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I would think a large part of the negative thoughts about this change can be attributed to the older (my) generation having a factor of loyalty. It may be to a sports team, football, baseball, basketball or hockey or car manufacturer or even a brand of TP. The younger generation does not seem to have that same loyalty factor. I know most of the pro sports players don’t have it. They will switch teams and even demand to get out of contracts if they can get more $$$. Why shouldn’t a company change their logo, they may just get the attention of the demographic that will buy their product. I could honestly care less about the logo, I just want a good product for the $$$. Now if Rogers decides to leave the Packards like Brady did the Patriots I will be very upset!!  

Edited by SC38DLS (see edit history)
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18 minutes ago, SC38DLS said:

I would think a large part of the negative thoughts about this change can be attributed to the older (my) generation having a factor of loyalty. It may be to a sports team, football, baseball, basketball or hockey or car manufacturer or even a brand of TP. The younger generation does not seem to have that same loyalty factor. I know most of the pro sports players don’t have it. They will switch teams and even demand to get out of contracts if they can get more $$$. Why shouldn’t a company change their logo, they may just get the attention of the demographic that will buy their product. I could honestly care less about the logo, I just want a good product for the $$$. Now if Rogers decides to leave the Packards like Brady did the Patriots I will be very upset!!  

 

The GM logo is a totally different thing,

 

Don't mix up employees with employers. The athlete is is the employee and should go where the market will afford them when the contract is due. The employer has no regard for the athlete when they do not produce.

 

I am curious out of all the people posting in this thread how many purchased or leased a NEW GM vehicle in the past 3 years? or even 5 years? or plan on doing so in the next 2 years?  Does the logo really affect that decision?    

Edited by John348 (see edit history)
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Very fair question John.

While I have purchased new from GM in the past, I have not in recent years.  Although my wife's Tahoe is getting near time to replace, my first thought was to go back to Chevrolet and buy another.

If only I could talk her into a nice vintage station wagon!

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21 minutes ago, John348 said:

 

The GM logo is a totally different thing,

 

Don't mix up employees with employers. The athlete is is the employee and should go where the market will afford them when the contract is due. The employer has no regard for the athlete when they do not produce.

 

I am curious out of all the people posting in this thread how many purchased or leased a NEW GM vehicle in the past 3 years? or even 5 years? or plan on doing so in the next 2 years?  Does the logo really affect that decision?    

My last GM car was 1976.

  Does the logo really affect that decision? NO, But what they DO does. Are they loyal to our country and citizens.

 

   image.jpeg.70f216271bb52400ff96c7ccbad1566c.jpeg

 

What do you think? 

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GM lost me as a new car customer 15 years ago. A 1997 Olds Bravada taught me the lesson. Biggest POS I have ever owned- I've had $500 beaters that were better cars. It was always some niggling little thing on that vehicle and for what it cost ($29k in 1997 money) there shouldn't have been a thing wrong with it.

 

Add in beyond sorry dealer support on all the problems that "high-line" vehicle had and GM could gold plate that new logo and I wouldn't go back to them for new vehicles. The Ford store has taken care of me well since 2005.

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Like every publicly held company their primary concern is to satisfy the interests of their shareholders.  If they can do that and maintain a semblance of interest in the country where they have their headquarters all the better.  Most of my life I worked for RCA, an American company that mostly employed Americans during its lifetime. In the late 1980s RCA was sold to GE, another American company.  Two years later GE sold the consumer electronics division I worked in to Thomson Sa of France who did their best to take care of its US employees but were under no obligation to do so.  Some divisions of the Thomson Consumer Electronics divisions were later sold to companies in China and India to help keep the value of Thomson stock in the money making side of things.  It’s how it goes today in publicly traded companies.  

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No, 2 pi r round. Pie r square.

and if the majority shareholders are not American ?

am seeing a big change in the demographics in commercials. Guess that is who they expect to talk into a long term contract.

Elders mostly have the money but ask too many questions.

Mary Barra is the single largest shareholder in GM. Suspect she approved.

