1929 Cadillac sedan - $35,000 (Toluca lake)

[Guest]

 

https://losangeles.craigslist.org/lac/cto/d/north-hollywood-1929-cadillac-sedan/7459944629.html

All original Cadillac survivors!!!!!! V8 drives great 67,119 miles $35,000!!!!! Maybe trade for anything in value, let me know what you got, if you see this ad that means it’s available so don’t ask, make sure you have $ before asking questions, don’t offer me offers on phone show contact info
 Title in hand

Hovik (310) 386-3238

[m-mman]

Interesting not bad, nice original.  

But as we have learned on these cars the real money is in the details and I already see some broken die cast. All the mechanicals are suspect until proven otherwise. 

Also top of the value range for a closed car. 

[Steve_Mack_CT]

Seems high on price but looks pretty intact overall.  See what Eddie has to say.

[chief5]

Didn't he say anything to it ?

 

[edinmass]

On 3/22/2022 at 4:45 PM, Steve_Mack_CT said:

Seems high on price but looks pretty intact overall.  See what Eddie has to say.

Looks nice. Above comments on die cast are correct. Sorting and finishing will cost more than most think. Like the rear spare double…..rare and unusual. I have a number in mind much lower than asking……..it’s a fun vs return issue. Lots of interesting turn key cars for much less……maybe not Cadillac……….overall it’s probably gonna sit for ten more years till the family wants it gone at a market price.

[Matt Harwood]

I sold my restored '29 Cadillac sedan for not much more than the asking price of this one.

 

[rcr]

When this was a Pennsylvania car, I did a lot of work on it. Original Cadillac hot water heater and Cadillac Kelch underfloor rear heater as well and working original radio I think it was a Roamio. Everything worked properly on this and broken die cast parts were replaced. It was 100% complete and drove well. Maybe a little blow by but good transmission (first synchromesh in 1929) and clutch. Reliable.

 

[chief5]

On 4/12/2022 at 5:48 PM, rcr said:

When this was a Pennsylvania car, I did a lot of work on it. Original Cadillac hot water heater and Cadillac Kelch underfloor rear heater as well and working original radio I think it was a Roamio. Everything worked properly on this and broken die cast parts were replaced. It was 100% complete and drove well. Maybe a little blow by but good transmission (first synchromesh in 1929) and clutch. Reliable.

 

Thank you a lot for sharing your knowledge on this.

Is there any further history on this vehicle known to exist? I did some research on the numbers but yet didn't find anything.

We have no information on the car except that it was registered (and driven) in Pennsylvania before it was relocated in L.A.  That cadillac looks to be original and well maintained. The car should have been a hotrod rebuild, but for the reason that it has been so well preserved (obviously with patina) the owner decided not to take it apart.

There is also a youtube video i think: 

 

any comment is appreciated

 

[rcr]

Left here and was shipped to Wisconsin by widow of George Crapo the man who owned and loved the car. She claimed she was keeping his car.

 

[JRA]

In late 1920’s, the usage of potmetal became very frequent and we can face today challenges during restoring work. Regarding Cadillac, when this problem is worse 1928/29/30 ? Does it mean that 1925/26/27 and 1931/32/33… Cadillac owners do not face this issue? Or this problem window is worse?

thanks

 

[edinmass]

1929-1932 are particularly bad. Storage and environmental conditions play a big part in the amount of suffering you WILL have. Caddy's of this vintage are difficult for many reasons, and it should never be your first old car. 

[chief5]

So i have good and bad news regarding this Cadillac.

At first the bad news:   that car has already been sold!

.. and now the good one: I'm the lucky guy

 

Well i really hope to get lucky with this car. Of course it's an antique piece of machinery and have to be taken care of in such way.

As i learned some details of the previous owner/driver (thanks @rcr) chances are very good that this car has been taken care of in the past.

But that cracking potmetal could really be an issue. If exchange parts are available they will suffer the same kind of braking like zinc pest. Remanufacturing

those parts is never an easy job and sometimes impossible.

 

So what - i took the chance.. and for me it's not the first old car.

Not the complete history is known yet, but from what i know at this point is that this car could be on the road again.

 

As soon it arrives i'll post some pictures and introduce it to you.

 

 

[Guest]

Congratulations Chief! 

 

[alsancle]

I'm with Ed on the double rear spare.   A neat feature never or rarely seen on sedans.   Hopefully the mechanics are decent for you.

[John_S_in_Penna]

Yes, congratulations to Chief.

It's always satisfying to see old cars going to

someone who will appreciate them.

[Leif in Calif]

Very exciting indeed! Lucky You! Can't cracked pot metal be soldered and re-plated? 

[edinmass]

By strange coincidence I ended up driving a 29 Cadillac convertible this morning. 

[edinmass]

Congratulations on your new car. 

