The phone rang... and then the next car adventure starts

[1935Packard]

Very cool, Ed!

[edinmass]

Here is the Bugatti he passed on in the early 70’s. Type 44 and the serial number was 44923. It sold last year for 400k...........ugly? Not too bad. I will find out the asking number when he went to look at it.

 

Also, here is a current photo of the Alco. The White had a bunch of FANTASTIC siblings in the carriage house.

 

And.....remember from the letter, the Type 44 was available in the “meager price range”..... If anyone today knows where there’s a Type 44 for meager money, please call, PM, or email me immediately! Times have changed!

 

Interstingly , with all the insanely cool stuff in the garage......the “Great White” was not for sale.......period.
 

 

Edited November 17, 2020 by edinmass (see edit history)

[John Bloom]

7 hours ago, edinmass said:

ALSO- Most people here watch American Pickers....which is how shall we say......scripted and fiction. But you can learn a few things from them.........Mike has a common saying that he not only preaches, but actually does. It is:

 

 

If I see something I have never seen before, I buy it. That is GREAT ADVICE 

I will second this and additionally quote a mentor and childhood friend of mine who has a stunning collection of prewar autos, as well as other things that are simply unbelievable.  He is a great guy and I won't mention his name or collection in detail because I'm uncomfortable listing them publicly, but Ed does know him personally and can vouch for the level of stunning cars.  We were visiting in the building that holds most of his collection and he is always gracious to mention his grandfather who was a giant in our home town and who started his grandson's interest and taste in autos (and other things).  Many of the stunning cars were initially bought by his grandfather and he now has those cars as well as others he has purchased.  Explaining how all of this happened to him and his grandfather he said "Most people buy a little of things they made a lot of, my grandfather bought a lot of things they made very little of"...............It is great advice.  

[edinmass]

UPDATE:

 

More from this weekend..........

 

Photo of David C from Georgia visiting.

 

Photo of the overnight post nasal drip on the White......sure likes to mark it's spot.

 

Photos from the show.........

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[edinmass]

[SC38dls]

If it’s not leaking it’s not running! 

[padgett]

Growing up mainly with English cars my meme is "if it's not leaking, it's out of oil". Triumph fixed it, they put a sponge under the crankcase seam.

[keiser31]

2 minutes ago, padgett said:

Growing up mainly with English cars my meme is "if it's not leaking, it's out of oil". Triumph fixed it, they put a sponge under the crankcase seam.

If it's not leaking water through the top and oil out the bottom, it's not English.

[edinmass]

I could change the valve cover gaskets........but since they are 103 years old.......I rather have the bragging rights and some leakage. I’m not sure replacing them will even slow it down by half. 
 

The letter above from Kevin who has known the White for more than fifty years came over to the shop yesterday, and not only gave me that great letter, he told me about the second owner of the car in detail. He owned the car for 68 years, and refused all offers to sell......it only left the garage after the funeral. He owned countless cars and bikes, he truly was a prolific early collector buying his first Bugatti in the late 30’s. He had the White by 1939 or 1940. He actually drove it as a daily driver in 41 & 42. He parked it and never drove it from 42 to 52. He started to service the car in 51/52 and never finished. It ended up in the corner of the garage from 1952 to 2006. It was in good storage. Also, I was correct with the damage to the leather.......the car was fine in the early 70’s and 80’s. Kids playing chauffeur did the damage around the turn of the century.  Keith has owned a bunch of pre war cars, but his heart is in the speed cars from 1910-1915. He owned a White for quite a while and sung its praises. He was all smiles to get in and go for a drive. He instantly evaluated the car and it’s gearing, and commented how great it went down the road. There is an AACA tour in his neighborhood in April, and I was planning on attending. Kevin will now drive the White, and I will drive whatever he gives me......he’s thrilled to get a chance to finally get some windshield time in a car he has been chasing for over forty years. With luck, more information will come to light when I speak to the wife..........time will tell.

 

 

UPDATE: The asking price for the Type 44 was 3500.00 in 1973. It sold last year for 400 thousand at Amelia in Florida.

Edited November 17, 2020 by edinmass (see edit history)

[edinmass]

More fun......with the Peerless special tap and die tool kit, I was able to make the bolts that were missing for the horn. Next time I will start with parkerized bolts. Felt good to put the horn in place, and get it done right. Look close at the photo, and the hood hinge where it attaches to the cowl.....see the pin sticking out? That’s a quick hood release to remove the hood off the car. Quick and easy, one person can get the hood off......very convenient! Interestingly......the hood is marked with a different body number than the rest of the car......it’s off by three............someone must have swapped them out back at Rubay when the cars were in primer.

