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6 volt battery source

doc bell

By doc bell
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MCHinson 25,000+ Points

MCHinson

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I am not sure what size battery a 1938 Dodge uses. In addition to NAPA, Tractor Supply is another source for 6 volt batteries. It seems that lots of tractors are still out there that use 6 volt batteries. Both my 1937 Buick and my 1938 Buick are running batteries from Tractor Supply. 

 

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Marty Roth 25,000+ Points

Marty Roth

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I use Group 1, and Group 2 standard size 6-Volt Batteries,

but also OPTIMA 6-Volt batteries, either single, and also in Parallel for 6-Volt but double amperage for my 1941 Cadillac

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Jon37 5,000+ Points

Jon37

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Each car uses a specific battery "group", which stands for a particular voltage and physical size.  The most commonly available six volt battery groups nowadays are Group 1 or Group 2 but if you search around you can find a few less-common ones being reproduced, like 2L.   Here's a short article about battery Groups, from an old Hemmings Motor News:  https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/6-volt-batteries

 

I don't know which group you would use in a 1938 Dodge.  You will have to research that. Probably either Group 1 or Group 2.  Hear are the physical sizes of Group 1 and Group 2 (both 6-volt) batteries:

    Group 1:  9-1/8" (L), 7-1/8" (W), 9-3/8" (H)

    Group 2: 10-3/8" (L), 7-1/8" (W), 9-3/8" (H)

    (I believe these are overall dimensions, including the height of the posts)

Generally, whichever one fits into your battery box, is what you should use.  But be careful!  If your battery lives under your seat, and you install a too-tall battery, the posts will short out on the battery cover and cause a car fire.  This happened to me in my '39 DeSoto, in 1965.

 

Do shop around.  Don't grab the first battery you find.  For example, always check the CCA (cold cranking amps) rating on batteries.  Some of the cheapie batteries have very low CCA ratings, and you may regret saving a few dollars when you go to start your car and the engine doesn't turn over.

 

The traditional battery is the lead-acid battery, but the Optima battery (which uses a different technology) is much smaller but more powerful and which has a much longer life.  It is also more expensive than a regular lead-acid battery.

 

I myself use a battery (lead-acid) made by DEKA in Pennsylvania. It's a Group 2, and is currently rated at 675 CCA.  (Up to a year or so ago, it was rated 780, almost as much as an Optima.)  It is available through the Batteries Plus chain as stock number SL-12, sold under the Duracell label (part number 902).   I usually get about 5 years out of DEKA batteries, sometimes more.  My latest one cost about $85 (last June) at my nearest Batteries Plus.

 

You asked about "reproduction" batteries.  Here is one company that sells batteries that actually LOOK like old batteries, but they are pricey! https://www.batterycentralmall.com/Batteries/TurboStart/Script/G2L_W.html

 

 

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padgett 25,000+ Points

padgett

Posted
Posted (edited)

Just FYI Deka and Duracell are both made by East Penn.

Personally buy all batteries at Sam's Club when on sale (several times a yesr).

Sam's has both a conventional 6v (GV2) and an AGM GV2 .

Reproduction: keep in mind that in the US federal regulations require labeling that did not exist in 1938.

ps is the battery location sized for a 9.5" battery (BC1) or a 10.5" battery (BC1 or BC2)

Edited by padgett (see edit history)
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Paul Dobbin 25,000+ Points

Paul Dobbin

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Try Tractor Supply, they have 6 volt batteries for tractors that work fine in old cars.  Last time I bought one it was about $79.95 and they last me about 5 years+.   When 6 volt Optimas went to $213.,

I went back to these in my 35 Ford pickup truck.   I'll reconsider Optimas next time.  

Edited by Paul Dobbin
added thought (see edit history)
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zepher 10,000+ Points

zepher

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15 hours ago, Marty Roth said:

I use Group 1, and Group 2 standard size 6-Volt Batteries,

but also OPTIMA 6-Volt batteries, either single, and also in Parallel for 6-Volt but double amperage for my 1941 Cadillac

 

Since the battery is under the floor in my Pierce I run a single Optima 6v.

Never any fuzz on the terminals and never any acid to eat the battery box.

Plenty of Pierce folks also use two 6v Optimas to give them more cranking power for the V12 cars or those that seem to crank slow when hot.

