alsfarms Posted September 15, 2022 Share Posted September 15, 2022 Hmmmmm....I caught the CID difference as stated in the above writeup and wonder the same thing. Is any clarification available? Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 15, 2022 Share Posted September 15, 2022 2 hours ago, prewarnut said: George, Do i read correctly thst the engine displacement is bored out larger for these? It would then be interesting for the future restorer of the one for sale what changes there are. No chance of getting 16.6 cubic inch per cylinder due to physical dimension restraints. As I stated it’s a typo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 15, 2022 Share Posted September 15, 2022 Please read text 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted September 15, 2022 Share Posted September 15, 2022 George, I reread your posting and for some reason I missed the typo CI remark. Now on to another thought that relates to your last factory literature posting. I can only guess how white ones knuckles would be driving a 6000 lb Limousine at 85 mph, on a public thoroughfare with other traffic and only two wheel brakes. That ride must have been exhilarating if not flat scary! Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 15, 2022 Share Posted September 15, 2022 6 minutes ago, alsfarms said: George, I reread your posting and for some reason I missed the typo CI remark. Now on to another thought that relates to your last factory literature posting. I can only guess how white ones knuckles would be driving a 6000 lb Limousine at 85 mph, on a public thoroughfare with other traffic and only two wheel brakes. That ride must have been exhilarating if not flat scary! Al Google Dario Resta winner of 1916 Indianapolis 500 don’t believe he was scared. He died at 40 driving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted September 15, 2022 Author Share Posted September 15, 2022 I'm not sure which one this was (Aberdeen or Nevada one), from the Bridgeport Times 3/6/19: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted September 15, 2022 Author Share Posted September 15, 2022 This substantiates George's displacement comment. Perhaps some of the details will aid the restorer of the one for sale (wish it could be me but a year or two too early...) From the NY Tribune 2/2/19: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 15, 2022 Share Posted September 15, 2022 8 minutes ago, prewarnut said: I'm not sure which one this was (Aberdeen or Nevada one), from the Bridgeport Times 3/6/19: It would be great to see a photo as returned from war. Might be one of the ten standard limousines as the eight special were just being delivered. The purchase order didn’t post until January 24 1919. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted September 15, 2022 Author Share Posted September 15, 2022 Here's the photo from the NY Tribune (above) but that's not necessarily returned from the war. I can't yet find any salon photos from the Armory exhibits at Bridgeport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 15, 2022 Share Posted September 15, 2022 This is the car at the show as previously stated. The car you found stating it’s returned from France can not be a v windshield when the v windshield cars hadn’t even or just arrived in France. This car show is a pedestrian version. Not Military. The car returned must be a flat windshield car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 16, 2022 Share Posted September 16, 2022 This is from a March 1919 body trade magazine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted September 16, 2022 Author Share Posted September 16, 2022 OK, I think I better understand. According to the timeline so far, none of the "Overseas" limos actually saw war service, but were shiped for post-war duty in France. It is a little subtle and maybe a marketing ploy to boost domestic sales post WWI contracts at home. It is apparent that war contracts got immediately cancelled. An article describes this with a positive spin (excerpt below). I suppose this is different from present time when government contracts run their term even if changes occurs making it obsolete; the money is still spent. From The Republican Farmer 3/21/19: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 16, 2022 Share Posted September 16, 2022 The Special High Speed Overseas Limousines saw use in France. Armistice November 11 1918. Our interests continued for some time. We didn’t abandon our equipment back then. The service was not shot at service most likely. No matter how many tires you have you can still get stuck in the mud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted September 16, 2022 Author Share Posted September 16, 2022 If they only made a tracked vehicle! 😊 Actually the beginning of my last clipping (not shown) states Locomobile was contracted to make tanks...but I was joking about half-tracks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted September 17, 2022 Share Posted September 17, 2022 Locomobile involvement in WW1 is certainly an interesting subject on its own merit. How many Locomobiles we're sold on contract to Russia during the same timeframe? Did Belgium, Holland, Denmark or others make military contracts for Locomobile automobiles or Locomobile and Riker trucks? Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 17, 2022 Share Posted September 17, 2022 10 minutes ago, alsfarms said: Locomobile involvement in WW1 is certainly an interesting subject on its own merit. How many Locomobiles we're sold on contract to Russia during the same timeframe? Did Belgium, Holland, Denmark or others make military contracts for Locomobile automobiles or Locomobile and Riker trucks? Al Prewarnut’s first post in this topic answered your questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted September 17, 2022 Share Posted September 17, 2022 Did Russia, later, order addition Locomobile products, either automobiles or trucks? Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted September 17, 2022 Author Share Posted September 17, 2022 In perusing the CT newspapers I haven't seen announcements of sales to Russia beyond the few I posted, so probably 1916 at latest. They may still have had later contracts - probably it would need looking through any extant Locomobile records to figure out. The implication all of this is that there could be remains of Locomobiles lurking in Russia but good luck figuring that out. It might be easier to find a 540K or Horsch in an eastern block nation's barn.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted September 17, 2022 Share Posted September 17, 2022 Thanks for response. We can all dream for sure! My Greatgrandads 1909 Locomobile Model L in a very small rural farm town in western Utah, makes the statement true...."never say never". A few years ago I purchased some mid 1920's Stutz parts from a fellow who had just returned to the US a parts car that had been exported to Finland when the Stutz was new. I certainly have learned....never say never! Al 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted September 19, 2022 Author Share Posted September 19, 2022 I've seen this ad in a few places promoting features on the mid-teens Locomobiles. Toilets, now that's impressive. From the Atlanta Georgian 11/9/13: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 19, 2022 Share Posted September 19, 2022 58 minutes ago, prewarnut said: I've seen this ad in a few places promoting features on the mid-teens Locomobiles. Toilets, now that's impressive. From the Atlanta Georgian 11/9/13: I hoping they are using the archaic toilet. Eau de toilette being fragrance. If not a guy would have to be a good shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 19, 2022 Share Posted September 19, 2022 Now if you have a stand up Locomobile like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted September 19, 2022 Author Share Posted September 19, 2022 They must have made a few busses over the years. Here's two ads from the Norwich (CT) Bulletin in mid 1920 and early '21: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted September 19, 2022 Author Share Posted September 19, 2022 This might be new news, but another future general owned a Locomobile at age 27 while in D.C. for just a year: George Patton. He later teamed up with Pershing in the AEF abroad. See the Evening Star (D.C.) 4/13/13: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 2 hours ago, prewarnut said: This might be new news, but another future general owned a Locomobile at age 27 while in D.C. for just a year: George Patton. He later teamed up with Pershing in the AEF abroad. See the Evening Star (D.C.) 4/13/13: That’s a fascinating group. All have interesting stories. All owned Locomobile roadsters. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 Ok I know who G. Patton was, but who is the Countess Gizyika? Who is E.B. McLean? They must be notable for sure. The article comes from 1913 when the Model 48 was nearly a new offering and certainly at the top of the automobile field. Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 2 hours ago, alsfarms said: Ok I know who G. Patton was, but who is the Countess Gizyika? Who is E.B. McLean? They must be notable for sure. The article comes from 1913 when the Model 48 was nearly a new offering and certainly at the top of the automobile field. Al Google them then you’ll know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 Google search is not my best strong point, but I will give it a try. Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 Here is some Countess Gizyika information for those who may be interested. She certainly was a colorful character who at one time owned and drove Locomobile. Al Felicia Gizycka Magruder, an American heiress who was kidnapped as a child by her father, a continental count, died on Feb. 26 at the Regency retirement community in Laramie, Wyo. She was 93 and moved to Laramie from New Canaan, Conn., in 1995. Mrs. Magruder was the former Countess Felicia Gizycka, the only daughter of the Chicago-born newspaper heiress Eleanor Medill Patterson and Count Josef Gizycki, a fortune-hunting scion of a noble Polish family. Ms. Patterson, who eventually divorced the count, was a granddaughter of Joseph Medill, the founder of The Chicago Tribune. The little Countess Felicia, as the newspapers later called her, was born in 1905 in Blansko in what is now the Czech Republic. In 1908, when Felicia was a golden-haired, blue-eyed toddler, The New York Times reported that she had been ”kidnapped in London by the Count,” who ”is thought to be either in Vienna or St. Petersburg and has concealed the child.” The Times said that earlier ”the Countess ran away from him with her child one night after a violent quarrel.” The ensuing custody struggle led President-elect William Howard Taft to intervene with Czar Nicholas II of Russia, in whose realm the Gizycki family estates were located. In December 1908, Taft wrote the Czar pointing out Felicia’s mother’s connection to Russia and saying that the count had put the kidnapped toddler in a convent in Russia. Taft asked the Czar to ”make such order to Count Gizycki as shall seem to Your Majesty equitable.” The Czar commanded the count to return Felicia to her mother, and when that happened, as one Patterson biographer has written, ”they caught the first train for Germany and from there took the first steamship to America.” Lake Forest, Ill. became their home. Mrs. Magruder’s mother also bought a ranch in Wyoming, and there, as The Laramie Daily Boomerang reported in its obituary of Mrs. Magruder, an able young journalist named Drew Pearson ”came out to court Felicia.” But things did not go smoothly, and the teen-age countess ”caught a train to San Diego, where she took an assumed name and supported herself as a waitress.” In a 1939 interview she said, ”I tell you, I was good” as a waitress. ”I could swing a mean tray,” she added. ”I always wanted to make my own way in life — it gives one a nice feeling.” Undeterred, Pearson caught up with her. He is said to have made her a practical offer: ”Look, you’re only 18. Marry me now and in three