Trying to get some info about selling this vehicle.

[JMM2020]

Greetings All,

 

We are trying to get some info about selling this vehicle. My wifes family owned a number of dealerships and this 1991 vert was a dealer/employee only car I believe. So this is obviously a one owner vehicle with just under 54,000 and I believe all options except CD. The only real issue is the dash as it sat in the store window for some number of years and has a pretty good fade. Never seen a winter or anything either. I saw one recently and similar for something like $19k and it was commented that was +$10k overvalued so I'm thinking $9-10K and wanted to see if I could get a ruling...;)

Many thanks! 

[2seater]

No real opinion at this point but I do want to point out it isn't a good idea to lead with a photo of the car sitting in broad daylight with the headlight doors open. It doesn't appear the lights are on, at least I don't see any marker lights, so this indicates some sort of issue with the headlights. An attractive car in many other ways.

[JMM2020]

Thanks for moving this around first off...Lights and everything else work perfectly I just brought it down to the dealership for inspection and had the fuse pulled so they didn't monkey around with them opening and closing...they have the upgraded arms and work perfectly.

I saw this in the Sell rules so here goes...

 

Your Contact information (Phone/Email/Private Message/???): mkrofthings@gmail.com

 

Asking Price: $9800 Willing to take trade? (Y/N): N

 

Year: 1991 Body Type: Coupe: ____ Conv: _X___   VIN: 1G4EC33L3MB900546(Recommended)

 

Vehicle Location: (if applicable) NH

 

Mileage:54000+/-(Highly recommended) Mileage considered correct? (Y/N): Y

 

I have owned this Reatta for: _____ Years and/or _____ Months.

 

I am the ___1___ owner of this Reatta.
 

Title Status: Clear__X__ Salvage ____ Other ______________________ (Explain)

 

Any Accident History? (Y/N) _N__ - If Y please explain: _______________________

 

Exterior Color: _______W________     Interior Color: ______R__________

 

Paint Original? (Y/N): __Y__ Paint Condition? (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): Good

 

Belt & Bumper Molding Color: (Black/Body Color): W

 

Body Dents: (Y/N): N- If Y please explain: __________________

 

Body Rust: (Y/N): N - If Y please explain in detail: __________________

 

Windshield Chipped or Cracked? (Y/N) N- If Y explain to what extent: _______________________

 

Vent Glass Intact? (Y/N): _Y___ - If N please describe: _________________________

 

Rubber surround molding for windshield condition? (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): ____G___

 

Rubber molding for coupe rear window condition: (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor) __________G_______

 

Out Side Mirrors Intact? (Y/N): ___Y_ Headlight Motors Function Correctly? (Y/N): ____

 

Tail Light Lens: (Clear/Cloudy/Cracked): _______________

 

(Convertible only)

Convertible Top Material (Vinyl – Cloth – N/A): ____V______  Convertible Top Color? ___R_______

 

Convertible Top Condition? (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): ______G_________

 

Please describe any flaws or problems with the convertible top: ______N/A_________

 

16 Way Seats? (Y/N): __Y__ - Working? (Y/N): __Y__ - Suede Bolsters? (88 only) (Y/N): ____

 

Seat Condition? (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): ___F____________

 

Interior Original? (Y/N): _Y___

 

Drivers interior door panel condition? (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): ______G_________

 

Passengers interior door panel condition? (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): _______G________

 

Center console top armrest condition? (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): ______G_________

 

Door weather stripping condition? (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): ________G_______

 

Headliner Condition? (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): _____G__________

 

Carpet Condition? (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): ______G_________

 

Original Floor Mats? (Y/N): _Y___ - Condition: (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): _______G________

 

Condition of Steering Wheel Leather: (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): _____G__________

 

Sun Roof? (Y/N): ____ - Works? (Y/N): ____

 

Functional Keyless Entry? (Y/N): __Y__ - Both Remotes? (Y/N): __?__

 

Problems with Electronic Dash items? (Y/N): __N__ - If Y describe problems: _______________

 

Power Windows Work Correctly? (Y/N): __Y__ Power Seats Work Correctly? (Y/N): __Y__

 

Power Door Locks Work Correctly? (Y/N): __Y__ Power Antenna Work Correctly? (Y/N): __Y__

 

