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A 1917 White Finds A New Caretaker


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Posted (edited)

Earlier today I sat with Ken at his kitchen table in the house he was born in 85 years ago.

 

On the farm his Grandfather bought back in 1881.

 

4226B2EF-F9E3-4A2F-AAB5-70495FEACAFF.jpeg.2cb73276454c22972c9a3d5ff5ee4f79.jpeg

 

We had just concluded a FaceTime call with

the next Steward of an interesting car that

certainly is a Survivor.

 

0EE8A4D5-D8BE-442A-A2F4-3FD93D54267D.jpeg.0479a7da3cef8943dd456e593ca41cc2.jpeg
 

I had committed to buying the car last Friday - but then Monday I found the museum I was planning on loaning it to had no room and my friend Mark was not available to do the work I wanted done.

 

So - I carefully considered the options.

 

The first name on the short list was the obvious choice - he welcomed the opportunity.

 

Reviewing the paperwork at the kitchen table - I was able to document the anecdotal history of prior ownership.

 

50AEA534-F8BE-431F-B318-F8F9E76C7A04.jpeg.5d8a719beac0096730cc9b22da37c808.jpeg

 

Then Ken & John & I went and had a great

lunch in the town square.

 

The new steward is well known here.

 

Doing what is best for a historically significant surviving vehicle may not fatten your wallet - but it will certainly confirm what you believe about yourself to be true.

 

 

Jim

 

 

Edited by Trulyvintage (see edit history)
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1 minute ago, alsancle said:

Jim,

 

Hopefully the new steward is the guy with more mechanical skills than personality (and looks).


Rumor has it he is very good looking, and has more charm than Don Juan, but I was also told he couldn’t fix his way out of a paper bag. One thing for sure......that car will will be popular with the ladies! 😏

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Already checked it........It’s a very small place. Probably a big estate that was torn down post war and cut up into tiny lots.

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28 minutes ago, edinmass said:


Rumor has it he is very good looking, and has more charm than Don Juan, but I was also told he couldn’t fix his way out of a paper bag. One thing for sure......that car will will be popular with the ladies! 😏

 

Does he look like Manny Dragone?

MysteryBoob.jpg

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Ed. so type out the freaking address, already!  Sneak up here while you're at Pebble and I'll photograph your smiling face at that address--but we will need to be armed....

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1 minute ago, alsancle said:

 

Does he look like Manny Dragone?

MysteryBoob.jpg


 

You know.........sometimes you can really cross the line...............

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Grimy said:

Ed. so type out the freaking address, already!  Sneak up here while you're at Pebble and I'll photograph your smiling face at that address--but we will need to be armed....


 

348 24th Ave if I remember correctly........looks like the whole area is post war construction. I’ll bring my Tavor 95.........and my 200 round drum. We can make our way over to Orin’s house.......it’s only three miles away. That’s seven miles closer to safety than your place.

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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This thread really offends me, since Ed is such a good friend...I can swear that he’s twice as good looking as he’d be if he was half as good looking as he is...

 

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Ed, just don't wear silly tactical gear, look nerdy and harmless as usual (shouldn't be hard).  I have enough "sporting goods" for both of us.....but I never want trouble because the paperwork is overwhelming.

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The car had never been named.

Since Ken’s father was actually the one 

that purchased it from the widow of the 

fourth ? owner - I thought it fitting the car

carry with it his name.

 

Meet “ Billy “

 

DABB56B4-245C-4E43-89DC-5801C4D101DB.jpeg.0dba178828530d1f22753ae8dc45c1cd.jpeg
 

Ken’s father was nicknamed “ Billy “

as a child - because of his determination

stubbornness and resolve - it was a

abbreviation for “ Billygoat “.


 

Jim 

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Interesting enough, the other 1917 White is named Dave.

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Mark Wetherbee said:

Cornering the market?? 
 

Once you get good ID on the dash clock please post it, there’s this guy who needs one...


 

That’s why I bought it,needed a clock.......and it had a car attached! Not too practical.....but car guys are not too bright.

 

How do you corner a market on non existing cars? 

 

 

BBD0B310-D612-431C-A0D4-395944DDC209.png

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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Known Documented Ownership History

Starting With The Mechanic

 

A California mechanic performed repairs

that went unpaid - he took the owner(s)

to court - received a judgment - owner(s)

turned over the vehicle & paperwork.

