2013 Miles. No Gas. Many Hassles. cross country in an EV...

[kar3516]

What it’s really like to drive an electric vehicle cross country!!  If I post a link to this article from today’s Wall Street Journal by two girls who attempted a 2,013 mile trip in four days by EV, many won’t be able to read it.  So I’m posting the article the old fashioned way (photos)...  I know the charging situation will improve in the future...whenever that is.  Note the writer’s last four sentences:  “The following week, I fill up my Jetta at a local Shell station.  Gas is up to $4.08 a gallon.  I inhale deeply.  Fumes never smelled so sweet.”

 

 

[Mark Shaw]

My nephew is moving to Hillsborough OR.  He just borrowed my 20' enclosed car trailer to transport his EV car from Campbell CA to his new place 678 miles away.  He said the battery only lasts one hour at freeway speed and takes one hour to recharge.   So it would have taken him about 14 hours to drive it to his new hime in OR.  Fortunately, he also has a Lincoln Navigator tow vehicle and is familiar with towing a big sailboat.   He didn't realize how bit my trailer is and thought he can probably fit the rest of his stuff in the trailer too.  I am just glad he can load it and tow it himself and pay the current high price for gas....

I told him to be sure to wash it before it returns....

[Ford Fan]

This story reminds me of the adventure of Alice Ramsey, June,1909, and her friend, the first women to drive across the USA.

 

[TerryB]

Sounds like your nephew owns a Nissan Leaf.

[kar3516]

Just think if 300 cars attempted the same journey leaving from the same place and returning to the same place.  Would take weeks not days...

[plymouthcranbrook]

A few years ago the local NAPA got a Nissan Leaf for local deliveries.  I was in one day and asked how it was working out.  What an earful I got. The Manager told me they hated it.  Slow and clumsy( their words) and they could only use it about half a day before it was almost dead.  I noticed after about 6 months or so I didn’t see it anymore and they had a new Kia Soul.

[TAKerry]

I couldnt read the article, my glasses arent that good. I will try to find a reprint somewhere. 

I saw a blip on motorweek tv show not too long ago when they were testing a Mazda electric car. I think they may have said it is only available in CA right now? It was a small commuter car. They said Mazda had a program if you bought this car you would get a special deal to lease/rent a gas Mazda for taking a vacation/long trips if need be.

[pkhammer]

   EVs are without doubt the future of transportation but when you consider the infrastructure that needs to be in place to make that happen it is mind boggling! As others have pointed out, where will all that electricity come from? 30 years from now If every McDonalds parking space has a 350KW charging station can you imagine the electricity needed if 50% of those stations would be charging at one time while the car owners are having a Big Mac? And what about the battery disposal and cost to replace? Won't the cost of electricity go up if power companies need to spend billions to upgrade infrastructure?

  I think an EV would be fine for a commuter to get you to work and back and you can simply plug in at home to recharge overnight. Long distance travel is another ballgame altogether! Until EV prices come down, range increases and charging stations are more plentiful and quicker, long distance travel would not be worth the hassle.

   I suspect in 1910 gasoline stations were not overly plentiful either. That changed pretty rapidly. Time will tell.

Edited June 5, 2022 by pkhammer
mispelling (see edit history)

[Gunsmoke]

I could suggest this post is taking on the flavor of the next episode of Jurassic Park, but won't! The WSJ is a known & notorious Climate Change Denier, and while the article may be more or less accurate, my thoughts are that the trip was undertaken for the sole purpose of undermining the EV vehicle movement by recording every negative and underplaying any positives, classic one-sided journalism, so common to WSJ.

 

My advice, don't fall for biased reporting. The USA in particular has a huge stake in the success of the EV evolution. As Climate Change response continues over the next 20-40 years, the country that develops the vehicles and technology (batteries, charging stations, manufacturing, computerization, service capacity, marketing, recycling/reuse etc) will have a dominating role in meeting the worlds needs. I ask: do you want China, Japan or India playing that role?

 

1960's era thinking will be of no help. The business and technology leaders who can clearly see the future and plot a road to get there will be the Henry Fords of the future. The Government leaders who understand the balance needed to both support the development/marketing of EV's and also the need to maintain ICE usage in the transition period should be appreciated and not excoriated as grifters. 

 

For once I would like to see someone on here (if they think it is so simple) set out what they would do for transport in view of what we are facing Climate Change wise, as opposed to howling like some brontosaurus.

[John Kelso]

How about building more trains to haul freight long distances.