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1 hour ago, plymouthcranbrook said:

I heard it as pie are round, cornbread are square but who’s counting?

As far as owning GM cars my daily drivers have been Chevrolets since the early 80’s.  They have been good reliable transportation the vast  majority of the time.  The Traverse I have now seems good but is so complex it is hard to have full trust in it yet.  

 

Cornbread properly done is round, baked in a well-seasoned and preferably OLD cast iron skillet, and made with cornmeal from a small grist mill. Too many people also make the mistake of putting too much sugar in it. If you can taste any sugar there's too much.

 

As many issues as that Bravada had, and as many horror stories as some of you have posted here with $80k+ GM vehicles, GM is not even on my radar for a replacement vehicle.

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3 minutes ago, rocketraider said:

 

Cornbread properly done is round, baked in a well-seasoned and preferably OLD cast iron skillet, and made with cornmeal from a small grist mill. Too many people also make the mistake of putting too much sugar in it. If you can taste any sugar there's too much.

 

As many issues as that Bravada had, and as many horror stories as some of you have posted here with $80k+ GM vehicles, GM is not even on my radar for a replacement vehicle.

 

 Times 2 on the cornbread!  And the skillet MUST be pre heated so the bottom crust is as hard as a ====Buick. NO SUGAR.  Best eaten in a bowl of buttermilk.

 

  Ben

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3 hours ago, Pfeil said:

My last GM car was 1976.

  Does the logo really affect that decision? NO, But what they DO does. Are they loyal to our country and citizens.

 

   image.jpeg.70f216271bb52400ff96c7ccbad1566c.jpeg

 

What do you think? 

They, Ford and Chrysler are either loyal to the US and workers or stupid. If they only cared about profits they could off shored the whole shebang many years ago like so many other American companies did. They could have told the UAW adios and still sold cars here under their brand and made a fortune doing so. However, they stayed here through bankruptcies, strikes, lawsuits, fines, expensive employee buyouts etc. For what? That's why it irks me a bit when I see people speaking poorly about them. They provide millions of jobs and quality of life throughout the entire country and North America. Without those three automakers, the USA and North America would be a much different place right now. Their commerce is woven all through our economy.

Edited by Locomobile (see edit history)
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9 minutes ago, SC38DLS said:

Are you guys starting a COOKING thread?😀

I sure hope so, you can only eat so much boxed cornbread and chili from a tin can.  In the old days the tin can would be recycled to patch a rusted out section of my car, now I just get to eat the chili.

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You do know Chrysler is Italian owned Fiat-Chrysler (FCA) and they have signed a merger agreement with Peugeot?  I wholly support your argument to keep the US in auto production. I was looked at with some distain when I supported the GM bailout program and other similar programs to keep the doors open.  It’s a tightrope to make money and make jobs in the US.  When I was working in Mexicali Mexico the Kenworth plant was just down the street from me.  I would often have lunch with other US Kenworth workers at a great little sandwich shop close to their factory.  BMW and Subaru is made in the US too as is Honda and I believe Kia.

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45 minutes ago, TerryB said:

 BMW and Subaru is made in the US too as is Honda and I believe Kia.

Yes they have assembly plants here but they are headquartered elsewhere. They buy very little from US Suppliers. All of their tooling is made elsewhere. Every dollar they take in, leaves our shores and only a small fraction in operating costs makes it's way back here. They have no unionization to deal with. They are not equal. They provide non union jobs to the locals and that is it.

 

Fiat like Daimler has left Chrysler pretty much intact to operate as an American company. Same union, similar supply chain.

Edited by Locomobile (see edit history)
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54 minutes ago, Locomobile said:

They, Ford and Chrysler are either loyal to the US and workers or stupid. If they only cared about profits they could off shored the whole shebang many years ago like so many other American companies did. They could have told the UAW adios and still sold cars here under their brand and made a fortune doing so. However, they stayed here through bankruptcies, strikes, lawsuits, fines, expensive employee buyouts etc. For what? That's why it irks me a bit when I see people speaking poorly about them. They provide millions of jobs and quality of life throughout the entire country and North America. Without those three automakers, the USA and North America would be a much different place right now. Their commerce is woven all through our economy.

