Dr. Thomas G. Hedberg Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 We have a beautiful 1912 Buick model 29 which runs like a dream except for shifting gears. Pressing the clutch pedal down, pressing it down hard, pressing it down repeatedly (and other variants of this) has pretty much no effect. The gears still clash horribly when going into first or second. Third is pretty much just as bad. I've already gotten into the clutch box, greased the appropriate ports and checked the linkage. Everything looks fine, but I'm still getting no clutch action. Shifting into reverse is pretty easy as long as the engine is at a low RPM, but beyond that, trouble. Another clue: when the car is in neutral and rolling down a hill there are still some horrible noises as if something was still clashing in there somewhere. Does anyone have any ideas. We love this car and want to drive it regularly but this is a game changer. Please help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHa Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 Post your question at BB@BrassBuicks.groups.io Someone there can help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayne sheldon Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 A very good friend had a Buick very similar to that a long time ago. If I recall correctly, it had a cone clutch. Cone clutches are a bit problematic, and tricky to use. They tend to grab quickly and one needs to learn to use them with care. All that said, if the lining in the cone clutch is not just right, they will be difficult. Original lining was usually leather, but only certain types of leather are suitable. If the leather has dried out, they will become excessively grabby. Neatsfoot oil is often recommended, and they should be oiled regularly. Excess oil will be squeezed and thrown out. There are a couple people in the hobby that do a "side business" of relining cone clutches, I don't know offhand any in particular, so ask around. There are tricks to doing the lining correctly so that the leather doesn't bunch up, and engages as gently as they can. Another option loved by some but hated by others, is Kevlar for clutch linings. I do not have any experience with that. You may have more than one problem. If something is making bad noises with the car rolling downhill in neutral? That is likely not the clutch. It could be almost anything in the rear end, gears, U-joints, wheels, drive shaft, even suspension parts and the torque brace, or the output end of the transmission. The first thing to do, is jack up the rear end just enough to take the weight off the rear wheels (make sure the car is safely secured!). Crawl around under the car, and grab anything and everything and shake it! Twist it this way and that, spin everything. Grab the wheels from outside and do the same. Look for anything that has more movement than it should, and listen for anything going clunk or making any excessive noises. That way you have a clue where to look more closely. Some amount of disassembly may be in order. Good luck! I love the car. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 I have a Model 29 in my shop right now, but sadly have yet to get it running so I have no first-hand experience (hopefully I will soon). This may sound redundant and I apologize if it's too basic, but is he double-clutching it between gears? Accelerate, clutch in, move shifter to neutral, clutch out, clutch in, move shifter to next gear, clutch out. It has to happen fairly rapidly to synchronize gear speed with road speed. On cars like this with straight-cut gears it can take some practice to get it just right. Some cars like a quick double-clutch while some don't mind if you are more leisurely. I've found going quickly is best on cars that are balky. Also, it may help to shift at lower RPM--engines like this don't need a lot of RPM and they like to pull rather than rev, so there's no need to wind it out. Just get it rolling in 1st, quickly get 2nd, and you should be in 3rd by 10 MPH and let the torque pull it along. Too high an engine speed can make shifting more difficult. Sorry if he's already doing these things, but it's often a matter of finding what the car wants--two otherwise identical cars could have completely different needs in the shifting department. I hope this helps! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kings32 Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 Check the oil in the trans , should be a heavy oil . My 14 buick used a 600 oil. Helped my shifting problems kings32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinmass Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 If it has a clutch brake, try shifting while only pushing the pedal down between half way and 2/3 of the way. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PFindlay Posted August 9, 2020 Share Posted August 9, 2020 Is this a problem when shifting, or when trying to put it into gear at a standstill? In either case, make sure the engine will idle right down. A fast idle will make everything more difficult. If it's a problem at a standstill, check to make sure the clutch is fully disengaging. Pull the floorboards and watch as you press the clutch pedal with the motor idling. You should be able to see the shaft between the clutch and the transmission and it should come to a full stop before you can put it into gear. If it's not, your clutch is hanging on a little. If it's a shifting problem, follow the good advice in the previous few messages and get lots of practice. Especially Matt's advice - shift early at low revs. Don't try to drive it like a modern car. Peter 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Thomas G. Hedberg Posted August 11, 2020 Author Share Posted August 11, 2020 On 8/9/2020 at 5:56 PM, Matt Harwood said: I have a Model 29 in my shop right now, but sadly have yet to get it running so I have no first-hand experience (hopefully I will soon). This may sound redundant and I apologize if it's too basic, but is he double-clutching it between gears? Accelerate, clutch in, move shifter to neutral, clutch out, clutch in, move shifter to next gear, clutch out. It has to happen fairly rapidly to synchronize gear speed with road speed. On cars like this with straight-cut gears it can take some practice to get it just right. Some cars like a quick double-clutch while some don't mind if you are more leisurely. I've found going quickly is best on cars that are balky. Also, it may help to shift at lower RPM--engines like this don't need a lot of RPM and they like to pull rather than rev, so there's no need to wind it out. Just get it rolling in 1st, quickly get 2nd, and you should be in 3rd by 10 MPH and let the torque pull it along. Too high an engine speed can make shifting more difficult. Sorry if he's already doing these things, but it's often a matter of finding what the car wants--two otherwise identical cars could have completely different needs in the shifting department. I hope this helps! Dear Matt, Many thanks to you (as well as to the other responders) I'll try to try out your suggestions on shifting within the next few days and will let you know what happens. Thanks again and best wishes, Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Thomas G. Hedberg Posted August 11, 2020 Author Share Posted August 11, 2020 Dear Matt, Many thanks to you (as well as to the other responders) I'll try to try out your suggestions on shifting within the next few days and will let you know what happens. Thanks again and best wishes, Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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