[wayne sheldon]

I like the car! I hope it treats you well. Fifty years ago, I had a good friend that had a 1929 Cadillac five passenger sedan. It was a great riding car then. I often wonder what became of the friend, and the several nice cars he and his dad had.

[edinmass]

 

Chief......take your time, and don't take it apart. Cars sitting for long periods of time need to be gone through. The car has leather rear axel seals....things will need attention. I would start by doing a wet and dry compression test, and dropping the oil pan. Get a feel for the engine.....BEFORE you do anything else. Like most things in life, a good plan and some evaluation time are worth the effort. People here are happy to walk you through it. Be aware many parts on that car are fragile.....carburetor, distributor, ect........to much force with a wrench and you will be hunting for parts. Go slow........and use correct tools. Shortcuts will kick you in the axx. 

[chief5]

10 hours ago, edinmass said:

 

Chief......take your time, and don't take it apart. Cars sitting for long periods of time need to be gone through. The car has leather rear axel seals....things will need attention. I would start by doing a wet and dry compression test, and dropping the oil pan. Get a feel for the engine.....BEFORE you do anything else. Like most things in life, a good plan and some evaluation time are worth the effort. People here are happy to walk you through it. Be aware many parts on that car are fragile.....carburetor, distributor, ect........to much force with a wrench and you will be hunting for parts. Go slow........and use correct tools. Shortcuts will kick you in the axx. 

That's exactly the way to go in my opinion! PS: I can live with oil leaks on the floor

 

The most important thing is to get familiar with it: how everything works (or should work the correct way), where are the typical problems, etc...

So i have already ordered the standard manuals and started diggin. Sometimes this is quite fun

And last but not least as Jay Leno is always saying: join the community! So i joined here when the ad was in craigslist to learn from you folks - thank you!

You all must have great knowledge and "feeling" of these type of cars so i'm glad and willing to learn.

 

I don't intend to take it apart without a good reason, especially if it's in original condition. The best cars are the untouched unrestored but well maintained ones that are driven occasionally.

In the past I was more the mopar guy (dodge) but we also had my friends desoto complete rebuild. My last full restoration took 10 1/2 years to complete. But now I'm gettin older and don't want every single piece correctly nickel / zinc plated, repainted,  rechromed or powder coated, polished etc  anymore. This Cadillac is not to be restored.. it will be repaired to factory specifications if needed.

Hunting for parts is not easy i know that for sure. But at least i already have found that missing lock on the door of the toolbox / battery tray. How does it look like to drive without it?

 

So let's see what we get .. and what follows is standard procedure:  check fluids and oils - change oils, check engine condition, battery and cables, fasteners, suspension, wheels, etc.

and then you could hear from the speed and sound of cranking (without spark) in what overall condition the cylinders where. After checking compression i hope to find some cross patterns on the cylinder walls.

If that is ok: testdrive it.

Actually the car does run, but the shipper will not drive it but haul on the trailer. It's at the shipper right now. I'm really looking forward to it

 

 

Edited May 9, 2022 by chief5 (see edit history)

[edinmass]

If a 29 Cadillac isn’t leaking, it’s out of oil.

Looks like a 1950’s repaint. The car would have had factory pin stripes on the belt line and around the window surrounds. Overall looks relatively stock. The radio is not factory at all, and Cadillac didn’t have a hot water till late 30, and there were three styles……all fairly rare. The Kelso in floor heater looks aftermarket. The one I have seen that are factory are much different. Roof top material looks like a good job that was a replacement. The video isn’t very clear…….so these are general observations. Carburetor cover is intact ……..that’s rare. Over all looks like a nice solid car. Love the Mohair upholstery.

 

[m-mman]

3 hours ago, chief5 said:

So let's see what we get .. and what follows is standard procedure:  check fluids and oils - change oils, check engine condition, battery and cables, fasteners, suspension, wheels, etc.

 

3 hours ago, chief5 said:

If that is ok: testdrive it.

You didnt mention fuel system. . . . I havent seen it mentioned in the description but what fuel delivery system in it using? 

The factory Johnson carb will not tolerate an electric pump. (extreme fire risk) 

It SHOULD be operated ONLY through use of the vacuum tank. 

Do you understand how to prime, check, test a vacuum tank? 

 

3 hours ago, chief5 said:

After checking compression i hope to find some cross patterns on the cylinder walls.

Uhhhh. . . . are you saying that you plan to remove the heads?  (or bore scope?) 

Warning if you try to remove the heads be prepared for heads stuck to studs and studs stuck in the block. 

 

It is said to be a running car, but a danger of any long parked flathead V-8, is stuck valves. Hopefully yours are all free. 

 

Copies of the original manuals and parts books are readily available, however they are pathetic. They are sorely lacking in information. There are few if any exploded views and much knowledge came to me through experimentation. (and of course some breakage) on my 29. 

