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Best Value in a Roadster


John Bloom
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So a buddy and I were talking about Dream cars that could be realistic and I mentioned that I love Roadsters and  would like to have an example of one to keep for the long haul.  We talked through lots of models and it got me thinking about what is the "best value" in a Roadster of the earlier Classic Era.  I realize some may say "this Model J roadster for 1.4 million is a great value.......I was thinking much more modestly than that.  From two eras, 1925-1928 and then from 1929-1931, what Roadsters do you think of when you focus on value that still have the looks to keep you deeply in love for the long haul?

 

I wrote this a week ago, didn't post it, but Ed's comments recently about a Chrysler series 72 roadster that seems like a good value, reminded me that I had written this and never asked to hear others input.  It may be hard to do this without some guidance on what is the ceiling for cost and what kind of condition will you accept, so I would be interested in cars that would be under 100,000 in a Class 3 (or better) condition.  What comes to mind for some of you related to a good Value Roadster?

 

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JUST A SHORT NOTE....Most companies stopped building true roadsters in the 1930/1931/1932 model year. Thus, you may or may not want to consider convertible coupes. Simply, drivability is what dictates price. The better the driver, the more valuable the car..............a Series 80/81 Pierce can be bought in the mid 50's for a very nice car.......like 90 points plus. With a high speed rear, they are very good drivers. Whey won't keep up with an 8. It's all a compromise. 

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2 minutes ago, edinmass said:

JUST A SHORT NOTE....Most companies stopped building true roadsters in the 1930/1931/1932 model year. Thus, you may or may not want to consider convertible coupes. Simply, drivability is what dictates price. The better the driver, the more valuable the car..............a Series 80/81 Pierce can be bought in the mid 50's for a very nice car.......like 90 points plus. With a high speed rear, they are very good drivers. Whey won't keep up with an 8. It's all a compromise. 

Ed, that is a good point.  I've been looking at different models through the years with their convertible coupe vice Roadster.  In some models, they both look great, in others, the the Roadster is just a lot sexier.  I guess it depends on each individual model as to considering convertible coupes.  Those raked windshields move me......

 

I like the Pierce Roadsters of that era.  The lack of speed in those big 6's vice an 8 is an important point, but not something to cause me to take a pass.  I will confess this is a highly visual thing to me......  

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2 hours ago, John Bloom said:

got me thinking about what is the "best value" in a Roadster of the earlier Classic Era.

Not a roadster but that 90 series convertible coupe that was mentioned in another post recently sounds pretty appealing for the money. It may come up a little short on panache but I recall someone commenting on here that in some ways that car is even better than a Caddy of the same era.

Oh sorry, I just noticed you're discussing pre '31. Please disregard🤐

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Styling is great and you have to love what you see, but if you don't fit behind the wheel comfortably due to the lack of being able to move the seat back so you can accommodate you leg length then you won't like or use the car for anything more then a quick trip to a local store to run an errand. In the many decades I have owned and driven the era that roadsters were made ,I was happy to have been in them but knew that if I had to be there for over an hour long trip I would be paying the price with aches afterwards. People in that era were much shorter then they are now.

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I thought I'd start doing some research on the earlier year group of my initial post: (1925-1928 Roadsters).  Since Ed brought up Pierce Arrow's model 80, I'm going to dig in for a few days and look at what Pierce Arrow offered in Roadster platforms during those years.  After that, I'll look in the same year group (1925-1928) at other American made options: Cadillac, Packard, Lincoln, Chrysler, Studebaker President, Stutz, Marmon, ??????? (help me out here for other makes to research in that year range of Classics with a roadster platform.

 

Pierce Arrow Roadster Options 1925-1928:

 

In 1925, Pierce had two lines, the 33 series which rode on a 138 inch wheelbase, and the 80 series that rode on a 130 inch wheelbase.  By 1925, the 80 series was in its second year of the model run.  The 33 had a 414.7 Six and four wheel mechanical brakes, the 80 had a 288.7 Six and I believe it also had four wheel mechanical brakes?  In 1927, the 33 series became the 36 series, still on a 138 inch wheelbase, and in 1928 the 80 series became the 81 series.  What input for those Pierce Roadsters (Runabouts?) do you have?  I'm sure Ed and other Pierce guys could write a book about my naive question.  I initially put in my post "a class 3 car or better under 100,000".  Ed said that a 80/81 Roadster can be bought well for the mid 50's.  Can a 33 Roadster be bought today for under 100,000?  I saw one sold at auction about 6 years ago for 93,500 at Hershey.  What is the market today for these Roadster options from Pierce Arrow (circa 1925-1928)?  Driving  and ownership experience or thoughts?  What do those with more experience in this specific category say about the 25-28 Pierce relative to other Make's Roadster options in those years.    Any input is appreciated.  