 

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Grimy 25,000+ Points

Grimy

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I run a pair of Optimas in parallel in my 8-cyl Pierces more for the doubled reserve capacity for charging-deficit nighttime runs with lights on than for a fast spin of the starter, but only a single Optima in my 1918 Pierce with 525 cid 6-cyl engine which doesn't see much nighttime use, and in my 1922 Paige and 1948 Jeepster.  A single Optima will be plenty for your Dodge.  If your battery location is underseat or underfloor, Optimas are ideal because they need no water, do not discharge corrosive gas (unless heavily overcharged), do not need charging overwinter, and as zepher says produce no corrosion fuzz.  I average 9 years before I have to replace, which more than offsets the increased initial cost.

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Marty Roth 25,000+ Points

Marty Roth

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Check out this link: 

$189.95 - https://www.amazon.com/Optima-Batteries-8010-044-Starting-Battery/dp/B00099HVN6?ref_=ast_sto_dp

 

 

https://www.amazon.com/Optima-Batteries-8010-044-Starting-Battery/dp/B00099HVN6/ref=sr_1_3?dchild=1&keywords=6+volt+optima+battery&qid=1603731033&sr=8-3

 

As noted in my earlier post,

and amplified by Grimy & Zephyr,

The benefits of OPTIMA, Optima Batteries 8010-044 6V RedTop Starting Battery

being sealed, 

never needing water,

can be mounted in any position (even sideways or upside-down),

long-lasting,

Glass-mat, spiral-cell,

more than offsets the modest increased cost,

 

And they Are are available on AMAZON with FREE SHIPPING

for $189.95

and even $187.99

Edited by Marty Roth (see edit history)
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BearsFan315 10,000+ Points

BearsFan315

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I agree, i run the Optima Red Top 6v in my 1929 Chevrolet and use 00 cables for both ground and positive. also made sure that the ground was a clean metal to clean metal contact !!  it is also under the floor in my car, so not readily seen. it is great battery, plenty of power and no acid to worry about. 

 

I ordered mine via amazon years ago, about 6 to be exact. great price, and little slower hipping as they can not air freight them, have to go ground ;)

 

back then they were around $115 plus a special amazon promotion made it around $90 delivered to my door, so could not pass it up. should have gotten 2 based on the current price !!

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Marty Roth 25,000+ Points

Marty Roth

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23 minutes ago, Grimy said:

Whatever battery you choose, use HEAVY cables.  I use 00 (double ought), but 0 (ought) would probably be fine for your Dodge.  Do NOT use auto parts store 12V cables.

 

4 minutes ago, BearsFan315 said:

I agree, i run the Optima Red Top 6v in my 1929 Chevrolet and use 00 cables for both ground and positive. also made sure that the ground was a clean metal to clean metal contact !!  it is also under the floor in my car, so not readily seen. it is great battery, plenty of power and no acid to worry about. 

 

I ordered mine via amazon years ago, about 6 to be exact. great price, and little slower hipping as they can not air freight them, have to go ground ;)

 

back then they were around $115 plus a special amazon promotion made it around $90 delivered to my door, so could not pass it up. should have gotten 2 based on the current price !!

 

I absolutely agree, and use either Double-Aught or Triple-Aught (00 or 000) cable, or even welding cable,

but also have soldered ends to clamp or end, and ensure wire-brushed clean metal with paint removed from grounding surfaces.

Another good reminder is to ground from battery to chassis, to engine, and also to body of your vehicle. Don't depend just on chassis mounts.

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BearsFan315 10,000+ Points

BearsFan315

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32 minutes ago, Marty Roth said:

I absolutely agree, and use either Double-Aught or Triple-Aught (00 or 000) cable, or even welding cable,

but also have soldered ends to clamp or end, and ensure wire-brushed clean metal with paint removed from grounding surfaces.

Another good reminder is to ground from battery to chassis, to engine, and also to body of your vehicle. Don't depend just on chassis mounts.

 

i used the Fusion Connectors on all ends of my cable, they come based on wire size and have the Solder slugs in the connectors up to 4/0. Just strip the wire back the appropriate length (varies on cable size) then clamped in the connector in the vise, hit it with a torch then solder goes wet, slide stripped cable straight in till the casing hits the metal on the connector and hold for a few seconds (remove heat once you slide in the wire), once done there is NO way you are pulling that thing out. i went one step further and put on color coded heat shrink on the ends, as all my power cables i got from Rhode Island Wiring with the cloth covers to match factory. so the short strip of color lets me know what is what :) safety aspect. 

