 2023 by James Peck (see edit history)

[James Peck]

On 9/8/2023 at 9:53 PM, James Peck said:

The first Fordson Model F came complete off the Henry Ford and Sons Dearborn factory om April 23, 1918 Page 107.

It looks like the Overtime tractors were being painted for all of the pre-partition UK at Harry Fergusons dealership in Belfast. It looks like a little effort went into avoiding mention of Harry Ferguson.

Was the Overtime plowing up a London Park painted in Belfast? I doubt it.

My mother used to buy blocks of Paraffin brand wax to use in sealing jars of canned vegetables and fruit.

“The Waterloo Boy Model R Tractor built in Waterloo, Iowa, a descendant of the first successful gasoline tractor built by John Froelich in 1892, arrived in Northen Ireland in 1917. There it was repainted olive green, set off with deep red spokes, a gray engine case, and fuel tank. And rebranded as Overtime by L. J. Martin of the Overtime Tractor Company of London, England.  The tractor burned low-cost paraffin similar to American kerosene whish was preferred to petrol due to its lower cost. An estimated 3000 Overtime tractors were in use in Great Britain by the end of the year.” Page 86.

 

Tractor Wars by

Neil Dahlstrom Manager of Archives and History at John Deere

There is a photo of a Fordson Model F with a Ferguson Duplex plow.TractorData.com Fordson Fordson F tractor photos information

[James Peck]

The Wikipedia article reveals that Fordson F manufacture began in a hastily built building in Dearborn and moved later to the Rouge Complex.

Fordson - Wikipedia

[James Peck]

Through Lean contacts i was told that the Standard Motor Cars plant in Coventry that became a Ferguson and then Massey Ferguson manufacturing location had been a world leader in auto manufacturing efficiency before migrating to tractors.

Edited September 24 by James Peck
typo (see edit history)