I always knew the "bailout" would happen. It is my understanding that the UAW pension/retirement program kept the retirees out of Medicare as they had their own retirement plan. If they would have been allowed to collapse, all those retirees would have then gone into Medicare, accelerating the draining of Medicare reserves.

 So yes there commerce is woven into what makes up the fabric of our country.

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2 hours ago, TerryB said:

My cornbread comes from a box mix, never had the real thing! I’m open for donations if you would like to send me some.....

 

Refer to the other thread on slow mail...  Wouldn't be fit to eat time it got there.

 

I like it best hot out of the stove, and day-old corn bread is good too. But we never had any left... the dog starved!

 

Dogs will certainly eat cornbread if they can get it. Why you think hush puppies were invented?! Not that ol' Hector ever got any of those either. My grandmama was partial to hush puppies.

 

Maybe we should send GM BoD a pan of good cornbread. Reckon any of 'em would know what it was?

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52 minutes ago, Locomobile said:

They, Ford and Chrysler are either loyal to the US and workers or stupid. If they only cared about profits they could off shored the whole shebang many years ago like so many other American companies did. They could have told the UAW adios and still sold cars here under their brand and made a fortune doing so. However, they stayed here through bankruptcies, strikes, lawsuits, fines, expensive employee buyouts etc. For what? That's why it irks me a bit when I see people speaking poorly about them. They provide millions of jobs and quality of life throughout the entire country and North America. Without those three automakers, the USA and North America would be a much different place right now. Their commerce is woven all through our economy.

  

They, Ford and Chrysler are either loyal to the US and workers or stupid. If they only cared about profits they could off shored the whole shebang many years ago like so many other American companies did.

 They did, starting in the early 1900's. They also set up shop with friendlies, at least some of them were friendlies in the beginning, then people like Hitler came along and then there were problems. Problem with China is they were never a friendly.  Our  military and political leaders regard them as a more than potential enemy. Unfortunately  some of them didn't learn from playing with Hitler.

 

 They could have told the UAW adios and still sold cars here under their brand and made a fortune doing so. However, they stayed here through bankruptcies, strikes, lawsuits, fines, expensive employee buyouts etc.

No, the public pressure and of course the political pressure would have been too great. And certainly later on with the bailout you couldn't leave the table after taking the money.

 

That's why it irks me a bit when I see people speaking poorly about them.

Because today GM has moved most of  it's engineering to Southeast Asia- a great deal of which is in China. 

 

That's why it irks me a bit when I see people speaking poorly about them. They provide millions of jobs and quality of life throughout the entire country and North America. Without those three automakers, the USA and North America would be a much different place right now. Their commerce is woven all through our economy.

Yes, but they could provide a lot more. I believe a Cadillac , Buick , and Chevrolet models from China are sold here  now.

 You are correct to say, Without those automakers the U.S.A. would be a much different place, but that was before we started dealing with the devel...so to speak.

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2 minutes ago, John348 said:

So back to my question.........

 

How many of you have purchased  or leased a NEW GM vehicle in the past 5 years or plan on doing so in the next 2 to 3 years?

 

 

I plan on buying a new truck in the next few years. It will be another Silverado, I know it's not the coolest thing I could buy, but I try to invest in my community and country whenever possible. There is nothing any better, any cheaper. And I've had excellent service out of the one I have now, and it has good resale value that was one of the main reasons I bought GM product. My vehicle before was a f150 , nice truck, good shape dependable low miles, well cared for, I literally wound up giving it away I sold it so cheap.

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I think it is long over due. I had stock in General Motors Corporation and when they went bankrupt the government got it's money back, the workers kept their wages and pensions, management got bonuses and small stockholders like myself didn't receive so much as an old used sparkplug. I for one will not buy any GM product made after 2009 and believe they should have change the logo when they changed their name.