[SC38dls]

Well said Gunsmoke, my fears are too many are jumping on the EV bandwagon without considering the consequences. Are the current manufacturers even considering the disposal of old batteries, the environmental impact of new electrical production, how that will be accomplished in a world trying to stop using coal and oil? Over 60% of electrical plants in the USA are still using fossil fuel (over 25% use coal) to run the generators. Are they thinking of the bottom line for the corporation and their stockholders in the short term of 5 to 10 years? To me this is where our government should be focusing their attention on not just the immediate impact of new technology and jobs. I have not read one article that says anyone is addressing that problem and it is coming at us at a faster pace than many other disasters headed our way. Young people better wake up to that fact as guys like me will be long gone. If for no other reason than to have a life with the possibilities as good as their parents and grand parents had in this country. 
dave s 

[JACK M]

16 hours ago, Mark Shaw said:

Hillsborough OR. 

Hillsboro OR.

I suspect your mail will still find its way if you have the correct zip. 97123 or 97124.

Nephew is 20-25 minutes away. Over Chehalem Mtn.

[1912Staver]

1 hour ago, Gunsmoke said:

I could suggest this post is taking on the flavor of the next episode of Jurassic Park, but won't! The WSJ is a known & notorious Climate Change Denier, and while the article may be more or less accurate, my thoughts are that the trip was undertaken for the sole purpose of undermining the EV vehicle movement by recording every negative and underplaying any positives, classic one-sided journalism, so common to WSJ.

 

My advice, don't fall for biased reporting. The USA in particular has a huge stake in the success of the EV evolution. As Climate Change response continues over the next 20-40 years, the country that develops the vehicles and technology (batteries, charging stations, manufacturing, computerization, service capacity, marketing, recycling/reuse etc) will have a dominating role in meeting the worlds needs. I ask: do you want China, Japan or India playing that role?

 

1960's era thinking will be of no help. The business and technology leaders who can clearly see the future and plot a road to get there will be the Henry Fords of the future. The Government leaders who understand the balance needed to both support the development/marketing of EV's and also the need to maintain ICE usage in the transition period should be appreciated and not excoriated as grifters. 

 

For once I would like to see someone on here (if they think it is so simple) set out what they would do for transport in view of what we are facing Climate Change wise, as opposed to howling like some brontosaurus.

I am far from a denier. But when one looks at  the scale of fossil fuel use , and the standard of living that use allows, I just can't see things changing nearly enough. { assuming it is human activity that is the major cause , this question is still not completely answered in my mind }

 When you are talking about re inventing the way mankind does everything into a low carbon model, on a world wide basis I can only marvel at what sort of effort and expense that would require.

 

 I honestly think we are more or less stuck with Climate Change. Better to start working towards plans to deal with the harm than to try to do a colossally ,massive and ultimately doomed to failure, total change in human activity. Concrete, air travel, power in areas without hydro electric , these sort of problems are not going to be solved within our lifetime, but climate change effects are starting even now. Climate change is 100 % real in my opinion, the only question in my mind is the percentage of the problem caused by the various causes, both man made and natural. But really that question is irrelevant compared to preparing for what's going to come as a result of Climate Change.

 No Bronto roars here : on this issue at least, just a reasonably good knowledge of human nature. For dog sakes, we can't even stop cutting down trees in critical locations to protect Rain Forests. Now we are going to save the entire planet ?

 

Edited June 5, 2022 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[Terry Harper]

Thank you for sharing that article. It's one thing to read online reviews, specs etc. but another to read about real life experiences.

[MotiveLensPhoto]

Has anyone done a comparison of the difficulties of EV from inception to now compared to the same time frame of fossil fuel vehicles? The bad "roads," the lack of decent parts, etc.? Point is, emerging technologies always have growing pains.

[SC38dls]

The point seems too be they are looking at the beginning as a great money maker with only also considering the number and location of charging stations. They should be considering how to keep those stations operating without hurting the environment but do not seem to be any concern. It’s the mentality of “if there is a plug there must be electricity! “ or if there are checks in the checkbook there must be money in the bank. Guess what, we will be the bank. 
dave s 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Gunsmoke said:

My advice, don't fall for biased reporting. 

That is sound advice.

 

[car crazy]

Some things are better in theory than they are in reality.

[rocketraider]

40 minutes ago, SC38dls said:

It’s the mentality of “if there is a plug there must be electricity! “

You would be totally amazed at the number of people who have absolutely no idea where their electricity comes from. As far as they know it comes out of thin air (yes, Mr Tesla was working on that👽⚡).

 

We in the generation end used to tell uninformed that making electricity was "FM" ("xxxxing magic"). And that explanation seemed to satisfy them.

 

Yes, there were growing pains when fossil-fueled machinery first appeared. The difference was that things evolved over a period of 50 years or so, instead of a mad rush to convert everything in a span of five years- which seems to be the MO of those who are pushing to end fossil fuel use and run everything off batteries, which have their own set of environmental damage.