Original Sound System? (Y/N): _Y___ Factory CD Player? (90-91 only) (Y/N):N

 

Aftermarket Sound System Equipment? (Y/N): __N__ - If Y describe: _________________

 

Sound System Fully Functional? (Y/N): ___Y_ - If N please describe: ___________________

 

A/C Functional? (Y/N): __Y__ - If N describe problem: ______Needs a recharge light is on___________________

 

Has the A/C been converted from R12 to R134A? (Y/N): __N__

 

Does the suspension require any attention? (Y/N): __N__ - If Y describe what is needed: ______________

 

Tire Brand: ____Toyo Spectrum_______ Remaining Tread: ___90%___ Are All Tires Matched? (Y/N): _Y___Only 2nd set on car ever

 

Factory Wheels? (Y/N): __y__ - If N describe the non stock wheel: _______________

 

Factory Wheel Center Caps Condition (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): ________G_______

 

Missing Caps? (Y/N): _N___ - If Y number missing: ____

 

Any Brake Components Replaced? (Y/N): _N___

 

If Brake Components were replaced describe: (part(s) replaced and when: ________?__________________

 

Last Time Brake System Was Flushed: (Date flushed/Don't know): _____N/A__________

 

Original Engine? (Y/N): ___Y_ - If N date replaced: ______ - How many miles on replacement? ______

 

Original Engine Rebuilt? (Y/N): _N___ - If Y when and how many miles ago? __________

 

Does Engine require attention? (Y/N): __N__ - If Y what needs to be done: ____________________

 

When was last tune up? ___N/A_______ How often do you change the oil? ____3K______

 

Does the engine, cooling system, power steering, or brake system leak any fluids? (Y/N): _N___

 

Describe in detail what is leaking, to what extent: ______N/A______________

 

Original Transmission? (Y/N): __Y__ - If N date replaced: ______ - Miles on replacement: _______

 

Original Transmission Rebuilt? (Y/N): _N__ - If Y when and how many miles ago? ________

 

Does Transmission require attention? (Y/N): __N__ - If Y what needs to be done? _______________

 

When was last Transmission Service? ___N/A______

 

Any Transmission Leaks? (Y/N): __N__ - If Y to what extent? ____________________

 

Have CV joints been replaced? (Y/N): __N__ - If Y when and how many miles ago? __________

 

How many receipts for this vehicle's service history? (all/most/some/none): _____S__________

 

Explain any major work performed on this car: _________N/A______________________

 

Does the car have the owners manual portfolio? (Y/N): __Y__

 

(90/91 Reattas only)

The Portfolio contains the following:
*Craftsmen?s Log (Y/N): __Y__ *Tire gauge (Y/N): __Y__ *Flashlight (Y/N): _Y___ *Road Atlas (Y/N): __Y__

 

In General, What items need attention on this Reatta? Vehicle is solid just needs some TLC and detail work....it sat in the dealership window for many years so the mirror top and dash on the drivers side shows fading...Have 2nd set of light buckets with all hardware as well...drives wonderful and always stored away sometimes for years at a time as my father-in-law was a dealer and this was for my wife.

 

My Reatta Drives: (Excellent/Good/Fair/Poor): _____Excellent__________

 

Other comments about this Reatta: One of our last collectable Buicks and want to find it a good home...seems a super rare whip and dosen't need a whole lot to be exceptional.

[JMM2020]

[dship]

Any pic's of the interior to post?

[JMM2020]

[JMM2020]

[JMM2020]

[JMM2020]

[Barney Eaton]

Interesting  car.   900546 was one of the group (of approximately 136) that was approved for sale to the public.

It did not have the 16 way seat or CD options..... and the top was white. 

The info says it went to Brad Williams ....maybe the zone contact. 

In todays market $10 -12k would be a good number,  the dash, drivers seat, and top color change might turn off some buyers. 

[JMM2020]

Interesting as I saw similar data in the report and all but this car is untouched...I have pictures of it when new at the dealership...red top and manufactured for documentation to L. Aranosian (my Wife) and my wifes' dad was a Buick dealer for over 40 years and has the order paperwork somewhere...it's strange...I specifically asked him about the roof and he affirmed always been red and showed me the picture.

[JMM2020]

OK I got the Bradford Williams figured out...product manager at the dealership who put in the order....white top is still a mystery.