 

This occurred in 1925 or earlier.

 

Robert Lee Harris was the mechanic.

The serial number on the car was “ 511 “.

 

B483EBD3-7A11-48A2-8180-0EF280A69D88.jpeg.8249ae0476d38cccd908d2fdd3ed1909.jpeg

 

The same number appears on the engine

of the car and on the current title.

 

FE5A3B3D-D014-497E-8968-360516CA2541.jpeg.d0480cdd9362ee0020b3796167d630ba.jpeg

 

FB67551B-10A0-4F9A-BE41-95B8AEBE6EF4.jpeg.ffccdeb934c807e995d1c53c97a19b1a.jpeg

 

Ken called Robert in California when the car was acquired by Ken and his father “ Billy “ sometime after 1974.

 

At first - Robert didn’t remember owning

it - then he recalled getting it as payment

for his mechanical services.

 

 

Jim

 

 

 

 

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20 minutes ago, edinmass said:

Just for fun, a video taken before I bought the car.........

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4yPVTi7VRo

@edinmassthat car is being picked up a l-o-n-g way from Oakland!  I saved and printed the photo of the title, and the 24th Avenue street number has FOUR digits but I can't make it out--when you get the title in hand, please eyeball it with a magnifying glass at different angles and let me know.  Checked a map--anything below 1400 24th Ave got wiped out in the construction of the Nimitz Freeway in the 1946-49 immediate postwar period (we call it the Nitwits Fwy these days).  As an inducement to a close examination, there are a number of Victorian and Edwardian large homes still left in that area, a few restored; others got torn down for cheap post-mounted, park-underneath apt buildings ca. 1962--which is a long story and why I've been obsessed with Unintended Consequences ever since.  I used to deliver election supplies in East Oakland when it was a nice place to live.

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, trimacar said:

Sorry, I prefer David.....

 


 

Ok, we shall rename it............”Trim”.......in honor of Trimacar.........😏 we all need some trim after all. You pay the court costs for thr name change! Now, we shall see how many people know the reference.........after all. It’s era appropriate! 🥸

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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Posted (edited)

Let’s turn this thread on its head.......name the coach builder.............don’t post if I told you already. Only answers from people without inside info............Inquiring minds want to know. “Trim” has an unfair advantage............😝

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, John Bloom said:

Looking forward to the details of this story Ed.  


 

It’s three cars down the schedule............it could be a while.

 

Already started accumulating missing items.........

 

 

Up next.....1929 Stearns Knight eight

then 1932 Boat tail 

and 1917 White......

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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The Retired Oil Field Worker In Prescott

 

The next owner of record appears to be

A.W. Nelson of Prescott, Arizona.

 

He was a retired oil field worker.

 

Mr. Nelson surrendered the California 

pink slip to Arizona Motor Vehicle Dept.

 

Luckily he requested & retained the 

cancelled document when he received 

an Arizona title.

 

This happened prior to 1974.

 

397C85B6-C2BB-471D-9D99-D25CBEBE868F.jpeg.7215557fa8863c8bc88000db21ad0beb.jpeg

 

Jim

 

 

 

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8 hours ago, edinmass said:


 

It’s three cars down the schedule............it could be a while.

 

Already started accumulating missing items.........

 

 

Up next.....1929 Stearns Knight eight

then 1932 Boat tail 

and 1917 White......

Did you just give us a hint as to what the mystery car is??? 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, SC38DLS said:

Did you just give us a hint as to what the mystery car is??? 

 

Mail your contribution check towards the restoration to my home address...........that's how the others found out............😇

 

Sorry Dave, you know how I am! I'm having too much fun to spill the beans. I will say, it's not what you think, and you can never guess it, as it's so obscure it makes Duesenberg's look common.

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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Just now, mdsbob said:

Kuntz

 

 

Well done! You won a chance to drive it................🤪 Got to watch out for those people!

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Posted (edited)

The Retired Lockheed Aircraft Engineer


Interesting how aviation folks are attracted to early complex automobiles.

 

In my research into “ Alexander “ - the 1904 Ford Model B - the gentleman who saved it from the scrapper was a former WW2 pilot.
 

