Restorer32 Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 Posting this here for better exposure. Very few views on the Electric Car forum. Looking for the large GE mercury arc rectifier bulb used on early electric car chargers. We have everything else and the charger is restored cosmetically but now our client wants to make it work if possible. Found one in a museum but for obvious reasons they will not sell. We would happily pay several thousand $ for one of these bulbs in useable condition. Leads? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Gariepy Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 Might help to fill in some back story on this... I've never even heard of a mercury arc rectifier 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Gariepy Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 https://edisontechcenter.org/MercArcRectifiers.html 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank DuVal Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 You mean a Tungar tube? Extra large size or so? Mogul base with a plate cap? Picture? If you do not have one, that might be difficult to do.... Try: antiqueradios.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrspeedyt Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 I'm guessing it just acts as a diode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayne sheldon Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 I remember past threads about wanting this bulb. I am sure part of the issue is that they want to be able to watch the mercury arc rectifier lamp glow while the charger is functioning. Pictures of the right type of mercury arc bulb would help in finding the right one. Also base type and size may be necessary. I am sure there were a few different ones. I have worked with a lot of electronics and electrical power systems over the years. However it was my dad that was a brilliant electrical engineer! He would have loved the challenge of making the original charger work. He passed away getting near twenty years ago now. I would imagine that a selenium rectifier could be bridged in to make the charger function. But I do not think I would trust my judgement to determine the proper size rectifier required for safety. Battery charging is more complicated than even most electrical engineers today understand. I KNOW this because I got in the middle of that issue thirty years ago! When I made a couple predictions, a room full of electrical engineers said they hoped I was wrong, but ten years later I was proven correct. Part of my problem with electrical issues, is that although I know a lot about electricity, and worked for many years at finding and fixing failures for other people? I also know how much I do NOT know! And that makes me doubt myself. I do know one still living engineer that might be able to help adapting something other than a mercury arc rectifier? He retired for the third time a few years ago, and is well up in age. He may not be available or willing at this time, but I could reach out to him if you like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8E45E Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 Shipping one across the country might be more of an issue. Craig 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfloro Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 (edited) 34 minutes ago, wayne sheldon said: I am sure part of the issue is that they want to be able to watch the mercury arc rectifier lamp glow while the charger is functioning. Look at this one glow in 1911...! Mr. Samuel Whitestone was an early adopter of personal electric transportation since he was the GE moneyman... Note the very clean and precise installation. The Mercury Arc Rectifier sure beats using a Rotary Converter... Edited May 23, 2022 by pfloro (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank DuVal Posted May 24, 2022 Share Posted May 24, 2022 5 hours ago, wayne sheldon said: I would imagine that a selenium rectifier could be bridged in to make the charger function. Selenium went out of style once silicon became cheaper. Silicon never gives off that awful rotten egg smell when they die like selenium does. Lots of silicon diode choices out there. But silicon will never give off that wonderful blueish purple glow when operating correctly!👍 Restorer, is there any information on the charger about the rectifier needed? Have any measurements of the socket and mount? Hard to find one without this information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted May 24, 2022 Author Share Posted May 24, 2022 The owner now wants it restored to useable condition to charge his 1918 Rauch & Lang we restored for him. Like the car, he wants only original parts used. We restored the thing cosmetically several years ago as he wanted and shipped it to France where he lives. This certainly complicates matters but we will do what we can to locate the proper bulb. Another complication arises due to the fact that these bulbs contain several ounces of metallic mercury. There are very strict rules when it comes to shipping anything containing mercury. He is sending pics of the unit. It is a GE unit commonly seen in old photos of electrics being charged at home. Very similar to the chargers in use pictured above. Owner is willing to hire an electrical engineer in France if necessary to get the thing working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank DuVal Posted May 24, 2022 Share Posted May 24, 2022 In your search, remember the term is tube, electron tube, rectifier tube or mercury rectifier. Tungar is GE's trademark name for theirs, there are others. You either illuminate area with a bulb or plant a bulb, as we say in the electronics industry. Ha!😆 Of course I'm sure you could read a book with the illumination of the tube shown in the GE charger photo!