 

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Posted (edited)

My stream of consciousnesses echoing some of my friends above:

 

1.  Stutz is cool and has a sport element to it.   I think you can get a decent AA or BB for under 100k - but not a M, SV, or DV.   For a small club the guys are fairly supportive.

 

2. I was fooling around with a Pierce Model 80 doctor's coupe for Ed so I have a bit of experience.   It is not as big or high end as what you commonly expect from Pierce, but you should be able to get one for less than a similar Stutz or Packard.   It is a relatively simple car and the club is supportive with lots of activity.   It won't be as fast as something from 5 years later.

 

3. Size matters and the point about fitting in the car was a good one.

 

4.  Much like buying IBM, it is hard to go wrong with Packard.  If roll up windows are not an issue,   I would aim for a 33/34 Standard Eight Packard.

 

5.  Again with the roll up windows,  that 32 Caddy Conv Coupe that was for sale on here for a long time was a great car - I think it finally sold on BAT for around 60K.  I think Ed will say avoid the earlier Caddy as they are technically a challenge to maintain.

 

6.  Another good option is a Studebaker President Roadster.   You should be able to get a decent 31 for under 100k.   The 32 is made of unobtainium.

 

In the non Hyman market,  you can find one of these for under 100k and you get a OHC straight eight.

 

https://hymanltd.com/vehicles/6640-1928-stutz-series-bb-two-passenger-speedster/

Edited by alsancle (see edit history)
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AJ, I like the look and history of Stutz.  As a Hoosier, they are always something that catches my eye and is on my radar, but only the visuals.  I have never ridden or driven one.  There was a Bearcat (not sure of the year) in my hometown that I remember.  I knew as a kid it was something special.  

 

Packards are definitely something I'll research and love the styling.  Without going through this analysis, I will tell you that a 640/740 Roadster is something that would be a "keeper" forever, but I'm not sure if that can be done for under 100K.  I will maybe do some auction research on Packards next.  

 

I seem to have this difficult reputation of the earlier Cadillacs in my mind that you mention.  Not sure of the differences in parts, reliability year to year in those Cadillacs.  Again something to research. 

 

Studebaker Presidents.....Did I mention I'm a Hoosier!?...  I love them and also wondered if they could be bought for under 100K.  That too will be an auction search I will do.

 

Pierce Arrows.  I guess I do know that the "little Pierce" is a different experience than the big Pierce.  Your comments further back that up.  I had a friend tell me that the 80 series reminded him of the larger Buicks of the day.  That isn't a slight because Buick made some great cars, but I think I get what you're saying about the more simple less grand nature of the 80/81 series (relative to the 33 or 36 series Pierce).  I saw an 80 Runabout and thought it was a very good looking car.  I don't know production and survival numbers for the Big and Little Pierces of that time frame.  Can a larger Pierce Roadster be bought for under 100K today.  Does the simpler nature of the 80/81 lend itself to a less complicated owner experience?  I seem to always hear good things about the Club support for Pierce Arrow and that is a factor to consider if you're going to be an owner.  I'm going to spend the weekend reading as much about Pierce Arrow's of this era before moving to another Make.  I love the research, I can get really caught up in it.  And it's free.....!

 

 

 

 

 

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Roadsters are a simple numbers game, the faster it goes, the more it will cost. There are a few sleepers like the Stude President. That said, unless you buy a well restored car that is sorted, you open yourself up to dumping in big money........if it needs an engine, add 30k minimum.......and 18 months. There are plenty of Packards from 1925 to 1928, but they drive like a Packard for 1925 to 1928. Personally I would pass over the Packards........too many of them for my taste. How you intend to drive it is important. A Series 80/81 Pierce is a fantastic car, and with a high speed rear end vary drivable. If your only a local driving type person, without a trailer and no interest in long tours, almost any car will be fine. Want to do a trans con ? Better look at the big boys. In context......My 1917 White in Southern Florida is no fun, and I’m too on edge to enjoy it. Bring it out to the sticks.......and it’s a pure joy. Most owners today drive their cars too fast. Last week we took the V-16 for a ride and never got over 40 mph. It was a great turn around..........we could actually see the scenery, and the drive was very relaxing. It is nice to have a car that will go highway speeds and be safe, but the cost is staggering. Take your time, and don’t buy a car unless it will drive 100 miles straight in 90 degree weather.