 

when i stripped down the bare metal i prefit the connector, then coated connector and frame with a conductive carbon paste to prevent corrosion, great stuff but is nasty if you get in on clothes !! like liquid black grease !! then once assembled i touched up the paint around the connector and topped with more of the conductive to seal it up ;)

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Frank DuVal 10,000+ Points

Frank DuVal

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2 hours ago, Marty Roth said:

and use either Double-Aught or Triple-Aught (00 or 000) cable, or even welding cable,

 

Welding cable is a "type" of wire, not a size. Welding cable comes in many sizes, from 4/0 down to #6 AWG (too small for 6 volt use). It is preferred due to fine stranding over building wire. Also, skip the orange welding cable for most AACA applications.😁

 

https://temcoindustrial.com/product-guides/wire-cable-and-accessories/welding-cable

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Bloo 25,000+ Points

Bloo

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I'm just going to add that automotive (battery) cable is also available in those sizes, and it is not the same as building wire. Building wire is much stiffer than automotive cable and should be avoided in nearly all cases.

 

When using welding cable instead of battery cable you should be extra careful to keep it away from grease contamination, heat, and so on, as it's maker did not account for automotive use in the design.

 

The advantage of welding cable is that it is WAY more flexible than battery cable. That can be a real advantage when dealing with huge cables like 2/0 or bigger. I have used it in the past and I like it.

 

 

 

 

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padgett 25,000+ Points

padgett

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I used to buy Optimas until they priced themselves out of my range. Now buy Duracell AGMs when on sale at Sams. Two sizes (H6 and 34/78) fit all of my cars and spares provide backup for the UPS in my equipment closet.

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cahartley 10,000+ Points

cahartley

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On 10/26/2020 at 6:23 PM, padgett said:

I used to buy Optimas until they priced themselves out of my range. Now buy Duracell AGMs when on sale at Sams. Two sizes (H6 and 34/78) fit all of my cars and spares provide backup for the UPS in my equipment closet.

 

And I used to buy DELCO until THEY priced them out of my range.

Then I switched to Carquest who decided they should have more money too which led to Batteries + Bulbs where I have bought several Duracell batteries with which I have been entirely happy.

Batteries + Bulbs can even supply these (ironically a DELCO)>>> 2E.jpg

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MCHinson 25,000+ Points

MCHinson

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7 hours ago, cahartley said:

 

And I used to buy DELCO until THEY priced them out of my range.

Then I switched to Carquest who decided they should have more money too which led to Batteries + Bulbs where I have bought several Duracell batteries with which I have been entirely happy.

Batteries + Bulbs can even supply these (ironically a DELCO)>>> 2E.jpg

Just curious for future use, what is their part number for that battery? I can't seem to find it on their website. I only see a Duracell 3EH on their website. 

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Buffalowed Bill 10,000+ Points

Buffalowed Bill

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I've been using Optima batteries for over twenty five years. You can read all you want, talk to owners and grouse at the high initial cost, but it takes owning one to seal the deal. When I bought my first one decades ago, it was an experiment. It's hard to believe that a little sixteen pound battery can produce the same results as a conventional battery, two to three times as large, but it's true. I still use lead-acid batteries on some application but for the most important applications, where you want the extra insurance that your car will start, and it will not be destroyed by corrosion optima takes the guess work out the process.

On 10/26/2020 at 9:45 AM, Grimy said:

I run a pair of Optimas in parallel in my 8-cyl Pierces more for the doubled reserve capacity for charging-deficit nighttime runs with lights on than for a fast spin of the starter, but only a single Optima in my 1918 Pierce with 525 cid 6-cyl engine which doesn't see much nighttime use, and in my 1922 Paige and 1948 Jeepster.  A single Optima will be plenty for your Dodge.  If your battery location is underseat or underfloor, Optimas are ideal because they need no water, do not discharge corrosive gas (unless heavily overcharged), do not need charging overwinter, and as zepher says produce no corrosion fuzz.  I average 9 years before I have to replace, which more than offsets the increased initial cost.

 

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cahartley 10,000+ Points

cahartley

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On 10/29/2020 at 8:25 AM, MCHinson said:

Just curious for future use, what is their part number for that battery? I can't seem to find it on their website. I only see a Duracell 3EH on their website. 

 

We bought one of these about 2 years ago at which time I believe I found it at their website without much difficulty.

This time I couldn't find it........ :wacko: .......so had to google the battery group number (3EH) in order to find it........go figure.

