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1922 Buick clutch issue


David P

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My 22 Buick would not go into gear. It would just grind. I posted a question about how to solve this problem. I received a response that said to jack the car up so the rear wheels are off the ground. Start the car in high gear and then once the wheels are spinning pretty good, jam the brakes. Did that, heard a pop and now it goes into gear, but wheels won't spin. Anyone have an idea of what happened and why the car won't move at all? Thanks...Dave

22 Buick - June 19e.jpg

22 Buick - June 19d.jpg

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Most likely in the clutch. Hub broke out or something. If you broke a master rear end doing this it was going to fail tomorrow anyway.  Speedometer test as mentioned. 

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I watched a video of one of our posters freeing up things in an early Buick  with methods such as mentioned, and worse. Gave me the willies but he didn't break anything right off the bat. I had more respect of the toughness of those cars after watching that.  

 

Edited by JFranklin (see edit history)
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And here is where internet experts get new people into trouble............if the clutch was stuck, all he needed to do is let the car warm up at idle for about 45 minutes and the heat will work it's way through the crank and flywheel, and the thermal expansion would have released it. Likely a broken axel. Too bad poor advice caused a new member to damage his car. It's certainly possible the failure would have occurred just driving........but it's impossible to know. 

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  • 7 months later...

OK, Finally got a chance to look at the car again. Dropped the cover to expose the flywheel. With the rear of the car jacked up, I turned the rear wheels and the flywheel does not move but I can see the metal plates in the clutch moving. When I first had the problem, I was adjusting the nut on the shaft that comes from the clutch pedal arm. I'm not sure if I may have adjusted it too much in the wrong direction and whether that may have something to do with the current problem. Can anyone give me advice on which direction I should be trying to re-adjust that nut. Also is there an approximate location that nut should be? Sorry if I sound very unknowledgeable but I am trying to help my 88 year old dad with this problem and also trying to learn about this vehicle. I attached a pic of the adjustment nut so it's location can be seen. Thanks for any help. Dave

Buick clutch - flywheel 20231211.jpg

Buick clutch 20231211.jpg

Buick clutch adjusting nut 20231211.jpg

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The big nut adjusts clutch pedal.   Below is a pic from the 1925 Shop Manual describing clutch adjustment which is probably identical to 1922 as clutch design was carried over.  

The only explanations for your current predicament that I can think of, is either the big clutch spring has broken or somehow the release bearing got stuck with clutch engaged. 

clutch adjustment.jpg

clutch section view.jpg

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Dave,

    Here is a view thru the transmission inspection plate.  

Since you have been adjusting the big nut on the clutch pedal, We need to first make sure that you have the clutch at least adjusted correctly.  

When your foot is off the pedal.

   - there should be just a little play in the pedal before the throw out bearing pushes on the clutch assembly. 

   -the small spring on the throw out bearing should not be stretched

   -there should be a small gap between the throw out bearing and the lever arm. 

Push the clutch pedal in about 1 to 1 1/2"

   You should feel a noticible difference in the pressure required to push the clutch pedal past this point.  This is when you have taken up the slack in the parts and you are now feeling the "clutch pack spring" pressure.  

If this feeling occurs at 1 3/4" in, you have too much play in the clutch system, and the clutch may not disengage all the way when fully depressed.  You need to tighten the nut or move it forward.

If there is no feeling of this play, the nut is too far in, and needs to be backed out.  If you don't take all the pressure off the big internal clutch spring when your foot is off, the clutch will slip when in gear.

 

In the photo you will also see the clutch pins.  These should not move if the clutch pedal is depressed about 1 to 1 1/2".  Once you push the pedal past this amount, these pins should begin to look shorter as the spring is being compressed.  

 

Hugh

clutch.JPG.3b49a0eda7559f4fbea98709624e2e14.JPG

 

Edited by Hubert_25-25 (see edit history)
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On 12/11/2023 at 5:31 PM, David P said:

OK, Finally got a chance to look at the car again. Dropped the cover to expose the flywheel. With the rear of the car jacked up, I turned the rear wheels and the flywheel does not move but I can see the metal plates in the clutch moving. When I first had the problem, I was adjusting the nut on the shaft that comes from the clutch pedal arm. I'm not sure if I may have adjusted it too much in the wrong direction and whether that may have something to do with the current problem. Can anyone give me advice on which direction I should be trying to re-adjust that nut. Also is there an approximate location that nut should be? Sorry if I sound very unknowledgeable but I am trying to help my 88 year old dad with this problem and also trying to learn about this vehicle. I attached a pic of the adjustment nut so it's location can be seen. Thanks for any help. Dave

Buick clutch - flywheel 20231211.jpg

 

 

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Just now, Oldtech said:

The advise on adjustment is correct and Hopefully that is all that is wrong. Now you say the plates turn but not the flywheel do you mean just the fibre ones or the complete unit in the picture, It Everything turns including the ones with the turned out flats on the pin, then the pins have broken loose from the flywheel.  I've never seen that but spose it is possible. 

 

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On these clutches, the friction discs turn with the flywheel, and the metal discs turn with the transmission input shaft.  If the metal plates are moving when you spin the rear wheels (I assume one rear wheel is on the ground) that says the clutch is not holding and may be adjusted too far in and not releasing all the way. 

With no pressure on the clutch pedal, one rear wheel on the ground, one wheel up, transmission in gear, the metal discs should be stuck to the friction discs and you should not be able to turn the metal discs by spinning the rear wheel that is off the ground. 

2017-12-1510_51_35.jpg.67312dedcc5367e2e17231ab86e09189.jpgIMG_5773.JPG.4e12dc98c083cff7234d4572821ea05f.JPG

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  • 1 month later...

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