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I totally agree with Ed's statement that "Most owner's today drive their cars to fast". Because it may have a larger engine, and was of the luxury price range when new , many just think the car is capable ( in a modern attitude for cars) to be able to fly down the highway with the rest of the modern cars. You are i a 80+ year old car , take the time, enjoy the view. I am not stating you need to keep it in high gear at 35 mph all day long.

Franklin roadster of the 1928 series 12 to 1931 series 15 era are great. Have all steel chassis ( this started in 1928 on the longer wheelbase cars of which the roadster was one) if the engine is well sorted they cruise along at 50 mph all day long up or down hill , long grands etc. If tweaked a bit engine wise in adjustments can be a bit more so speed wise. Trying to locate a Franklin roadster of that era can be a difficult thing to do, especially the 1930-31 era. They are long lasting cars! I knew of a 1931 roadster in Brooklyn ,NY that was in the hands of its original owner , my buddy Henry Rovich, for about 45 years, it was his only car - ever. Car still exists in New England someplace with several hundred thousand miles on it . ( no that wasn't a typo)

WG

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9 minutes ago, Walt G said:

I totally agree with Ed's statement that "Most owner's today drive their cars to fast". Because it may have a larger engine, and was of the luxury price range when new , many just think the car is capable ( in a modern attitude for cars) to be able to fly down the highway with the rest of the modern cars. You are i a 80+ year old car , take the time, enjoy the view. I am not stating you need to keep it in high gear at 35 mph all day long.

Franklin roadster of the 1928 series 12 to 1931 series 15 era are great. Have all steel chassis ( this started in 1928 on the longer wheelbase cars of which the roadster was one) if the engine is well sorted they cruise along at 50 mph all day long up or down hill , long grands etc. If tweaked a bit engine wise in adjustments can be a bit more so speed wise. Trying to locate a Franklin roadster of that era can be a difficult thing to do, especially the 1930-31 era. They are long lasting cars! I knew of a 1931 roadster in Brooklyn ,NY that was in the hands of its original owner , my buddy Henry Rovich, for about 45 years, it was his only car - ever. Car still exists in New England someplace with several hundred thousand miles on it . ( no that wasn't a typo)

WG

 

 

Walt, that roadster is in central Mass somewhere as I have actually have had it coming down the road at me on some back country roads I drive on the weekend. The current owner doesn't pull over to shoot the breeze...I motioned to him a few times and he just keeps going. Looks all original. I usually see it in the Palmer area, probably going to NB Pease & Co. Ed

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Ed, if an 80 series Pierce doesn’t have a high speed rear end, what is the ballpark for making that change?  I’m not a speed demon and the season of life I’m in doesn’t have lots of time for touring, but the capability to comfortably go 60-65 is a nice attribute, all things considered. 
 

Walt, I am a Franklin lover. They have always impressed me and I love to go to the Franklin museum in Tucson.  I get a sense that they are few and far between, but something to seriously consider if one was available. 

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Hi Ed, the car you have seen is maroon, and basically an original car that did come from the Mass. area. Current owner for many many decades and I have been friends for half a century and ran the Franklin Club annual meet or Trek as they call it together in 1972-73! ( two ornery , think alike fellows who love pre WWII era cars and are firm believes in driving the cars we own) That is one heck of a good running car that has been very well sorted mechanically.  The owner doesn't often stop to chat as he doesn't reside in the area and is usually on his way back home or "on a mission " to do something. He also really loves cars made in Springfield , Mass. but not R-R,  but S-D. 🤐 Enough information as I don't want to reveal his name out of respect for privacy.

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Walt, the S-D plant is owned by family on my mother’s side........since the 60’s and maybe earlier.

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On 4/28/2021 at 9:29 AM, edinmass said:

JUST A SHORT NOTE....Most companies stopped building true roadsters in the 1930/1931/1932 model year. Thus, you may or may not want to consider convertible coupes. Simply, drivability is what dictates price. The better the driver, the more valuable the car..............a Series 80/81 Pierce can be bought in the mid 50's for a very nice car.......like 90 points plus. With a high speed rear, they are very good drivers. Whey won't keep up with an 8. It's all a compromise. 