In any case I'm grateful for the input and the insight.....great stuff!

We are consolidating and downsizing so some things simply have to go and this is one of them as we just don't drive it anymore. It has always been a great driver and I am sure with a little work it will really give someone some good times for ,any more years to come.

Edited September 19, 2020 by JMM2020 (see edit history)

[Barney Eaton]

I would like to see if we can solve the mystery.   

I am working from what I believe to be a document created within Buick listing all the 1991 Reatta convertibles.

If I were on my computer I could attach the page with this cars documentation. 

So lets come in the back door ...... in the trunk beside the spare tire is the "Service Parts" lable... this contains the DNA of the

car.   If you can take a picture of that label I will decode it and share that information. 

You can post the picture here or send it directly to me.

Until I get my computer browser converted I cannot attach pictures to these messages because I am using my wifes computer. 

NOTE... the label is attached to the side of the spare tire well... you must lift the trunk insulation on the right side of the spare to

see the label.     It will be very interesting to see what the label reviels.  

[JMM2020]

Awesome Barney and I do appreciate it very much. I took a good look at the photo and I can't say I have a real time reference to go by in it and my FIL is quite old these days and while still as sharp as a razor it could be the type of thing he would just pass over as he had so many cars over the years scattered around here and there...I'll tell you about the GNX in the basement of one of the buildings sometime...lol

Anyway...40T...there it is!

[Barney Eaton]

Thanks for posting the picture of the label

40T =  white convertible top.   

Guess this does not solve the mystery.... any chance it got changed at the Craft Centre, or maybe the top was damaged in shipping and the dealer went for a red top?   does the red top have a glass back window and does it have the defroster wire in the glass? 

 

Ronnie,  could you post a ling to the section on your site that has all the codes and colors.... that would help others that visit this forum

decode the picture of the label for 900546

C05 = convertible

40 = white.... so 40Q = white side molding,  40T = white top, 40U = white exterior paint.

also for some of the newer owners that come here....at the bottom are the paint codes if you need touch up or paint. 

8554 is the PPG paint code for white paint if you need to paint something.   40U is the paint code if you are buying a touch up pen at a auto parts store.     Also the last code, 75A is the pin stripe color.... 75 = red,  "A" is the code for the pinstripe

 

[B Jake Moran]

On 9/19/2020 at 8:40 AM, JMM2020 said:

Interesting as I saw similar data in the report and all but this car is untouched...I have pictures of it when new at the dealership...red top and manufactured for documentation to L. Aranosian (my Wife) and my wifes' dad was a Buick dealer for over 40 years and has the order paperwork somewhere...it's strange...I specifically asked him about the roof and he affirmed always been red and showed me the picture.

Exactly!   There has been much discussion about rolling changes or features NOT seen on the SPID or delivery information.  Here is an example of that but officially THIS car does not exist with a red convertible top.   

 

All of my conspiracy theorists are long gone from the forum but this is the kind of proof needed to support the idea that some Reattas left the factory not matching the order bill.  What a shame it would be to deduct points at a BCA National meet for non original convertible top if the owner provides proof from inception of the top.  But whatever....

[B Jake Moran]

On 9/21/2020 at 9:43 AM, Barney Eaton said:

Thanks for posting the picture of the label

40T =  white convertible top.   

Guess this does not solve the mystery.... any chance it got changed at the Craft Centre, or maybe the top was damaged in shipping and the dealer went for a red top?   does the red top have a glass back window and does it have the defroster wire in the glass? 

 

Ronnie,  could you post a ling to the section on your site that has all the codes and colors.... that would help others that visit this forum

decode the picture of the label for 900546

C05 = convertible

40 = white.... so 40Q = white side molding,  40T = white top, 40U = white exterior paint.

also for some of the newer owners that come here....at the bottom are the paint codes if you need touch up or paint. 

8554 is the PPG paint code for white paint if you need to paint something.   40U is the paint code if you are buying a touch up pen at a auto parts store.     Also the last code, 75A is the pin stripe color.... 75 = red,  "A" is the code for the pinstripe

 

You are re-opening the can of worms Barney.  I am only playing Devil's Advocate here.  For how many years have you and others denied ANY cars left the factory not matching the SPID.  You and your apologists said NEVER.  Here is evidence that one did.  I'm not saying a majority did, but it is clear to me and the other conspiracy theorists that SOME did because at the end of the run we believe the attitude was probably "who cares" among the Craft Centre management.   

