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Interesting video EPA going after companies for non complient parts and upgrades..


edinmass

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Anyone who owns hot rods, restoration rods, modern performance cars and trucks....EPA is now going after parts, chips, programs, ext.....worth your time to watch this video. Please post thoughts and comments.........

 

 

 

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Enforcment is new..........state inspection stations were at one time checking for the devices. Then they stopped as long as you check engine light is "off". Already people are making an egr delete that looks like it is in place and working with wires going to it.......although it is a bypass. Looks like this stuff will all come in from China from now on.........wait till they go after the high end exhaust systems placed on the BMW's. 

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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Why the outrage? This isn't a surprise and is how it has always been. The problem is that most aftermarket companies building parts can self-certify, meaning that they're considered legal... until the EPA finds out they're not. Or they hide behind the "for off-highway use only" disclaimer, which is BS. So this happens. 

 

It also seems to be aimed primarily at the guys who build devices to allow diesel trucks to "roll coal." That isn't anything other than modifying your truck for the sole purpose of being an a$$hole. It doesn't make more power or increase fuel economy, it just makes a lot of soot by allowing it to run pig rich. Wheee!

 

And removing catalytic converters is still frowned upon by the feds? Wow, what a shocker!

 

The article also notes they're only targeting the manufacturers, not individuals. Nobody's coming after you and your toy car at the hobby level.

 

This isn't a surprise, it isn't new, and it isn't an outrage. It's cracking down on people gaming the system for profit and hurting the industry and the hobby. We should all want that. 

 

 

Edited by Matt Harwood (see edit history)
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It will come down to language and wording. If you claim this pipe could fit on your car. But is designed to help you consum dietary fiber requirements. To aid in weight loss in children, to help reduce childhood obesity. You might be ok? Not sure? I remember the military removing air filters from their equipment, and replacing them with panty hose. Not sure if an environmental impact study was done on that, or if they just did it because it worked. https://youtu.be/kgeIINs1TrQ

 

Edited by Xander Wildeisen (see edit history)
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XW. The pantyhose trick was because a private in charge of a truck got caught by an officer that saw his wife get out of the truck and the private had a big smile on his face. He was a quick thinking private!  Don’t ask how I know that information. I was a PFC and Spec4 or 5 a few times while in the army. 

Edited by SC38DLS (see edit history)
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The issue is that many modern performance cars are being modified with parts for “off road” use and then the shops watch the customer drive off with their lambo or mustang down the street.  Both parties have a legal issue in this case.   It is just easier for the epa to go after the shop.   The owner still has an issue, if caught.  

 

Most “delete” a diesel for reliability.  You can easily spend 20k on a modern diesel  fixing the epa controls at around 120-150k miles  That is why lb5, lbzs and 7.3s are at a premium.  

 

the diesel shops have been raided over the last few years and so have the performance shops.  Ie this is something that has been going on before 2021.  Not that new.  
 

 

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It’s all related to the clean air act...........and when the junk was installed in cars. I think it’s all more towards more modern stuff..........OBDII bypassing. That said, all the stuff wit fun exhaust systems, chips, added turbos, ect.........are all now being gone after. Hell, does anyone drive a stock Desiel truck to tow with. I haven’t since 1995. DOT inspections made me take the egr delete plate at switch over to the “in place” bypass unit. I was just getting ahead of them. My truck is basically stock, with a tune, egr bypass, and a bigger exhaust............nothing crazy. I actually haul in stock mode otherwise you’re asking for transmission and injector problems. I do use the chip in difficult situations, and it has certainly helped save me problems. All the cool Corvettes with modified systems and the loud exhausts may be in trouble where cars have to be inspected. The very new stuff is so fast that there aren’t many upgrades that make sense.

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4 hours ago, Matt Harwood said:

It also seems to be aimed primarily at the guys who build devices to allow diesel trucks to "roll coal." That isn't anything other than modifying your truck for the sole purpose of being an a$$hole. It doesn't make more power or increase fuel economy, it just makes a lot of soot by allowing it to run pig rich. Wheee!

 

A couple of times/month I come across modified diesel pickups driven by these ***holes.  Gets old real fast when I have to close the windows, sunroof and put the ventilation on recirculate when they spew a cloud of black soot and I'm 100-200+ feet behind them.