  "In 2009, GM had renamed itself as General Motors Company, creating its former appellation: General Motors Corporation."

 

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2 hours ago, 1937-44 said:

I think it is long over due. I had stock in General Motors Corporation and when they went bankrupt the government got it's money back, the workers kept their wages and pensions, management got bonuses and small stockholders like myself didn't receive so much as an old used sparkplug. I for one will not buy any GM product made after 2009 and believe they should have change the logo when they changed their name.

  "In 2009, GM had renamed itself as General Motors Company, creating its former appellation: General Motors Corporation."

 

 

You might want to check that information, the workers did make concessions to keep GM competitive. The stock market is a gamble, you, myself, and millions of others lost with that, but in the same breath we all collected the dividends when things were good.   

 

https://money.cnn.com/2009/05/29/news/economy/auto_rescue/

 

2 hours ago, Locomobile said:

I plan on buying a new truck in the next few years. It will be another Silverado, I know it's not the coolest thing I could buy, but I try to invest in my community and country whenever possible. There is nothing any better, any cheaper. And I've had excellent service out of the one I have now, and it has good resale value that was one of the main reasons I bought GM product. My vehicle before was a f150 , nice truck, good shape dependable low miles, well cared for, I literally wound up giving it away I sold it so cheap.

 

I was raised the same way. I always purchased new American Vehicles with a majority of parts that are union made. https://aflcio.org/UnionCars No logo change is going to affect my purchase, I could care less about the logo used on a sign, billboard, or advertisement. I only see myself buying maybe 2 or 3 more new vehicles in my life now at this point. I had my wife's car serviced last week and I was given this car as a loaner, I have an appointment to see what they are going to give me on a trade in on the Caddy my wife has this week

 

-3960282350827054295.jpg

Edited by John348 (see edit history)
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12 hours ago, Locomobile said:

They, Ford and Chrysler are either loyal to the US and workers or stupid. If they only cared about profits they could off shored the whole shebang many years ago like so many other American companies did. They could have told the UAW adios and still sold cars here under their brand and made a fortune doing so. However, they stayed here through bankruptcies, strikes, lawsuits, fines, expensive employee buyouts etc. For what? That's why it irks me a bit when I see people speaking poorly about them. They provide millions of jobs and quality of life throughout the entire country and North America. Without those three automakers, the USA and North America would be a much different place right now. Their commerce is woven all through our economy.

Just remember what happened to the home-grown UK car industry.

 

In 1964, BMC (before owning Triumph, Jaguar, and Rover) had 40% of the UK market, plus a major presence in worldwide markets.  By 2005 when MG-Rover filed for 'insolvency', they held a paltry .02% of their home market in the UK.  

 

Craig

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I briefly have checked in here as this topic seems hot on other social media sites as well.  What bemuses me and always has is the attention to logos by marketing people.  I have seen how some got approved and it would astound you at the lack of common sense in those deliberations.  People who did not know the end user one bit (interesting how many people who never bought a car make these decisions) but used their positions to make a personal stamp on the product no matter how bad it was.  As a 30 plus year Olds dealer and former Olds employee I saw many logos changes.  Each time my mind wandered to the fact if they would just build a better styled, engineered and performing car they could call it whatever name they wanted and a square box for a logo and people would buy it.  That's my take...the good news is I have a lot of signs now for my garage!  Probably will not seek the new logo...😁

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2 hours ago, Steve Moskowitz said:

I briefly have checked in here as this topic seems hot on other social media sites as well.  What bemuses me and always has is the attention to logos by marketing people.  I have seen how some got approved and it would astound you at the lack of common sense in those deliberations.  People who did not know the end user one bit (interesting how many people who never bought a car make these decisions) but used their positions to make a personal stamp on the product no matter how bad it was.  As a 30 plus year Olds dealer and former Olds employee I saw many logos changes.  Each time my mind wandered to the fact if they would just build a better styled, engineered and performing car they could call it whatever name they wanted and a square box for a logo and people would buy it.  That's my take...the good news is I have a lot of signs now for my garage!  Probably will not seek the new logo...😁

Yep, just ask Smuckers, Fudruckers or Orville Reddenbacher

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I am astounded what Chrysler has gotten as HP from an obsolete engine. Does anyone not know what a Hellcat or Hellcrate is ? But how  many know about the ZZ572/720R Connect and Cruise ?