 

Now, SPID's could be created well in advance or mistakes could happen or - more than likely - there was no code for some variants.  Is that not the case for a red convertible top?   

 

I'm sure forum management will delete my posts. Steve, Marck (for the most part) and the others are long gone at this point, but many said these cars were out there, and here is proof.  

[JMM2020]

I sort of have to concur as we have really looked into a ton of old photos and there's another shot of it up at the lake house we can identify the timing of and it was a about year after delivery and it has a red roof and we can't imagine it needing a roof in it's first year and especially as it has sustained no damage since it was new. My FIL also swears it had a red roof and the original photo he showed was the day after it had arrived at the dealership and it certainly looks pretty new though it was not the actual focus item in the shot it's sitting right behind my wife and and her mother.

I guess my point after a bit more review this evening is that we do not have a shred of evidence supporting a white roof other than this sticker....

Edited September 24, 2020 by JMM2020 (see edit history)

[Ronnie]

6 hours ago, JMM2020 said:

I guess my point after a bit more review this evening is that we do not have a shred of evidence supporting a white roof other than this sticker....

 

I don't think a lack of evidence overrides the SPID. Some real evidence that the red top came from the factory on that car would.

 

The problem I have with that red top is it doesn't appear to be any GM red convertible top color that I can remember ever seeing. You would think that if the top was a special order item, that didn't show up on the SPID, it would still have to be a GM color that was used on other GM cars of that period.  Can it be confirmed that the color of red on this car was offered by GM as a factory convertible top color during the period Reattas were produced?

Edited September 24, 2020 by Ronnie (see edit history)

[B Jake Moran]

The point was always made that if these cars existed why have we as a community never seen them.  This car is a perfect example. It is a one owner family vehicle that is just now coming on the scene.  Never seen before by Reatta geeks.  How many others are out there?  Rare combinations or colors not on the SPID. 

Edited September 24, 2020 by B Jake Moran (see edit history)

[Ronnie]

8 minutes ago, B Jake Moran said:

The point was always made that if these cars existed why have we as a community never seen them.  This car is a perfect example. It is a one owner family vehicle that is just now coming on the scene.  Never seen before by Reatta geeks.  How many others are out there?  Rare combinations or colors not on the SPID. 

If what you say is correct there should be a paper trail saved by the dealership showing how the car was ordered. If it was ordered with a red top there should be documentation. For me, the lack of evidence to the contrary is not proof of anything. Not only is this a "one owner family vehicle". It is a family that owned dealerships and they should have records of the cars they ordered.

[B Jake Moran]

8 hours ago, Ronnie said:

If what you say is correct there should be a paper trail saved by the dealership showing how the car was ordered. If it was ordered with a red top there should be documentation. For me, the lack of evidence to the contrary is not proof of anything. Not only is this a "one owner family vehicle". It is a family that owned dealerships and they should have records of the cars they ordered.

I would agree with that statement. no business gets conducted at that level without being in writing.  Even Chevrolets COPO program in the 60s had documentation.  

[Y-JobFan]

16 hours ago, B Jake Moran said:

Exactly!   There has been much discussion about rolling changes or features NOT seen on the SPID or delivery information.  Here is an example of that but officially THIS car does not exist with a red convertible top.   

 

All of my conspiracy theorists are long gone from the forum but this is the kind of proof needed to support the idea that some Reattas left the factory not matching the order bill.  What a shame it would be to deduct points at a BCA National meet for non original convertible top if the owner provides proof from inception of the top.  But whatever....

And what proof would that be?  I wouldn't want to count how many cars I have looked at over the 50 years I have been in this hobby that have been said to have come from the factory like that and low and behold, false.  

As with the vast majority of these "special" cars, they were changed by the dealer as soon as they came in.  The dealer could have had his upholsterer have a red top to put on the car as soon as it was delivered.  So many cars were changed by the dealer when they came in, from color, to wheels, to adding vinyl tops etc.  Say so doesn't hold up in the court of law or this.  

 

 

Edited September 24, 2020 by Y-JobFan (see edit history)

[Barney Eaton]

If you do not care about a Reatta being authentic or original, none of this matters. 