 

I have to wonder if these fellas would mind if I mounted a couple of sidewinder missiles on my truck. 😉 😁

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I had a custom made chopper. Was riding it in Daytona during bike week. Got pulled over and $100 ticket because 'I cut off the mufflers'.

Bike had an S n S motor and shorty headers, no mufflers. I bought it that way, got it tagged legally and insured in my state, MD. The Ormond Beach PD disputed and insisted I installed them illegally. No recourse but to pay the fine.

 

I also have a Screamin Eagle settup on my roadking. This was done with factory aftermarket parts installed by an authorized HD dealer to do so. Has been at least 10-15 yrs now. From what I understand because of the above laws they stopped doing so sometime ago.

 

In MD we have an 'emissions' test every 2 yrs. They plug directly into the computer. It will show if anything is faked or tampered with. I do have a plug in power chip made by edge in my truck. They just unplug it, test and replug it. Never had a problem with that part, though at present my truck has failed for other reasons.

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DOT since 1995 has taken decibel readings on everything sold in the US. They have a specification of noise at a certain rpm at so many feet. For a while at my three inspection stations in Mass, we were checking every motorcycle. Most didn't pass. I did have a work around to keep me off the hook...........and help out friends. Then they installed live feed cameras in the bays.......no more cheating. Noise will get their attention, so it's best to keep your modern and hot rods quiet as possible. A cut out is usually your best option. By the way, the DOT has laser exhaust testers at many locations taking samples.........when they decide its a revenue source that can tap.........every car is going to get mail tickets for pollution.  

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You think the Govt,  would have other things to worry about as we circle the bowl, they are worried about the doily on the back of the tank. 

Alot of the vehicles in question are used very limitedly as well.  Again we will have the greenest country on the planet taking into consideration population, while we choke on every one else's pollution from south of the border to blowing on the breeze from the west or far east in terms of old, all while we strangle our economy in the name of enviro justice. 

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21 hours ago, edinmass said:

does anyone drive a stock Desiel truck to tow with.

 Yes, I do, repairs cost way too much to void my warranty, or give the dealer an excuse to do so. When the warranty is up I will buy another new one.  I have had no problems towing. My friend who purchased my last truck installed a box to improve tune and a message scrolled across the instrument panel "factory setting have been violated"

 

21 hours ago, edinmass said:

It’s all related to the clean air act..........

 

Yes and no, what pushed this over the edge was class action Law Suit against VW and Bosch Ignition, and also the suit now against GM who also uses Bosch on their diesels. Once the manufacturers were altering the tune, only to change it when plugged into emission analyzer, the aftermarket manufacturers were going to get hit as well

 

  

Edited by John348 (see edit history)
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Wait till they start making a gizmo to erase data in the cars computer so the cops can't take readings off the cars to see if you were speeding, hit the brakes, ect,ect,ect. With a Tesla, they have so many cameras anything that happens they have access to.......

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1 minute ago, edinmass said:

Wait till they start making a gizmo to erase data in the cars computer so the cops can't take readings off the cars to see if you were speeding, hit the brakes, ect,ect,ect. With a Tesla, they have so many cameras anything that happens they have access to.......

 

They only access that data in a major accident,, so I don't see a market for that 

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4 minutes ago, John348 said:

What does this topic have to do with antique cars? 

Well Not every one of our cars is 100 percent stock.  Plus the mention of tow vehicles applies as alot of members own them and use them to transport their vehicles.  (there is a whole section on that if I'm not mistaken)

 As I mentioned before every thread doesn't have to be 100 percent old car all the time in entirely stock formation to be worthy of discussion on a site full of old car guys that it very likely will affect something in their automotive world at some point. 

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The Dodge 3500 with the Cummins makes more than 1000 pounds of torque. If you can't tow your trailer with that, maybe you should stop trying to move an apartment building with a pickup truck.

 

I understand the fun of modifying your vehicle, but if the argument these guys are making for their mods is that they need more power for towing, well, that doesn't seem to hold much water these days...

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Well unfortunately without 80G or more for a new tow truck (chose to invest that in my new 4320 square foot shop, which I built for close to that) some of us have to make do with what we have, including me with my paid off '06,  6 liter, that travelled a whopping 1200 miles total last year.  My mods are minor in comparison to many and my tail pipe doesn't spew a big black cloud on takeoff. 