 

I'm also in the camp who doesn't believe our current climate woes are all man-made. I simply refuse to carry that guilt. The same science that is now screaming that the sky is falling should be well aware that the planet has been thru worse cataclysms and endured, and nobody was burning fossil fuels then.

 

Follow the money. It will always reveal the truth, and who stands to benefit.

[Mark Shaw]

1 hour ago, JACK M said:

Hillsboro OR.

I suspect your mail will still find its way if you have the correct zip. 97123 or 97124.

Nephew is 20-25 minutes away. Over Chehalem Mtn.

Hillsboro, OR to Campbell, CA is still 678 miles any way you spell it Jack.

Maybe your nephew is 20-25 miles away from you, but mine isn't.

[28 Chrysler]

EVs may have a place in the cities but were I live it's a bit over an hour to drive to Las Vegas. If I go north to the EV charging station it is 175 miles, day time lights are required and AC would be recommend.

[alsancle]

A Tesla is actually a great car.  Especially the Model S.  It is also SUPER expensive.  The long range model will go 400 miles between charges and it is a rocket ship.

 

But the most brilliant thing about Tesla that you can drive one and not look like an ass.    You could not give me a Prius.

 

 

 

 

[Crusty Trucker]

3 hours ago, alsancle said:

But the most brilliant thing about Tesla is that you can drive one and not look like an ass.  

 

 

 

 

At $100,000.00 to $130,000.00 per copy, folks in my neck of the woods would use a different descriptor:

PLUS:Where ya gonna put the hounds?

[nickelroadster]

Right now electric cars are burning a lot of coal.  fossil fuels still have a ways to go and we need to get something ready before we toss them all.  We also will not do ourselves any good by ruining our economy to get to carbon free.   We used lot less carbon when we were shut down for covid but that  is not a good way to  do things.  There is the whole rest to the world that we can't effect that much.

[1937hd45]

2 hours ago, Crusty Trucker said:

At $100,000.00 to $130,000.00 per copy, folks in my neck of the woods would use a different descriptor:

PLUS:Where ya gonna put the hounds?

You could get TWO fairly nice pickups for that kind of money. Has anyone seen a Tesla battery? Has anyone ever moved one? 

[alsancle]

8 hours ago, Crusty Trucker said:

At $100,000.00 to $130,000.00 per copy, folks in my neck of the woods would use a different descriptor:

PLUS:Where ya gonna put the hounds?

 

If I was living in your neck of the woods I would stick with my 10 year old truck.

 

I'm arguing that the Tesla is a cool piece of engineering,  and yes, probably only appropriate for the coasts.   But a cross country trip is doable if you wanted to.

 

Otherwise, if I had to buy an electric car,  I would buy this.

 

[Avanti Bill]

If you would put 1900 as the beginning of the motoring age then you could honestly say that 122 years later we still have areas of our country that don't have enough and in some cases any gas stations.  My guess is it will be close to the same amount of time for the EV infrastructure to be adequately developed. 

[oldcarfudd]

True, but any modern gas car can carry enough gas to get you to where there IS a gas station.

[TAKerry]

Personally, I would love to jump into my truck and head off to work, without having to think about stopping on the way home (sometimes twice a week) and dump another hundred dollar bill into the gas tank. However, 1. I am not sure when the all electric pickup that can haul a full load of construction materials, or pull a trailer with a skid loader will be available and 2. I am quite certain I will NEVER be able to afford to buy one!!  My biggest beef with electric cars is the bottom line, the price! I do ok, but I see no reason to buy a new car just to be the first one on the block or have the shiniest paint, or the newest gadgets. I work hard for my money and would like to keep as much as possible, not go to work 3 days a week to make payments to a bank for the priveledge of driving a new car. So, when a decent, viable used ev comes available for less than 30k I may seriously start looking. But not until then.

[trimacar]

The question I've never seen answered, when we no longer use gasoline for cars, what do we do with it?

 

When oil is refined, one can't say either/or, such as I'll either make oil or gasoline.  Gasoline is a byproduct of the refining process, period.  To get all the hundreds of other things made from petroleum, gasoline must be made.

 

If we stop refining oil, then a LOT of products disappear......from this keyboard and computer case to just about everything plastic, not to mention asphalt for roads and oil for lubrication, the list is long.

 

We are a petroleum based society, and it's going to be quite difficult to change that.

 

The other side of the coin, as mentioned, is that electricity doesn't just magically appear at a plug.  I call this the "behind the wall" syndrome.  A lot of people don't know what goes on behind the wall, all they know is they can plug in an appliance and POOF electricity comes out...California is having difficulty now with power issues, I believe that 40% of all electric vehicles in the U.S. now reside in that state....come home, plug in EV, turn on air conditioner, lights, TV...and the power grid can't keep up with demand...