🤣 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfloro Posted May 24, 2022 Share Posted May 24, 2022 (edited) 6 hours ago, Restorer32 said: Owner is willing to hire an electrical engineer in France if necessary to get the thing working I truly hope the owner realizes that finding a functional "MAR" is going to be very difficult. The old chargers probably languished in garages, barns, and service stations after they were no longer needed. Compared to service station gasoline pumps, how many were made for that fairly short period of electrics...? Imagine those mercury filled globes breaking when the chargers were hauled to the dump... The MAR replaced the Rotary Converter in providing DC track power (~625V) for mass transit systems and were used up until the 60s or 70s. However, these MARs were designed for 3 phase AC input unlike residential chargers which worked with single phase power. I suspect that the other electrical components in the charger are designed to specifically accommodate the electrical characteristics of a given MAR. I don't think a simple substitution of solid state components can be made... This being said, I would be thrilled to see this charger function as it did a century ago...! *** Of course I'm sure you could read a book with the illumination of the tube shown in the GE charger photo! Fun Fact: in that 1911 photograph, the MAR's glow was really not that bright. The B/W film emulsions of the day were orthochromatic. They were overly sensitive to blue & violet light, somewhat to green, and not at all to red. There was also sensitivity in the ultraviolet area of the visible spectrum. I believe there was some UV emitted by the vaporized mercury. However, the glow is impressive...! In the silent picture era, orthochromatic film was the standard. Panchromatic negative was available on special order from Eastman Kodak but it was pricey. "Pan" took over by the later 1920s. If you wanted clothing to photograph black, the actor wore red...! Makeup was used to tone down tanned skin and reddish lips. Films of that era had a unique "high contrast" look which was at least partly caused by the orthochromatic film. Paul Edited May 24, 2022 by pfloro (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexRiv_63 Posted May 24, 2022 Share Posted May 24, 2022 Give this guy a call. 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted May 25, 2022 Author Share Posted May 25, 2022 Actually I have found several tubes still in their original shipping boxes, just not the right one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SC38dls Posted May 25, 2022 Share Posted May 25, 2022 You might try Richardson electronics in the far western suburbs of Chicago, near St Charles. They make all kinds of equipment for old very large welding equipment. Sorry I don’t have a number for them. Two brothers owned the company one was a neighbor his name is Art Richardson and lived in Wayne Illinois. dave s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted May 31, 2022 Author Share Posted May 31, 2022 Here is what we are dealing with. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhigdog Posted May 31, 2022 Share Posted May 31, 2022 Give Boris Karloff a call. I think he had one of those...........Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted May 31, 2022 Author Share Posted May 31, 2022 The back board is actually 1' thick red-brown slate. Quite a work of industrial art. Found a book on e-bay which details the working theory and operation of this thing. Hoping it arrives today. Upping our bounty for a useable tube to $3500. Maybe that will help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted May 31, 2022 Author Share Posted May 31, 2022 Another pic, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1912Staver Posted May 31, 2022 Share Posted May 31, 2022 The rectifier is the large box at the bottom ? Is the tube a replaceable part on the inside, or do you need the whole thing ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfloro Posted May 31, 2022 Share Posted May 31, 2022 (edited) 29 minutes ago, 1912Staver said: The rectifier is the large box at the bottom ? Is the tube a replaceable part on the inside, or do you need the whole thing ? No..., the metal box at the bottom houses the transformer. The MAR is a replaceable part. The glass "tube" mounts on the back clamped by the big "insect" claws... Paul Edited May 31, 2022 by pfloro (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted May 31, 2022 Author Share Posted May 31, 2022 The MAR is about 18" tall and is shaped like an upside down pear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted May 31, 2022 Author Share Posted May 31, 2022 What I also found interesting while restoring a 1918 Rauch & Lang Electric and the 1921 Milburn Electric was that the headlights were 90 Volt, as were the dome lights etc. The horns were even 84 volts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1912Staver Posted May 31, 2022 Share Posted May 31, 2022 I doubt Pep Boys keep those bulbs in stock . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted May 31, 2022 Author Share Posted May 31, 2022 For ease of maintenance we modified the wiring a bit so the lights were all 12 volts although 90 volt bulbs are available. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatima Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 (edited) On 5/23/2022 at 10:05 AM, Restorer32 said: Posting this here for better exposure. Very few views on the Electric Car forum. Looking for the large GE mercury arc rectifier bulb used on early electric car chargers. We have everything else and the charger is restored cosmetically but now our client wants to make it work if possible. Found one in a museum but for obvious reasons they will not sell. We would happily pay several thousand $ for one of these bulbs in useable condition. Leads? Are you still interested in one? I have one. It’s still IN THE ORIGINAL UNOPENED BOX. I can send you more information. General Electric Mercury Arc This a picture of one alike. the one I have is still new unopened box place of origin Schenectady, Bridgeport maker GE Company (1892-present) fatcarvac@gmail.com Fatima Edited February 17 by Fatima Added more information (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatima Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 On 5/23/2022 at 10:05 AM, Restorer32 said: Posting this here for better exposure. Very few views on the Electric Car forum. Looking for the large GE mercury arc rectifier bulb used on early electric car chargers. We have everything else and the charger is restored cosmetically but now our client wants to make it work if possible. Found one in a museum but for obvious reasons they will not sell. We would happily pay several thousand $ for one of these bulbs in useable condition. Leads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatima Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 Hi are you still interested in one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted February 19 Author Share Posted February 19 Thanks but we found one and managed to get it hand carried to our client in Paris. Because these bulbs contain about 4 ounces of liquid mercury it is illegal to ship them via Fed Ex, UPS, USPS or other carriers without a major hastle . FYI our client paid $5500 for the one we found him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Mead Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 Do you know if the Valued Client was able to get it working ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHa Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 Maybe he would like a spare? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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