 

Of course could be same thing said for why do we need to put OD in an old car or even disc brakes or a dual master as many tout.  Not for the 99.9 % of the time you are driving (well all except maybe the OD) ,  it's for the .1% when you may really need it. 

 

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42 minutes ago, John348 said:

 

They only access that data in a major accident,, so I don't see a market for that 

 

Because the govt and corporations are so well known for never snooping around in data that they are not allowed to, right?

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1 hour ago, TAKerry said:

I bought it that way, got it tagged legally and insured in my state, MD. The Ormond Beach PD disputed and insisted I installed them illegally. No recourse but to pay the fine.

That was a revenue grab pure and simple, and they know when you're hundreds of miles from home you won't fight it. It's also a slippery slope because if a vehicle is legal WHERE IT'S REGISTERED another jurisdiction as a rule has no say. 

 

Living on VA/NC border we've seen that for years. Time after time when a Virginia cop ticketed a NC vehicle for exhaust, window tint, suspension height etc it got thrown out because the vehicle was legal in NC.

 

Now, years later, NC is tougher on some things than VA is!

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22 hours ago, edinmass said:

Hell, does anyone drive a stock Desiel truck to tow with.

 

The only thing not stock on my 95 F350 is a larger down pipe and the wheels.

I bought the old gal new and has 144K on it, Some call that still new.

But its not terribly fast compared to some of todays trucks. Especially loaded.

Some wise guy once told me that for dependability "Stock works best". I am good with that.

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18 minutes ago, auburnseeker said:

Well unfortunately without 80G or more for a new tow truck (chose to invest that in my new 4320 square foot shop, which I built for close to that) some of us have to make do with what we have, including me with my paid off '06,  6 liter, that travelled a whopping 1200 miles total last year.  My mods are minor in comparison to many and my tail pipe doesn't spew a big black cloud on takeoff. 

 

Of course could be same thing said for why do we need to put OD in an old car or even disc brakes or a dual master as many tout.  Not for the 99.9 % of the time you are driving (well all except maybe the OD) ,  it's for the .1% when you may really need it. 

 

 

I thought the DEMA inspection is in the lower 10 counties of NYS, if  so none of this would apply to you anyway.  Do they now require the entire state of NY to be subjected to it?  It really is strict on DEF vehicles

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I bought my 06 GMC when it was 11 years old and 30k on it, because it didn’t have a catalytic converter. Basically, it’s the last year of almost no emission controls, and black smoke is allowed out the pipe and it will still pass emissions test. The new trucks are great,, but a fair amount of maintenance......and huge dollars. Most guys tend to play with their tow vehicles performance and exhaust. It’s not expensive, and fun. All the new Mustangs, and modern muscle cars seem to have very high end exhaust, larger turbos, air box upgrades and the such. Personally, my every day drivers are bone stock. But the “modern” car guys who like to trick out their rides may have issues in the future. 

59 minutes ago, rocketraider said:

That was a revenue grab pure and simple, and they know when you're hundreds of miles from home you won't fight it. It's also a slippery slope because if a vehicle is legal WHERE IT'S REGISTERED another jurisdiction as a rule has no say. 

 

Living on VA/NC border we've seen that for years. Time after time when a Virginia cop ticketed a NC vehicle for exhaust, window tint, suspension height etc it got thrown out because the vehicle was legal in NC.

 

Now, years later, NC is tougher on some things than VA is!


 

The federal tax money and acceptance of DOT regulations means if your legal in your home state, your fine in the lower 48. But you can still be stopped, harassed, and have to deal with fines when you get home. I drive a white truck and trailer, no stickers, no hot rod advertising, just plain white and unassuming. 99 percent of the time, they leave me alone. I always have luggage on the back seat ..........even empty bags, and my immediate answer is I’m on vacation.........which makes me exempt from ALL DOT issues.

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19 minutes ago, John348 said:

 

I thought the DEMA inspection is in the lower 10 counties of NYS, if  so none of this would apply to you anyway.  Do they now require the entire state of NY to be subjected to it?  It really is strict on DEF vehicles

As far as I know it's still down state but if you revert to the other posts,  once they get an inch they will take a mile,  so expect at some point it will spread.  That's why I speak up when I hear something in CA that I wouldn't want to see happen here,  because it's often too late to do anything once it has taken hold elsewhere. 

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