 

 

[NewOldWood]

I did a little back of the envelpoe math recently. Looked up the kw/hr equivalent of a gallon of gas, gallons burned (in the US) annually, and our annual electricity production. In order to replace all the gas we burn with electricity we would have to more than double out electric generation capacity. This is gasoline only, does not include diesel. We are currently taking base load plants, both hydrocarbon and nuclear, off line and not replacing them. Your future is your electricity demand increasing significantly while the amount of electricity being made available to you being reduced. This is not happening by accident. And then their is our antiquated neglected wholly inadequate electric grid, but that's a whole other can of worms.

 

 

[auburnseeker]

1 hour ago, oldcarfudd said:

True, but any modern gas car can carry enough gas to get you to where there IS a gas station.

If not then it can be carried in an extra 5 gallon can in the back and that will get you to one.  Let me know when we have the equivalent of the electric 5 gallon can. 

 

Of course you could always bring along a generator and enough gas to charge your car,  but that really seems to be the opposite of what they are trying to accomplish.  

[Terry Harper]

My concern is the approach seems to be "one size fits all". We live in a remote, rural farming area. A shopping trip can encompass several towns to source what you need and no matter which direction you go - other than due east which quickly puts you in Canada - its always a 20 mile round trip. Lowe's 20 miles, Walmart 20 miles - you get the picture. Work is a 20 mile round trip. Winter up here is a challenge. We average 100 inches of snow from November through March with temps ranging down to -30F and hovering for weeks a few degrees above or below zero. 

 

EV range falls away dramatically  in cold weather below freezing  - Lithium EV batteries have a fairly limited range of operating temp. When its too cold they need to be heated, when too warm the need to be cooled. Thus in below freezing weather the EV needs to be plugged in with the battery heating when not in use and parked in a heated garage to maintain any decent range. That of course all ads to the cost and subtracts from the appeal.

 

As for the electricity... here in Maine, for over 100 years we had cheap electricity generated by a very extensive hydro electric facilities. Unfortunately, over the last 30 years that system has been largely dismantled to "save the rivers" and bring back the fish. All noble but seemingly short sighted in todays context. (I am still grabbling with how hydro electric is not "green"  - at least here in Maine) We also dismantled our only nuclear power plant after a series of public referendums. Now we import a significant portion of the electricity we use.

 

I greatly appreciate the technology the EV's represent. However, I would rather they develop and succeed based on free market demand as opposed to artificial conditions that work to force their acceptance. To do so begs the question of are they really the only or best solution? 

Edited June 6, 2022 by Terry Harper (see edit history)

[1912Staver]

The best from who's point of view ? The buyer / user or the person making them and selling you one ?

[Restorer32]

I think electrics are the wave of the future and I welcome them.  I would like to test drive one on a dark, very hot and rainy PA night thru the hills of Northern PA.  I want the grandkids to be watching videos in the back seat while I concentrate on my navigation screen in the front while I listen to music on the radio. I would be charging my cell phone also. Oh yea, I would also be towing a small camping trailer with electric brakes.  Those Grandkids do like to camp out. 

[John348]

EV's have a 1/3 segment of the new vehicle market, if they are not for you they are not for you, then don't buy one it is a simple as that.  This has nothing to do with antique cars  

Edited June 6, 2022 by John348 (see edit history)

[1937hd45]

3 minutes ago, John348 said:

EV's have a 1/3 segment of the new vehicle market, if they are not for you they are not for you, then don't buy one it is a simple as that.  This has nothing to do with antique cars  

I wonder why we ran out of interesting things to talk about on an ANTIQUE CAR SITE. If given an electric I'd sell it without sitting in it. 

[John348]

20 minutes ago, 1937hd45 said:

I wonder why we ran out of interesting things to talk about on an ANTIQUE CAR SITE. If given an electric I'd sell it without sitting in it. 

Nobody is going to give you one, so again a moot point. 

Edited June 6, 2022 by John348 (see edit history)

[1912Staver]

In my case at least any antique cars I am interested in have risen in price beyond my reach. Very interested in my brass era project, but next to 0 parts available in my area and travel to any of the meets likely to yield results , Hershey, Turlock etc. is also expensive beyond my reach. 

J.V. with his Mitchel and AHa with his early Buick are the only people on here that appear to be engaged in similar projects. That is an early car reconstruction with both hands tied behind our backs. { read on a very limited budget }

I also like British cars, small bore vintage racing cars but very little interest in these specialized cars on this forum. 

 

 Just seems to leave poking holes in the myths surrounding electrics.

[plymouthcranbrook]

Am I the only one still agitating for hydrogen power?