Also FYI - you can contact Cadillac Historical services and get a copy of the original build card. 

Edited May 10, 2022 by m-mman (see edit history)

[chief5]

All Valves are supposed to be free and no misfires have been observed. Therefore it's just checking all the spark plugs for proper burning or misfires and inspect trough the holes.. valves, carbon buildup..

Removing heads would be an option only when bend or stuck valves occur or other excessive problems have to be addressed before developing engine trouble.

If this happens i can tell it'll end up in magnafluxing block and heads, grinding and smoothing sharp edges on oil passages, polishing the exhaust runners, finding parts and gaskets or bothering with broken studs and leaking manifolds.

As far as i observed in that video, rust is a problem on the a pillars, fenders and some places at the frame. Especially the toolbox and battery tray rusted away and will have to be re-welded in place.

What i see is a different color on the rear passenger door and all that red/black is fading away. There are white pin stripes on the black window surrounds still visible somewhat but its hard to tell. On the lower front passenger door there is a fisher body emblem. So if i am not mistaken this could be from the factory.

 

There is some kind of a hole in the firewall trough the cadillac plate and another hole for a rod to the distributor (advance/retard?), the rod is missing.

Very few oil leaks at the rear axle housing and transmission. This doesn't look to bad.

Hopefully its just tweaking and regreasing - and really good cleaning.

The interior is in nice shape therefore it has to be left all in place, just really clean it up.

Maybe the floor-mat at front have to be replaced - if anything adequate is available.

Edited May 10, 2022 by chief5 (see edit history)

[edinmass]

Early Cadillacs of that era should have the pan dropped. It’s common for the cotter pins to come out of the rods……..and sometimes you find valve keepers down there also. The engine is VERY prone to sludge accumulation……and modern detergent oils can and often will break it all loose. The oil filter is a bypass system……..so it’s best to be wary of it. The oil pan screen is also prone to plugging. I would NOT pull rod caps……bearing delimitation is a huge problem on these original engines. Like someone posted……electric fuel pumps will burn it to the ground. Don’t even try. The distributor housings are very prone to pot metal failure. The distributor should be put on a Sun tester and set up correctly and check to see if the advance is working……it’s probably off. Other than the crappy Johnson carburetors and float set up…….that’s all you have to worry about for initial start up and sorting. They tend to pop out of seconded gear unless you replace all the detent springs and shifter spring. It will be a fun driver………understand that this isn’t a 350 Chevy……..it does not take the revs well…….do NOT spin it fast or for long periods of time. It’s a 42 mph car……..anything more and you will scatter the engine. I still recommend a compression test wet and dry…….that will tell you exactly what you need to know about the motor. Good luck, Ed.

 

If you look below…….you will see I have owned and driven these things for over 40 years. Owned over a dozen of them over time, and probably have 50k miles going down the road in them. Fun cars……..but they have their shortcomings and bad habits. All can be overcome with time and effort. 

Edited May 11, 2022 by edinmass (see edit history)

[chief5]

I was already wondering what speed the sweet spot is.. assumed it is more like 50 mph, but 42 hey that's fine. I've got other cars to race with, this is a cruiser..

It is self-evident not to change to negative ground or to a 12V system, electric fuel pump ... or to overspeed the engine.

 

You have a really impressive vita! i guess you could write stories..

That was a lot of information right to the point. It feels a lot better knowing how to deal with it, thank you all very much!

[rcr]

The original vacuum tank worked flawlessly as did the Johnson carburetor on this car. I don’t believe I mentioned anything about a “Kelso” heater. The Kelch under floor heater was the one shown in the service bulletins (serviceman) and the original Cadillac hot water heater was from 1931. Although the radio was not a Cadillac one, it certainly is a period radio as one was not offered yet in 1929. Everything worked very well on this car and the only issue was some blow by. It could cruise at 50 all day but has a hill country rear axle ratio. Did you get the original build sheet as I had gotten it for George.

 

[edinmass]

I would be interested to see the heater..........there were several different styles, 99 percent are aftermarket Southwind. My bad on "Kelso" as I was looking at a sign as I typed it. There is a 1929 Factory Accessories Catalog printed in bright orange listing all the goodies you could buy.......lap robes, trunks, air compressors, handy kits, hinge mirrors, wind wings, it was a large selection of stuff available in 29.....not so much stuff later. 

[rcr]

 

[chief5]

The car is delayed on the way.. no other news yet from the shipper.

 

 

[chief5]

.. finally the cadillac arrived yesterday!! 😀

The car is in good condition!

 

It took 4 people to move it on the trailer, both rear tires were flat.

Very few broken/missing parts (crank/handle for the front window glas, some screws etc..)

Roof started to deteriorate at front..

It is leaking oil from the engine and rear axle.

We did not have started it yet.. wanted to check it first and make an oil change.

.. looking forward to fire it up  🙃