ED - Series 80 P/A cars are all too anemic for most drivers . They are ok for a memorial day parade but short of that ....

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Posted (edited)

Mike........a good series 80/81 is fine. Problem is most are very far from optimal performance and ten miles away from being dialed in. Pop in a gear set, and they are fun cars. Again, the reason they are 1/3 the price of an eight is apparent........but for many who drive five hundred miles a year or less, on back roads, they are fine. It all depends on expectations. I know a guy who has driven a T cross country a few times...........

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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Ed- Agreed .

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Far be it from me to disagree with Ed on a Pierce Arrow question,  but I drove this up and down the driveway and it feels very different than your typical 1930 ish big Classic to me.   Still very cool, and probably a ball on the back roads at 30-35 Mph.

 

 

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AJ, that car is not sorted, and with a gear set would make a decent caravan car.

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3 hours ago, alsancle said:

Far be it from me to disagree with Ed on a Pierce Arrow question,  but I drove this up and down the driveway and it feels very different than your typical 1930 ish big Classic to me.   Still very cool, and probably a ball on the back roads at 30-35 Mph.

 

 

AJ, thanks for sharing that eye candy. A great looking car.  Ed, is the gearing the same in an 80 vice an 81?  
 

Also, no one has commented, but is getting a 33 or 36 for under six figures not realistic?  My gut tells me that there aren’t many and the number changing hands at any price is low ....

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Posted (edited)

History to the 40’s.........so one can say it’s probably real. Decent open Packard, at what appears to be in the market trading price. 

3 hours ago, John Bloom said:

AJ, thanks for sharing that eye candy. A great looking car.  Ed, is the gearing the same in an 80 vice an 81?  
 

Also, no one has commented, but is getting a 33 or 36 for under six figures not realistic?  My gut tells me that there aren’t many and the number changing hands at any price is low ....


 

I have never owned a Series 80/81 or 33/36 Pierce. I would own one if the body style and price were right for me........and that’s lower than 99 percent of the owners want to hear. I have 8’s and 12’s so my motivation is different than other people. A very well sorted Pierce in identical configuration would be more money than this car(1929).........for a reason, it’s a much better driver. In my humble, but correct opinion.

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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You guys forgot to mention one of the coolest cars made in 1931! Anyway, it's certainly the convertible/coupe that I hope to own-although that green one that sold recently one was probably anybody's last real chance at one for a while at least.😄

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There are 9 known Royale convertible coupes.  I

don't think you can get one for under 100k.  The green one sold in that vicinity but it was by far the cheapest sold in the last 10 years.

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Ed, it’s always good to be humble and correct!  So, regarding Pierce Arrow in that 1925-1928 era, I’m learning the 80/81 is fairly pedestrian (relative to other big classics),but will perform adequately with the right gearing and getting one substantially under six figures is do-able.  The inventory of the larger Pierce wheelbase models (33 and 36) is small in roadster numbers and may be difficult to find one for sale under six figures. 
 

this is a good brief summary of Pierce Roadsters in that 1925-1928 year range. Feel free to continue to give comments on the Pierce roadsters of this era as I turn and look at another Make in those years.  A listing for a Packard was posted. I will do some Packard research next.   
 

Although I am looking at Roadsters, keep the good/helpful comments and input regarding convertible coupes.  After all is said and done, a convertible coupe may be the best solution. I am trying to focus on the earlier year range for now, Just to keep it more consistent. There is just too much change in those years to fairly compare a 1925 to a 1931. I will circle back after the early years and look at that 1929-1931 range. 

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I am late to this party because I was at the current version of the Bakersfield pre-war swap meet on Saturday from 0200-1800, then on a local HCCA tour Sunday.

 

I'll address Pierce-Arrow roadsters.  I have owned a 1930 Model B roadster since 2002, which miraculously took 3rd in class at Pebble in 2010 (restoration was not my doing) despite 7,000 miles on it (all of them mine) in a weak class.  I've owned a 1925 Series 80 5-passenger sedan for 27 years, and owned a 1925 Series 80 4-window coupe for 21 years (sold it for space and partial $$ for the 1918 Pierce).