Edited November 17, 2020 by edinmass (see edit history)

[nickelroadster]

This year has been almost a total loss as far as "car things" go.  When thinking of whether it was worth it to drive 700 miles down to Florida to look at an interesting car, I must admit that I had second thoughts.  No second thoughts anymore as it turned out to be a memorable weekend.  The car was worth seeing and driving and it was very much my kind of car, very original. The car show on Sunday was a real hodgepodge of all kinds of cars with the most common type was a late model Rolls of which there was probably about eight or ten of.  most people seemed to be impressed with  Ed's fabulous white.  Meeting a five time winner, Derek Bell, of Le Mans was also fun and I even got a signed book from him.   Ed was a delightful host and I believe a good time was had by all.  Some of you other guys should try to come see this car as it is well worth it!  I am sorry that I missed a working horn.  Maybe I will have to come again.

 

David

[edinmass]

Dave..... it was great fun having you down for the weekend. Dave and I have never met before this weekend. We found out we had many mutual friends, and many common interests. The highlight of the weekend was Dave driving the car. He also has a bunch of other interesting vehicles that we shared. It’s a great hobby when two strangers can meet,  and end up spending the weekend like they are long-lost friends. The White has been a fun project.  The best part of it is I now have about two dozen more car people in my life. Most of who, have gasoline in their veins. Dave was very gentle with the car, even though it is not yet free of defects. He respected it even though it was difficult to shift. While he was driving we were able to compare it to his 1915 V -8 Oldsmobile. Furthering both his and my education about early cars. I’m looking forward to new adventures and friends the White Motor Car brings into my life. I’m sure I’m gonna get out of it 25 times what I put into it. 👍

Edited November 18, 2020 by edinmass (see edit history)

[wayne sheldon]

That has always been one of the best things about this hobby! I have never found anyplace in this world that I feel I belong as much as with the people passionate about their antique automobiles. As I have said for many years, antique automobiles seem to endow their caretakers with a genuine understanding of history, both general and personal. Antique automobile owners are much more likely to truly know their place in the world, and its history as well as future. 

Antique automobiles can beat you up, breakdown the day before the tour you have been looking forward to all year, and the people take it in stride. I have known many people, including ME, that worked all night through to repair that car and make it anyhow. I don't collect trophies, except for one that I am proud of. I pushed hard to get a car together in time to make an Endurance Run. By the time I got to the starting point, it had been driven less than a hundred yards! Nothing was tour ready. My son and I suffered one breakdown after another, fixed fuel line problems, vacuum tank problems, a short in the wiring, and the transmission shifter literally falling apart with pieces in the transmission oil. Except for a longtime good friend that followed us the last 75 miles, we were the last car to complete the Run! We got the "Hard Luck, but Completed the Run" trophy! It was one of the most fun Endurance Runs I ever went on!

I have known many people that did similar things. And I have been the fellow following the fellow having troubles a few times.  A lot of wonderful people in this hobby.

Edited November 18, 2020 by wayne sheldon
I hate leaving typos! (see edit history)

[edinmass]

Someone sent this to me......driving on the field at the Concours. Lots of fun. I had the oldest car......and the largest. 

[SC38dls]

Are you saying size matters, even if you very old? 

[edinmass]

There were some of those miracle in a bottle spray and shine wax treatments going around to the cars on the field. I went over to them and said.......go to town boys! They passed.

[Bush Mechanic]

Ed, have you had a chance to check the coolant filter you put in the return hose? I would be interested in your verdict on it, if you do. I've been hanging off getting one sent out, waiting for the 'Ed' tick of approval.

[edinmass]

There is nothing in it. Checked it a few days ago. Remember we did back flush and evapo rust the block and radiator. Very little of material came out of either. I have no opinion on them yet.......I probably will not install one ever again. Ultimately, I think they are a bandaid for problems that haven’t been properly dealt with. It’s probably a useful tool to determine how bad of a rust problem you have in a block.

[Grimy]

6 minutes ago, edinmass said:

There is nothing in it. Checked it a few days ago. Remember we did back flush and evapo rust the block and radiator. Very little of material came out of either. I have no opinion on them yet.......I probably will not install one ever again. Ultimately, I think they are a bandaid for problems that haven’t been properly dealt with. It’s probably a useful tool to determine how bad of a rust problem you have in a block.

