TerryB Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 That is the issue with auto ranging meters. You get a reading but the automatic range setting is not apparent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 For learning your meter purposes, measure a good 1.5v battery if you have one handy. See how the display should show DC and V for volts. I suspect the car battery is reading DC and mV on the display. I will be going off line until tomorrow AM. I’m on the east coast in PA. Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 25, 2021 Author Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) 10 minutes ago, TerryB said: Meter reading must have something behind to show the voltage range it’s on. Might be 70.5mV which is essentially 0 volts. Can you take a picture? Okay might be a bit slow but the back of the meter right? Here is a close up of the back and another of the meter and it shows mv. So finger crossed dead battery. Edited January 25, 2021 by Dapper (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37_Roadmaster_C Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) It sure sounds like you have a dead battery. Terry is right about auto ranging meters. I worked in the electronics industry for 45 years and I have been bit by auto ranging meters many times. There is nothing wrong with them, you just have to pay close attention to the display AND understand what it is telling you. Now back to the problem.... My first thought with what we now know is why is the battery dead? My next question is: Why was there a battery master kill switch? It might have been for security or storage, but it might be because there was a problem causing dead batteries. You might want to disconnect the battery and put a charger on it. Next give the guy you bought it from a call and ask if he ever had battery problems. It is amazing how many people fix problems with a hack/band-aid instead of a proper fix. Edited January 25, 2021 by 37_Roadmaster_C (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37_Roadmaster_C Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 Just read your last reply. mV=milivolts So 70mV=.070 Volts Very dead battery!! Charge it ASAP. The battery may be damaged because of the deep discharge. A quick recharge is your best action!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 25, 2021 Author Share Posted January 25, 2021 12 minutes ago, 37_Roadmaster_C said: Just read your last reply. mV=milivolts So 70mV=.070 Volts Very dead battery!! Charge it ASAP. The battery may be damaged because of the deep discharge. A quick recharge is your best action!! Looks like I need a charger. Any suggestions? Harbor freight has one for around 30.00. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37_Roadmaster_C Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 The Harbor Freight chargers are a problem. They are an electronic controlled charger and will not start charging a battery that is completely dead like yours. There are ways to force it to charge, but it is a pain and not guaranteed. If you can find an old dumb charger it is your best bet in this case, even if you can borrow one for now. I will leave recommendations up to others as with my background I am able to do quirky things that would be risky to people without the understanding. Sorry, just do not want to hurt anybody or any Buicks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37_Roadmaster_C Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) Also, Phoenix is a big place. I am sure there is an antique car group there. Those people would most likely be happy to help out AND they most likely have a 6 volt charger!!! You might want to make a post in the post war Buick forum: https://forums.aaca.org/forum/57-buick-post-war/ and ask for local help. I am sure there are Buick people local to you. Edited January 25, 2021 by 37_Roadmaster_C (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37_Roadmaster_C Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) @Dapper, Here is the contact info for a local Buick club. I got this from the Buick Club of America website. Just Google Phoenix car clubs and you will find more!!! VALLEY OF THE SUN (Phoenix) Ken Mitson 480-607-3714 PS: there is an email for Ken on the BCA site. Edited January 25, 2021 by 37_Roadmaster_C (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasJohn55 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 1 hour ago, Ben Bruce aka First Born said: I would say the battery is dead. Had it been up to voltage, the little test I suggested would have become so hot you would still be cussing me. I would put a charger on the battery and let it charge for several hours. Do you have access to another battery, either in a car or out? Try using a set of jumper cables and see what happen. Ben Nah, just the lights would have come on. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 Thanks for the meter picture, yes it’s millivolts (mv) as 37 Roadie has said. So time to charge the battery and then continue. Did you do the 1.5v battery test with your meter? If you do, try it on the DC meter setting like in your picture and then do it on the yellow Auto ranging OFF setting. I think that might disable the autonranging feature on the DC setting. Good luck and keep posting! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PONTIAC1953 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 the negative battery ground strap should be bolted to the engine block, not the engine mount bracket. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 25, 2021 Author Share Posted January 25, 2021 Thank you everyone for all your help. Having to buy a new battery today after work. Will let you know how it goes. Need it to run so I can get it over for the new upholstery. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Schramm Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 From my experience, I would get an old time charger and put in on the battery for three or four days. Doing a quick charge will not necessarily fully charge the battery. Just put the charger on the battery and come back in a few days to start trouble shooting with a clear mind. Just IMO. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Bruce aka First Born Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 On 1/25/2021 at 8:08 AM, pontiac1953 said: the negative battery ground strap should be bolted to the engine block, not the engine mount bracket. Not so. Hundreds of thousand of straight eight Buicks from 1948 until the end grounded to the mount bracket which is in turn bolted to the block. Ben On 1/25/2021 at 8:08 AM, pontiac1953 said: the negative battery ground strap should be bolted to the engine block, not the engine mount bracket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimy Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 Agree with the recommendation for an old-style (electric, not electronic) charger. For the best chance at recovering a really discharged wet-cell battery, and mandatory for an AGM battery like an Optima if the Optima is below, say, 5.7V, wire the dead/low battery with another good-charged battery of the same voltage (in this case, 6V) in parallel (negative to negative, positive to positive), then attach an electric (vs. electronic) charger. This overcomes the resistance is the really low battery. The foregoing is weak on science but strong on practicality.... 🙂 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 27, 2021 Author Share Posted January 27, 2021 Okay had to get a new battery. Went to put it on and got a lot of sparks on the negative post. More than I have ever got. I read the manual and have the battery in right based on that. Should it spark this much? Here is a picture of the battery. Am I doing something wrong? Should I have put the negative on first? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 No...you have a short circuit of some kind going on! I was going to ask you do that very test with ground connection. A wild guess here but you might have a bad voltage regulator. There is a section of the regulator that is an open contact when the engine is not running to prevent the battery from draining into the generator. Can you find the voltage regulator? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 28, 2021 Author Share Posted January 28, 2021 Is this it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 (edited) No, that’s the ignition coil. The regulator is probably mounted on the firewall. A rectangular box about 2” wide and 5” tall. Will have three wires, terminals will have B or Battery, G or Gen or F or Field marked on it. Edited January 28, 2021 by TerryB (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Internet photo of regulator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 28, 2021 Author Share Posted January 28, 2021 Found it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Yes, that’s it. Do you see a terminal marked Batt? If yes, disconnect that wire from the regulator WITH THE GROUND STRAP NOT CONNECTED TO THE BATTERY. When the Batt wire is off the regulator terminal, then try connecting the ground strap to the battery and see if you still get sparks. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 PS- that section of wire at the regulator with the bare spot should get tape on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 28, 2021 Author Share Posted January 28, 2021 It’s getting a bit cold and dark out so I will do that tomorrow after work. 3 minutes ago, TerryB said: PS- that section of wire at the regulator with the bare spot should get tape on it. My wife pointed that out and bought me tape! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Ok, I will be tuning in for updates. I think that battery cut out you mentioned might have been hiding this problem with the battery drain. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 28, 2021 Author Share Posted January 28, 2021 4 minutes ago, TerryB said: Ok, I will be tuning in for updates. I think that battery cut out you mentioned might have been hiding this problem with the battery drain. So if the battery doesn’t sparks after I disconnect the terminal that means I may have to replace the voltage regulator? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Possibly, or the contacts inside are stuck and might be able to be salvaged ( doesn’t always work out that way). The two screws on the cover can be removed to see what’s going on inside the regulator if it comes down to it being the problem. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Bruce aka First Born Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Just to be sure, a picture of the other end of the pos cable and where it is connected.. Hang in there. You will get there. Ben 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37_Roadmaster_C Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 @Dapper, Terry is exactly right with his idea and troubleshooting procedure. I just had the exact same problem with a 1956 tractor. The tractor is 6 volt just like your Buick. The problem was a dead battery which would work just fine after being charged. Then after the tractor was shut off and left overnight the battery would be dead again. This tractor has no electric accessories, only generator, voltage regulator, starter and ignition. With a little more elaborate troubleshooting it was found that there was a 10 amp draw when the ignition was shut off. To cut to the chase, the cutout contact in the voltage regulator was stuck closed causing the generator to be connected to the battery all the time, even when the motor was not running. I got lucky and was able to free the contact and all is well and still working properly. One caution... If you do find a stuck contact and are able to free it, be VERY careful cleaning the contacts. Do NOT use a file, sand paper or any grinding device. The contacts are made out of or coated with special metals and if they are removed the regulator will fail very quickly and have to be replaced. To clean the contacts the best way is to use a thick plain white paper. Think a business card or several folded layers of copy paper. Use rubbing alcohol or brake cleaner as a cleaning solvent. Simply wet the paper with the solvent and slide through the contacts with a light pressure on the contacts to lightly "pinch" the paper. Do this several times until the paper stays clean. Reassemble and reconnect and test. Keep a close eye on things for a while to be sure the problem does not return. Keep us posted!!! Good luck! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 11 hours ago, Ben Bruce aka First Born said: Just to be sure, a picture of the other end of the pos cable and where it is connected.. Hang in there. You will get there. Ben He had posted this photo of the starter connection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 28, 2021 Author Share Posted January 28, 2021 18 hours ago, TerryB said: Possibly, or the contacts inside are stuck and might be able to be salvaged ( doesn’t always work out that way). The two screws on the cover can be removed to see what’s going on inside the regulator if it comes down to it being the problem. Alright. Here are pics of what I have done. Changed the battery cables back because they where working. Disconnect the “batter” terminal from the voltage regulator. And no sparks when putting the negative cable on. Do I need to disconnect the battery and take the voltage regulator off and look inside? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Leave the ground off for safety while working on it. Great news the sparks stopped. The regulator cover has screws in it so you can take them off and look at the contacts. Did you put the old ground on too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 I wasn’t expecting you to be back working on the car this early! I would like to do this test if you don’t mind. 1. Leave batt wire on regulator OFF. 2. Connect both + battery cable and - battery cable. 3. With your meter on DC volts measure battery volts. Red meter lead on +. Black on - . See if you get 6v. 4. If you measure 6v try turning on headlights to see if they light. If yes then we know regulator is the issue. 5. Then if step 4 is good, remove battery ground cable from battery and open regulator cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 28, 2021 Author Share Posted January 28, 2021 1 hour ago, TerryB said: Leave the ground off for safety while working on it. Great news the sparks stopped. The regulator cover has screws in it so you can take them off and look at the contacts. Did you put the old ground on too? I did put the old ground cable back on it too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 28, 2021 Author Share Posted January 28, 2021 1 hour ago, TerryB said: I wasn’t expecting you to be back working on the car this early! I would like to do this test if you don’t mind. 1. Leave batt wire on regulator OFF. 2. Connect both + battery cable and - battery cable. 3. With your meter on DC volts measure battery volts. Red meter lead on +. Black on - . See if you get 6v. 4. If you measure 6v try turning on headlights to see if they light. If yes then we know regulator is the issue. 5. Then if step 4 is good, remove battery ground cable from battery and open regulator cover. Lights came on!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Ok, I just want to verify the replaced cables and new battery are working by asking for the test I listed. My guess is the voltage regulator is the problem, and I’m cheering for you here in PA, for hopefully finding the problem. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Ok, now it’s your call on removing the regulator to investigate if the contacts can be repaired. I think the contact next to the battery terminal connection on the regulator is the problem. Remember to remove the ground cable from the battery while you are working on the regulator. Congrats on your work to find the problem. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dapper Posted January 28, 2021 Author Share Posted January 28, 2021 11 minutes ago, TerryB said: Ok, now it’s your call on removing the regulator to investigate if the contacts can be repaired. I think the contact next to the battery terminal connection on the regulator is the problem. Remember to remove the ground cable from the battery while you are working on the regulator. Congrats on your work to find the problem. You have been a great help. I’m ordering a new one just to be safe. I hope the next photo I post is me driving it!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Glad to be of help! People helped me over the years and I’m always happy to help out when I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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