 

Series 80 competed with the Packard Single Six and, perhaps, with the 6-cyl Peerless.  It was, and remains, an entry-level Pierce, but built to the same standards of quality hand-built construction as the larger S33 (1922-25) and S36 (1926-28).  In fact, the quality of construction on the sedan is what caused me to seek to acquire more Pierces and led me to bail from a 1939 Cad 75 and a 1948 Linc Continental coupe.  Series 80s were slow, like competitive marques, as befitted the roads of the time:  S80 factory final drive ratios were 4.45 (most), 4.65, and 4.88; the ratios were specified by the factory for various geographic-area markets and as far as I know, were NOT optional.  See below for 1929-31 ratios for comparison's sake.  My sedan was sold in San Francisco which required 4.88 gears:  OMG, comfortable cruise was 36-37 and the engine was screaming at 40-41.  GLong and I negotiated a group buy of about 16 26% Mitchell overdrive units (which are synchronized, BTW), and he installed one in my sedan, making a 48-49 mph comfortable cruise--a different car entirely with those gears!  Yet the lower gearing is available when needed:  1st OD was the optimal gear for ascending Fandango Pass with its washboard dirt corkscrew road in Modoc County, California.  I should mention that Series 80 brakes use the same components as on the S33, but the S36 added a vacuum booster not used on the junior series 80/81. 

 

My preference for a S33/S36 car is a 4-passenger touring, the best looking Pierce body of the era.

 

For 1929-30, the Pierce roadster, now 8-cyl and 366 cid (3.5 x 4.75 bore & stroke), was on the shorter wheelbase (133" in 1929, 134" in 1930) shared by the 5-p touring and its dual-cowl version, and by 3-window coupes.  Model B closed bodies in 1930 were on a 139" wheelbase.  In those two years P-A offered a convertible coupe (i.e., roll up windows) on the long wheelbase of 143" (1929) and 144" (1930), as well as on the shorter wheelbases used by the roadsters.  The conv coupes look good with tops up and have landau irons (meh) but appear to me *very* awkward with tops down because they have a closed car vertical windshield with frames painted body color.  The roadsters have raked, chromed fold-down windshields.  In 1931, the last true roadster (side curtains) was found only in the junior Model 43 on a 137" wheelbase.  That year the mid-range Model 42 had a raked windshield but roll-up windows and was termed a "convertible roadster."  the latter term continued to be used by Pierce for its convertible coupes through the Company's end in January 1938.

 

For 1929-31, standard final drive ratios were 4.08 for open cars on the shorter wheelbase and 4.42 for closed cars.  My 1930 roadster, pictured below, was fitted with a Phil Hill tall set of gears (about 3.53/3.54) by some previous owner, and I'd prefer the 4.08s especially since my car, like most 1930s, has the one-year Clark 4-speed transmission with a wide gap between 2nd (generally used as low) and 3rd (at 1.25, it's a great city thoroughfare gear).

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Posted (edited)

Afterthought for OP @John Bloom:  The 1930 roadster has as factory equipment an adjustable driver's seat operated by a quarter-window-crank-type handle between the driver's legs.  The handle operates a screw under the seat to move the seat fore and aft on a slight angle which also affects the seat height.  I assume that the 1929 roadster has the same equipment.

 

The highest known-to-PAS body number for the 1930 roadsters is 106.  Over its 64-year history, PAS knows of only six roadsters surviving.  Last time I checked, three of those were overseas including the ca. 1970 restoration by Wally Rank that was featured in whisky ads in magazines.  I believe that 1929 roadsters, essentially the same cars but with hood louvers instead of doors, are more frequently found.

Edited by Grimy
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Body style, speed, braking - all need to be considered . I never have owned a P-A, but long time close friends ( now gone) in Flushing, NY Frank & Evelyn Spratt used to drive to and from Hershey every year for DECADES in a 1927 Pierce Arrow limousine. Not a totally restored car, Evelyn's father bought it in the 1950s, was well maintained and a good "20 footer" but always ran well. The took their time to do the drive to and from Hershey no matter what the weather - clear and/or  rain.  As I hinted at/mentioned take the time to enjoy the ride and thus the experience, we live in an 'instant' world now, old cars  aren't instant. If you want to fly along at 55 - 80 mph why do you want to do that in a car made 80+ years ago? Life is short , one doesn't know how short it can be until all of a sudden you may be at the end  of that road without warning, been there , done that, and fortunately was in a facility that could "jump start" me again. 