Herb Bubeck would become the next

owner of record after meeting a fellow HCCA member at The Queen Mary in

Long Beach, California at a convention.

 

Mr. Bubeck would drive the White from

Prescott, Arizona to Georgia without incident.

 

FE804880-5337-48D0-9295-BED1CE2D0DAA.jpeg.cdbab81d53afaeea417866da78b13084.jpeg

 

 

Jim

Edited by Trulyvintage (see edit history)
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The phone rang and the next old car adventure began................ Some people have all the fun but at least the rest of us get to live vicariously through their adventures.

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11 minutes ago, pkhammer said:

The phone rang and the next old car adventure began................ Some people have all the fun but at least the rest of us get to live vicariously through their adventures.


 

Come on down and drive them.......live the adventure. Life is short.....take advantage of this wonderful nation we live in. There is always something interesting to drive around here........today’s list.......V-16 60 miles, Stearns Knight eight 10 miles, 1917 White 20 miles, 2006 Ford Focus 5 miles, 2005 GMC 4 miles. Also walked the dogs three times. After lunch, something interesting.......to be determined. Feels like it’s about to Lycoming........😎

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21 minutes ago, edinmass said:


 

Come on down and drive them.......live the adventure. Life is short.....take advantage of this wonderful nation we live in. There is always something interesting to drive around here........today’s list.......V-16 60 miles, Stearns Knight eight 10 miles, 1917 White 20 miles, 2006 Ford Focus 5 miles, 2005 GMC 4 miles. Also walked the dogs three times. After lunch, something interesting.......to be determined. Feels like it’s about to Lycoming........😎

 We were talking about taking the Amtrak Auto Train out of Lorton for some event in Florida then Covid-19 came along. We need to start looking at that again plus we have friends at St. Joe Beach we'd like to visit. When/if that happens you'll be hearing from me and I'll bring a copy of this email with me just in case I need to prove you typed it. You know, just in case you've had too much Crown today. 😁

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I wonder if demanding payment for Canadian Whisky in vintage car units would help alleviate the old car imbalance between Canada and the Eastern U.S. ?

Crown Royal comes from Manitoba , which is the Start of Western Canada. Say for every ton of Crown shipped to Ed's part of the world, a ton of Pre War car has to be sent to those of us outcast in the boonies of the North West.

 Might be the start of a whole new chapter in Canada / U.S. trade.

 

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1 hour ago, pkhammer said:

 We were talking about taking the Amtrak Auto Train out of Lorton for some event in Florida then Covid-19 came along. We need to start looking at that again plus we have friends at St. Joe Beach we'd like to visit. When/if that happens you'll be hearing from me and I'll bring a copy of this email with me just in case I need to prove you typed it. You know, just in case you've had too much Crown today. 😁


 

I have never had too much Crown Royal so that I couldn’t still lay down on the ground and hold myself from falling off the face of the earth. It’s been close a few times........but I managed to keep my grip.

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CRIMINY !

 

17 hours ago, Trulyvintage said:

 

397C85B6-C2BB-471D-9D99-D25CBEBE868F.jpeg.7215557fa8863c8bc88000db21ad0beb.jpeg

 

Jim

 

Eureka Califunny!

I have family in Eureka. I actually lived in Humboldt county for nearly four years. Harvey Harper opened a Ford dealership along about 1912 (I forget the actual year?), which is still in business and considered to be one of the oldest Ford dealerships still in business. In his later years, he had quite a collection of antique automobiles! Good stuff, dozens of cars including 1903 Knox, Locomobiles, 1917 Winton. I knew the caretaker somewhat, he was a nice fellow and always spoke well of Harvey Harper. I visited the collection several times. I did meet a member of the Harper family, he was much younger, and also seemed quite nice, and involved with the local antique car activities.

The collection was mostly sold off after Harvey passed on. A longtime best friend of mine helped with appraisals and disposition of the cars.

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The California top is a redeeming feature of the car, a fabulous find...though my thought is that the people in the video were missing some knowledge of how it worked...nevertheless a fabulous find.  I’ve offered free storage to Ed, with usufruct, we’ll see if that works!  I have a guy who’s great on getting the inscrutable going down the road again, if that helps!  Finding people who can unscrew the inscrutable is rare these days....

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  • Trulyvintage changed the title to A 1917 White Finds A New Caretaker

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