Anyway it's there >>> https://www.batteriesplus.com/productdetails/replacement/battery/us-battery/3eh/sli3eh 

I don't know what the difference is between a 2H and the 3EH.......they look identical.

3EH.jpg

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MCHinson 25,000+ Points

MCHinson

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5 hours ago, cahartley said:

 

We bought one of these about 2 years ago at which time I believe I found it at their website without much difficulty.

This time I couldn't find it........ :wacko: .......so had to google the battery group number (3EH) in order to find it........go figure.

Anyway it's there >>> https://www.batteriesplus.com/productdetails/replacement/battery/us-battery/3eh/sli3eh 

I don't know what the difference is between a 2H and the 3EH.......they look identical.

3EH.jpg

I found the Duracell battery... I was asking about the Delco branded one that you said was available from Batteries + Bulbs. I would consider the Delco one if available, but for now I will stick with what I have. 

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Bryan G 2,500+ Points

Bryan G

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When I was shopping for a 6v battery for a 23rd series Packard (3EH style) I found that every one I found a photo of appeared identical, just with a different label. (Interstate, DieHard, Delco, etc.)  It may be that East Penn (Deka) makes them all. At that time I found that a local starter/alternator chain had the best price. I've noticed that some diesel tractors run a pair from the factory, in series.

 

For my shoebox I've been running a Group 2 from NAPA, about to turn 5 years old which I think is a good record as I've had modern 12v not last that long. Tractor Supply is convenient, with decent pricing & quick turnover so you're more likely to get fresh stock. They've switched from Deka branded to their house brand "Traveler" but may be the same battery.

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TTR 5,000+ Points

TTR

Posted
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On 10/29/2020 at 1:13 PM, Buffalowed Bill said:

I've been using Optima batteries for over twenty five years. You can read all you want, talk to owners and grouse at the high initial cost, but it takes owning one to seal the deal. When I bought my first one decades ago, it was an experiment. It's hard to believe that a little sixteen pound battery can produce the same results as a conventional battery, two to three times as large, but it's true. I still use lead-acid batteries on some application but for the most important applications, where you want the extra insurance that your car will start, and it will not be destroyed by corrosion optima takes the guess work out the process.

 

What is the average life span you've managed to get out of them ?

As I mentioned earlier, I'm on my 3rd (& still working well) Group 2 in 30 years. All my other vehicles are 12V and on average, I've been getting 5-7 years on vintage cars and 3.5-4 on modern daily drivers, including my current '16 (purchased new in May '17) for which I replaced it's OE battery just few weeks ago.

Besides, battery life or performance is dependant on numerous other factors in vehicles electrical system.

 

P.S. One of the funniest(?) advertisement/marketing gimmicks for batteries seem to be CCA rating. 

Kind of like HP ratings on cars, often BIG numbers that have very little to do with real or useable performance of the vehicle.

Mainly just chest-thumping compensation for manhood (or lack thereof).  

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Bloo 25,000+ Points

Bloo

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I bought a 12v Optima in 1995. 18 years and a few vehicles later it was stolen out of my truck while parked on the street. It was still working fine. It's replacement is getting weak and probably needs to be replaced, so maybe they aren't as good as they once were. I have them in a couple other cars now.

 

Are they worth it? Maybe. I generally don't buy anything else now. The biggest advantage is they generally don't corrode up the battery terminals. They don't eat up your battery tray either. If your car won't start it is much more likely a corroded terminal than something wrong with the battery, so there is a reliability and maintenance advantage.

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Frank DuVal 10,000+ Points

Frank DuVal

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Posted (edited)

Here is the 2020 list of lead acid battery manufacturers in the World and what brands they make.:

 

http://www.jgdarden.com/batteryfaq/batbrand.htm

 

Notice Johnson Controls has had a name change:

 

Clarios (formerly Johnson Controls Inc.), (US) 1-414-524-1200, "https://www.clarios.com/ or https://www.autobatteries.com/

 

Go ahead and take a look. Real eye opener as to who makes what!😲

 

EnerSys and Exide are still making them (lots of brands) in addition to Clarios and East Penn.

 

Yes, an Optima IS a lead acid battery. There are three main types of lead acid batteries: Flooded, Sealed and AGM (Absorbent Glass Mat).

 

Interstate is not and never has been a manufacturer.

Edited by Frank DuVal
Changed US to World (see edit history)
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