Go buy your roadster and go for a drive.

WG

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1 hour ago, Grimy said:

Afterthought for OP @John Bloom:  The 1930 roadster has as factory equipment an adjustable driver's seat operated by a quarter-window-crank-type handle between the driver's legs.  The handle operates a screw under the seat to move the seat fore and aft on a slight angle which also affects the seat height.  I assume that the 1929 roadster has the same equipment.

 

The highest known-to-PAS body number for the 1930 roadsters is 106.  Over its 64-year history, PAS knows of only six roadsters surviving.  Last time I checked, three of those were overseas including the ca. 1970 restoration by Wally Rank that was featured in whisky ads in magazines.  I believe that 1929 roadsters, essentially the same cars but with hood louvers instead of doors, are more frequently found.

George, thanks for jumping in with all that good info related to Pierce build quality, gearing, engine and wheelbase specs.  Your Roadster has great presence!  Thanks for those photos!  I am really enjoying the feedback and contributions about this topic, starting with the emphasis on Pierce. As I selfishly learn and get an education from those contributing, maybe others following this will think “I need a Roadster too”.......

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2 minutes ago, Steve_Mack_CT said:

What are you John, like 3 weeks in on your club sedan?  I would be careful, if he/she gets wind of this kind of talk your sorting might go from 6 months to three years! 😉

Lol......  Steve, the pursuit that became the club sedan started with a post by me, that within minutes got a response from Ed, that brought out a great bunch of dialogue and input ultimately ending in me getting a car I’m super excited about...  but it took 7-8 months. 
 

this thread I started (knowing I’d someday want to have a Roadster), within minutes got a response from Ed....... and a lively conversation has started again...... I believe in Karma. I’m banking on it again.....

 

please don’t forward this to my club sedan.....keeping her in the dark for now. And I am having fun with her. 

 

 

 

3C1CCAFB-B932-4DF9-BD91-B2360E46B216.jpeg

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Posted (edited)
On 5/3/2021 at 3:45 PM, Steve_Mack_CT said:

 

3) Ed knows a few things, but watch out he loves to spend other peoples money! 😁


Guilty as charged. 
 

The amount of money spent sorting a car is directly proportionate to the enjoyment you get out of it. For the record it absolutely astounds me the cost of fixing pre war cars today. I do it all day long and get to see both sides of the coin......and bill. I practice what I preach..........I put in twice out of pocket in my White than what I was expecting............and Phil and I did all the work. But, I must add.......it was worth every penny.

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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2 hours ago, alsancle said:

Did you see this one?   29 Packard.  Dude calls it a roadster but we know otherwise.  Price and colors will hold it back, but it tells you something about the market.  Car would probably find a home around 35-40k.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/164843913584

I didn’t see that listing previously.   I hope to dig a little deeper into the Packard Roadster choices over the next 24 hours.   In looking at Roadsters, there is always the possibility that a convertible coupe or coupe will catch your eye and you can’t turn away, but I am going into this hoping to not get knocked off my desire to have a relatively long wheelbase Roadster, from the previous mentioned year range with reasonable driving manners.....and that long hood, raked windshield, wires, old leather smell......

A car that I still want to go check on in the evening, 10 years into the ownership experience. 
 

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@John Bloom note there are no photos of the 1929 626 convertible coupe with top down, which would show the clunky looking vertical windshield and full-height door frames.  Other issues:

 

* Dealer refers to six-cylinder engine specs, but I think 1928 was the last year of the six until 1937.  I think I see 8 spark plugs, and the headlights are certainly 1929.

 

* Bleached out canvas cloth top.  I had a top made for a previous Jeepster out of expensive Haartz cloth and it bleached out in one summer's driving.  Haartz StayFast is what's on my 1930 Pierce roadster, and the color has Stayed Fast for 20 years.

 

* Packard guys can correct me, but I think their engine color was different from the Puke Green on this one.

 

* Why are there no photos of the right side of the engine?  Why are there no looking-down photos of the left side of the engine?

 

The Bonhams car is a true roadster, bigger engine, 14 inches more wheelbase.

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2 minutes ago, Grimy said:

 

The Bonhams car is a true roadster, bigger engine, 14 inches more wheelbase.

Without ripping on the conv coupe, the visual difference between those two cars is night and day...... and will be reflected in the price. 

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