It means nothing to me if a convertible has a green top.

When I started collecting Reatta information and data was to document information about the cars. 

Future owner will need to decide if certain changes make a difference in the value of the cars.... yes value.... there are those that feel a cars value is improved if it is rare, one of a kind etc

 

Back to this car with the red top............. the car is 29 years old and so far there is no documentation explaining the present of a red top on a vehicle that was not available with that color of convertible top.    With more information from the owner we might be able to make some sense of this.   Back on Monday (9/21) I ask if the back window was glass and had the built in defogger.   Another clue might be the stitching around the glass.    People like Marck,  could compare that with known original tops and possibly find clues. 

 

Would the car loose points in BCA judging.   That would be up to the judging team.  On 1990 Reattas, burgundy and blue tops are allowed because factory documentation shows they were supposed to be available and I have yet to see documentation that they were cancled/discontinued,  and there are some early pictures that show one of each on a 1990 convertible.   For 1991, the early printing of the Product Manual shows Flame Red top (code 74T) to be available and my copy has it marked thru with Delete written on it...also I have 1991 dealer order forms for the Reatta one with Rev #1 8-90 on the bottom of the page and the other Rev #2  1-91 and both only list 3 top colors  white, black, and saddle.

 

Where would the Craft Centre get a non standard convertible top?   ASC (American Sunroof Co)  designed the top mechanism for the Reatta convertible.  They also assembled the mechanism with the top covering in place.... it was shipped to Lansing and installed as a complete unit.   All this makes it more difficult for a car to be made with a part that was not on the build sheet.... if they planned to build this car with a red top,  it would need to be ordered,  the build paperwork would have been created with the special color.... important because they would not want to install 

this special color on the wrong car.    It is unlikely that a random, spare red top was over in the corner and one day someone said why don't we put that unused red top on the next car on the line.     Remember...the 1990 red was actually burgundy and the 1991 red was Flame red...so if it came from the factory it would have been a 1991 top.

 

Finally... this car 900546 was built Feb 28, 1991,  there were 7 white convertibles built that day and all but one had red interior.   Now a timeline on 1991 convertibles... the first production convertible was 900328 built on Jan 28 1991.  The last convertible 900622 was built on March 7.    900546 was 76 cars from the end of convertible production ... 8 working days between 900546 and the last convertible.  Maybe they were cleaning house and getting ride of unused parts. 

 

I worked 38 years in manufacturing....for 3 different companies,  none making the same parts as the other.  I do have some experience with the manufacturing system and when you are making a product that sells for $36K you just don't throw random parts on the product. 

 

Edited September 24, 2020 by Barney Eaton (see edit history)

[B Jake Moran]

13 hours ago, Y-JobFan said:

As with the vast majority of these "special" cars, they were changed by the dealer as soon as they came in.  The dealer could have had his upholsterer have a red top to put on the car as soon as it was delivered.  So many cars were changed by the dealer when they came in, from color, to wheels, to adding vinyl tops etc.  Say so doesn't hold up in the court of law or this.  

The owner is the dealer.  They stated it came in that way.  That's the original as delivered convertible top.  

[B Jake Moran]

10 hours ago, Barney Eaton said:

If you do not care about a Reatta being authentic or original, none of this matters. 

It means nothing to me if a convertible has a green top.

When I started collecting Reatta information and data was to document information about the cars. 

Future owner will need to decide if certain changes make a difference in the value of the cars.... yes value.... there are those that feel a cars value is improved if it is rare, one of a kind etc

 

Back to this car with the red top............. the car is 29 years old and so far there is no documentation explaining the present of a red top on a vehicle that was not available with that color of convertible top.    With more information from the owner we might be able to make some sense of this.   Back on Monday (9/21) I ask if the back window was glass and had the built in defogger.   Another clue might be the stitching around the glass.    People like Marck,  could compare that with known original tops and possibly find clues. 

 

Would the car loose points in BCA judging.   That would be up to the judging team.  On 1990 Reattas, burgundy and blue tops are allowed because factory documentation shows they were supposed to be available and I have yet to see documentation that they were cancled/discontinued,  and there are some early pictures that show one of each on a 1990 convertible.   For 1991, the early printing of the Product Manual shows Flame Red top (code 74T) to be available and my copy has it marked thru with Delete written on it...also I have 1991 dealer order forms for the Reatta one with Rev #1 8-90 on the bottom of the page and the other Rev #2  1-91 and both only list 3 top colors  white, black, and saddle.