years, if you don’t love me, you can leave and start your life all over again.” Their marriage began in 1925, produced a daughter, Ellen, and was ended in divorce by Mrs. Pearson after three years. But what years they were, with the promising Pearson, who was not yet the mighty syndicated columnist he later became, taking his young wife to China and beyond, while he polished his journalistic skills. In later years she wrote for American magazines and newspapers, lived in New York and elsewhere, and wrote novels and short stories. In her 1939 novel ”Flower of Smoke,” the Austrian-American heroine says, ”Make your own peace, no matter what.” After living for years in New Canaan she moved for good to Wyoming, where she had relatives. Her 1934 marriage to an Englishman, Dudley de Lavigne, ended in divorce. Her 1958 marriage to John Kennedy Magruder, a landscape architect and a director of the Alcoholics Anonymous Men’s Home in Alexandria, Va., also ended in divorce. She is survived by a daughter, Ellen Pearson Arnold of San Diego; three grandsons, Joe and Drew Arnold of Laramie and George Arnold of Evanston, Wyo.; a granddaughter, and eight great-grandchildren. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted September 20, 2022 Author Share Posted September 20, 2022 Al, I think you have the wrong one (notable as if born in 1905 she'd only be 8 at the time of the '13 article). I think googling Cissy Patterson is the correct person. See Wikepedia: "Eleanor Josephine Medill "Cissy" Patterson, Countess Gizycki (November 7, 1881 – July 24, 1948) was an American journalist and newspaper editor, publisher and owner. Patterson was one of the first women to head a major daily newspaper, the Washington Times-Herald in Washington, D.C." There are some similarities and she did visit Wyoming but Jackson Hole not Laramie. I think she was "countess" only to denote she married a count and may have been called this locally but she had no real title and was an American (from what I can see). Still a strong and accomplished woman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 Search skills are not my strong suite for sure. I did notice Grandmother, mother and daughter. So you are suggesting that the "Countess", we should look at is the mother of the person I posted the information on? The mother would have been Countess by marriage, where her daughter (who was kidnapped by her father the Count) would have been Countess by blood. Do I understand the Polish cass system correctly. The mother certainly came from a well to do Newspaper family and either by marriage to the Count or by inherited wealth could certainly afford to drive a Locomobile in 1913. Al 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted September 20, 2022 Share Posted September 20, 2022 (edited) Edward Beale "Ned" McLean was the publisher and owner of The Washington Post newspaper, from 1916 until 1933. His wife, Evalyn Walsh McLean, was a prominent Washington socialite. McLean was also a thoroughbred racehorse owner and purchaser of the Hope Diamond, which was traditionally believed to carry a curse. This morsel of information is of the third person who was listed as driving a Locomobile Roadster in 1913. Each of these people were certainly "known" and would have had the "wherewithal" to afford to drive a Locomobile. Al Edited September 21, 2022 by alsfarms clarity (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 Here is a bit of information, for those who may not know much of General George S. Patton. This bit tells of General G. S.Patton's Father and Grandfather. It appears that his family was also in the position to be able to afford to own and drive a Locomobile early on, per the above newspaper clipping posted above, regarding three Locomobile roadsters. Al George S. Patton Former Los Angeles County District Attorney George Smith Patton was an American attorney, businessman and politician who served as Los Angeles County District Attorney and the first mayor of San Marino, California. Patton was the son of Susan Thornton Glassell and George S. Patton Sr., a Confederate colonel during the American Civil War. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 21, 2022 Share Posted September 21, 2022 1 hour ago, alsfarms said: Here is a bit of information, for those who may not know much of General George S. Patton. This bit tells of General G. S.Patton's Father and Grandfather. It appears that his family was also in the position to be able to afford to own and drive a Locomobile early on, per the above newspaper clipping posted above, regarding three Locomobile roadsters. Al George S. Patton Former Los Angeles County District Attorney George Smith Patton was an American attorney, businessman and politician who served as Los Angeles County District Attorney and the first mayor of San Marino, California. Patton was the son of Susan Thornton Glassell and George S. Patton Sr., a Confederate colonel during the American Civil War. You have bio on senior. You need jr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsfarms Posted September 23, 2022 Share Posted September 23, 2022 So the original "Ponzi" schemer chose to drive a Locomobile in Boston in 1920. I didn't know that the term Ponzi was actually a guys name.... Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prewarnut Posted September 23, 2022 Author Share Posted September 23, 2022 We know of the factory sponsored racing such as the famous 1908 Vanderbuilt Cup win. Locomobiles kept being entered into races even after the factory stopped sponsoring this directly. See the Daily Star Mirror, Moscow, ID, 11/4/13: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 23, 2022 Share Posted September 23, 2022 Orin Davis was a privateer racer. Used a six cylinder which Locomobile never factory raced. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 24, 2022 Share Posted September 24, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted September 24, 2022 Share Posted September 24, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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