 

OTOH at one time the Fed was considering breaking GM up as a monopoly. Since then GM has dumped nearly all their suppliers, even the in-house one. In 1970 Anderson, Indiana was a GM town with Delco Remy and Guide Lamp the major employer. 20 miles away is Muncie. The GM acre where all starters, distributors, and alternators for all divisions was gone by 2009. Much now comes from China.

 

Every new car has a "content" sticker showing where parts came from. What's yours ?

 

 

 

content.jpg

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14 hours ago, John348 said:

So back to my question.........

 

How many of you have purchased  or leased a NEW GM vehicle in the past 5 years or plan on doing so in the next 2 to 3 years?

 

 

I have and will again. I had a first gen traverse (POS) then went to the equinox in 2016. The latest is a 2019, and has been a trouble free reliable vehicle with all wheel drive. Its the wifes car.

 

I am a bit biased as my son is an engineer in the transmission division of GM.

 

Personally, I drive a 2004 Ram Hemi and has almost 200K on it. Been sticking it to the man for many years now payment free......

 

 

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11 minutes ago, Delco32V said:

I have and will again. I had a first gen traverse (POS) then went to the equinox in 2016. The latest is a 2019, and has been a trouble free reliable vehicle with all wheel drive. Its the wifes car.

 

I am a bit biased as my son is an engineer in the transmission division of GM.

 

Personally, I drive a 2004 Ram Hemi and has almost 200K on it. Been sticking it to the man for many years now payment free......

 

 

 

So, I see you are a current customer like myself, does the logo have any affect on your purchase? I know myself I could care less about a logo. 

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39 minutes ago, padgett said:

I am astounded what Chrysler has gotten as HP from an obsolete engine. Does anyone not know what a Hellcat or Hellcrate is ? But how  many know about the ZZ572/720R Connect and Cruise ?

 

OTOH at one time the Fed was considering breaking GM up as a monopoly. Since then GM has dumped nearly all their suppliers, even the in-house one. In 1970 Anderson, Indiana was a GM town with Delco Remy and Guide Lamp the major employer. 20 miles away is Muncie. The GM acre where all starters, distributors, and alternators for all divisions was gone by 2009. Much now comes from China.

 

Every new car has a "content" sticker showing where parts came from. What's yours ?

 

 

 

content.jpg

 

That sticker really doesn't tell the whole story.

Engine; Mexico, and depending on what type of engine and how many cylinders, how many valves per cylinder, etc. Has parts in the hundreds, possibly over a thousand.

Transmission: Germany, these new multiple 6-7-9, 10 speed automatic's can also have close to 1,000 parts in them.

 

So where do all these parts come from? If all added up that 68% U.S. Canada content would be MUCH less. Funny how they lumped U.S. and Canada together, probably would shock a U.S. reader. Last time I checked Canada was a foreign country.

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1 hour ago, Bill Stoneberg said:

 

 

 

That's actually pretty relevant. I think someone else alluded to that. Could an anticipated shift towards electric vehicles be the major reason for the logo change? As in, when that happens, they won't want a logo associated with the use of fossil fuels? (Of course, that would avoid the question: what kind of fuel powers the electric generating plant?)

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45 minutes ago, wws944 said:

Ironically, the only car in GM history (at least that I know of) to exclusively wear the old GM logo, as opposed to one of the specific brands, was the EV1.

Though too old to wear the more familiar 'GM' logo, there was also a 'General Cab' which was a stretched Chevrolet sedan with longer rear doors with GMC HD components and sold through GMC truck dealers in the 1930's to taxi operators.  It was neither a Chevrolet, or a GMC.

 

Craig 

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