 

Where would the Craft Centre get a non standard convertible top?   ASC (American Sunroof Co)  designed the top mechanism for the Reatta convertible.  They also assembled the mechanism with the top covering in place.... it was shipped to Lansing and installed as a complete unit.   All this makes it more difficult for a car to be made with a part that was not on the build sheet.... if they planned to build this car with a red top,  it would need to be ordered,  the build paperwork would have been created with the special color.... important because they would not want to install 

this special color on the wrong car.    It is unlikely that a random, spare red top was over in the corner and one day someone said why don't we put that unused red top on the next car on the line.     Remember...the 1990 red was actually burgundy and the 1991 red was Flame red...so if it came from the factory it would have been a 1991 top.

 

Finally... this car 900546 was built Feb 28, 1991,  there were 7 white convertibles built that day and all but one had red interior.   Now a timeline on 1991 convertibles... the first production convertible was 900328 built on Jan 28 1991.  The last convertible 900622 was built on March 7.    900546 was 76 cars from the end of convertible production ... 8 working days between 900546 and the last convertible.  Maybe they were cleaning house and getting ride of unused parts. 

 

I worked 38 years in manufacturing....for 3 different companies,  none making the same parts as the other.  I do have some experience with the manufacturing system and when you are making a product that sells for $36K you just don't throw random parts on the product. 

 

Barney:

 

This is an excellent rebuttal.  It makes perfect sense to me.  It allows for the remote possibility that the top could have come from the craft centre, but highly unlikely.    The issue is this is the original owner and dealer and the dealer/owner is still alive.  

 

What would help is the original purchase documents from that manager.  I guess reluctantly I agree - we would need more documentation that the top was factory placed and ordered as such, maybe with notes from Buick that it was approved.  Ball is back in the sellers court, and perhaps they don't care too much.  

[Y-JobFan]

1 hour ago, B Jake Moran said:

The owner is the dealer.  They stated it came in that way.  That's the original as delivered convertible top.  

Again, I want paper proof, I have owned enough special order cars to know that there’s ALWAYS documentation That they were changed from original.  Special paint cars carried and SCO or asterisk where paint code went etc.  If changed at time of build I would expect an asterisk in the top color spot if they didn’t have a code assigned for red.  Odd that a dealer car wouldn’t still have paperwork with it.  I know of too many cars that are one owner or original family owned cars that have been changed from how delivered but are being passed off as how they left the factory.  For judging the burden of proof is on the owner and hearsay isn’t the needed proof.  I am one that has always gravitated to special cars, lie production, one off colors, etc, but for me to step up, it better be documented.  BTW, I have a piece of property for sale in a sink hole neighborhood but I feel it’s not affected by the problem all my neighbors have, interested? 

Edited September 25, 2020 by Y-JobFan (see edit history)

[NCReatta]

12 hours ago, Barney Eaton said:

 Now a timeline on 1991 convertibles... the first production convertible was 900328 built on Jan 28 1991.  The last convertible 900622 was built on March 7.    

The last convertible production day was actually 3/11/91. I currently have two Reattas here built that day. 0621 my white/flame red convertible, and 0610 Frank Sinatra Jr's silver convertible. If I remember correctly there were three total built that day. 

 

Which begs the question, which Reatta convertible was really the last one to roll off the line? 

 

Back to the original topic at hand, the top can pretty easily be identified as an OEM top by the back window. 

 

In the lower RH corner of the glass, an OEM top will have a PPG logo. Also no stitching around the rear window, and the bottom corners of the window are not rounded like the top corners. The vinyl surrounding it will come to almost a right angle. 

 

There is also the possibility that the top has been dyed at some point in its life. Given the faded red, this would be my best guess if it is indeed an OEM top. Best way to tell that would be to look at the piping around the edge, and perhaps the inside of the top to see if maybe she has worn off to expose white underneath. 

[Y-JobFan]

Marck, when I was looking at the Pics I wondered if it wasn’t dyed due to the odd color 

[Y-JobFan]

And there we have it, check the bottom window corners of an original top and then the rounded corners on the red top.  The rear defroster differs as well 

Edited September 25, 2020 by Y-JobFan (see edit history)

[JMM2020]

I went out and got this image so you experts could get a more up close view and make a ruling. As I originally stated my FIL has no real recollection of anything being done to it but that in no way means something was not done to it. He had quite a few dealerships and quite a few cars he speculated on and didn't really pay a whole lot of attention to so anything is possible and obviously if a red top was not even available as an inventory item it could not have been switched out if the original pick part was somehow defective or damaged.  If not original it's in good shape it's just red.

We would still like to find the car a good home rather than shove it back in storage...;)

Again thanks one and all for the incredibly insightful due diligence and I ask again if the asking price of around $9-10K would be reasonable for the vehicle.

Thanks!

[Y-JobFan]

Seeing it close up it is with no question aftermarket.   Looks like it will make someone a nice car and of course there are not a lot of 91's out there.  You may sit on it a while, the condition will deter some.  The seat is rough for a lower mileage car, the faded dash, looks like maybe the top of the drivers door panel is also faded, and the missing horn button etc. I see the service A/C light is on and that can get expensive quickly.   Lack of 16 way seat and CD will weed some buyers out as well.  The red top some will like and some won't but it is what it is and it's expensive to change if someone is looking to take the car back to stock.  The provenance of the car is great with it's full history and is definitely a plus.  One thing I would do is to have the car professionally detailed before you put it out there, that would certainly go along way in helping the cause.  Best of luck, it could certainly sit in my storage building if I had any more room for another. 

 

[Y-JobFan]

Any thoughts B Jake Moran? 

Edited September 28, 2020 by Y-JobFan (see edit history)

[B Jake Moran]

With the added information and the new doubts from the owner it is clearly an aftermarket post production top with no real documentation of when it was installed.   As for the car itself, it has the rarity of being a mid mileage 1991 and with the visual sun damage I would say it is a $5500 car.  I think there are 2 kinds of Reatta convertibles - those nice drivers like this one or my Driftwood convertible which sold for $4000.00 or much better ones which seem to go for $9500 to $17,000.  This is not one of those ultra low mile cars. 

[B Jake Moran]

I personally believe it needs maintenance such as a professional coolant flush, transmission flush, and ac service.  Just having 54,000 miles is nice but I could see a lot of money dumped into this car.  Brakes?     It all depends on whether a potential buyer wants a 1991 Reatta convertible or just a nice modern convertible.  Hopefully the seller will keep in touch. 

[Ronnie]

13 hours ago, B Jake Moran said:

I personally believe it needs maintenance such as a professional coolant flush, transmission flush, and ac service.  Just having 54,000 miles is nice but I could see a lot of money dumped into this car.  Brakes?     It all depends on whether a potential buyer wants a 1991 Reatta convertible or just a nice modern convertible.  Hopefully the seller will keep in touch. 

 

Jake, Please take a look at the photo of my car below and tell me what maintenance you think it needs. I plan to take it on a tour of the Blue Ridge Parkway this fall and it would be good to know ahead of time what maintenance I need to do to it so we will have a trouble free trip. Normally I would jack it up and check it over good but if you can look at a photo and tell me what maintenance is needed it would save me a lot of work.

 

[B Jake Moran]

Ronnie

I read the sellers comments based on the long standing format we ask sellers to use.  From that it stated the coolant, transmission fluid have not been serviced.  These are critical fluids.  I cant count on one hand how many old cars I have purchased that developed issues after I brought them home.  Just wanted you to know why I said that. If the seller would have stated he just serviced these fluids, I would not have mentioned.  

[Ronnie]

Obviously I was having some fun with you Jake.

 

Now that @JMM2020 has the information he was seeking he should create a genuine "For Sale" topic here in the Buy/Sell forum if he still wants to sell his Reatta.  Maybe this thread should be moved to the main Reatta forum where discussing and critiquing a Reatta is more appropriate.

[padgett]

From a Judging standpoint, I'd have to go by the SPI and deduct for the top. OTOH it is a nice driver and will do well at local shows where nobody is a fanatic.

 

Replaced my white top with a blue Haartz to match the interior. Just my preference.

 

Wonder what the difference is between 90 11T - white top and 91 40T white top.

 

ps I never cared for the code 40 White, has too much yellow innit. I like the code 10 Arctic White better.