I use stocking filters in all my cooling systems.  For new acquisitions, filters are essential as the cleaning process continues, to prevent dislodged debris from entering the radiator.  Once the cooling system is all sparkly clean, I continue using a stocking filter but remove and check it only about every four years--to assure myself that the cooling system has remained clean.  I find this particularly important on cars whose cores are not visible under the radiator cap (1934-38 Pierces, for example).  Last year I changed the hoses on my 1930 Pierce after 10 years and was delighted to find absolutely no debris in the stocking.  I will continue to use them.

[edinmass]

If all the members here had a chance to see the unusual collection of medical devices you have in the garage, then they would understand that it’s not unusual for you to be using ladies pantyhose................on the car.🤫

[Grimy]

1 minute ago, edinmass said:

If all the members here had a chance to see the unusual collection of medical devices you have in the garage, then they would understand that it’s not unusual for you to be using ladies pantyhose................on the car.🤫

I can't post them here or the mods would ban me....  One of the pre-war 120V medical devices would probably jump-start your Pierce V-12....

[nickelroadster]

They are a very unusual collection.  I bet nobody could guess what they are!

Edited November 20, 2020 by nickelroadster
misspell (see edit history)

[edinmass]

1 hour ago, nickelroadster said:

They are a very unusual collection.  I bet nobody could guess what they are!

Only the well traveled and worldly amongst us have an idea..........the collection is so unusual, it would make a working girl blush.

[edinmass]

UPDATE:

 

Why is it every time I get involved with a car, after digging around looking for information and provenance, I find cars that no one knew existed. Add another 1917 White Duel Valve to the list! Photos will follow after proper ID and owner approval. It’s a VERY INTERESTING car. Another sleeper waiting to get back on the open road.......interesting body style.........I would sell Trimacar’s underwear just for a ride in it........while he is wearing them!😝
 

Maybe I should do this for a living?🤔

Edited November 20, 2020 by edinmass (see edit history)

[edinmass]

Here is what I believe I located..........the owner, wasn’t sure. I think I am 85 percent certain........4600 in 1917. He is going to need help fixing it.........we will start working on making the parts he needs soon..........AJ won’t like it....not only does it have white walls....The whole thing is White.......some how, for a White, that seems reasonable. Look close double white walls.........AJ, you should buy this thing.

Edited November 20, 2020 by edinmass (see edit history)

[Matt Harwood]

7 minutes ago, edinmass said:

I would sell Trimacar’s underwear just for a ride in it........while he is wearing them!😝
 

Maybe I should do this for a living?🤔

 

What, sell used underwear? I guess if that's your thing you should go for it. You're not quite too old for a career change.

 

I think you're probably better with cars, though.

[edinmass]

14 minutes ago, Matt Harwood said:

 

What, sell used underwear? I guess if that's your thing you should go for it. You're not quite too old for a career change.

 

I think you're probably better with cars, though.

 

Old car people are very cheap.......offer them a good deal on used underwear and most wont be able to resist. Delivered to you door, shipping included. Laundering is available for an additional fee.........yup. Crown Royal played a significant part in this post.

 

And now, a time out to sing Alice’s Restaurant while sitting at the bar, holding on to my seat.

 

Hold on tight, officer Obie wants to hear the “I don’t want a pickle, I just want to drive my motorcycle!” 🤪
 

No toilet seat or paper........”We don’t want no hangings!”

Edited November 20, 2020 by edinmass (see edit history)

[Grimy]

15 minutes ago, Matt Harwood said:

What, sell used underwear? I guess if that's your thing you should go for it. You're not quite too old for a career change.

Matt, how do you think Ed achieved his exalted status in life?  I'm just surprised that now he's admitting to it....

[edinmass]

8 minutes ago, Grimy said:

Matt, how do you think Ed achieved his exalted status in life?  I'm just surprised that now he's admitting to it....

George is just upset that I was unable to secure a buyer for his! Sure paid for a lot of Pierce Arrow’s........got to keep on topic.

 

 

A actual photo, of the restaurant. George’s friend Bob J enjoyed the tour I gave him back at thr PAS meet in thr Berkshires. We drove there in our Pierce Arrow’s. True story.......look it up. Also true.......you can watch the movie on pay per view.

Edited November 20, 2020 by edinmass (see edit history)

[Grimy]

Ed, check your email....

 

In Hillsboro IL is a church converted to a very nice restaurant....

[Bush Mechanic]

5 hours ago, Grimy said:

I use stocking filters in all my cooling systems.  For new acquisitions, filters are essential as the cleaning process continues, to prevent dislodged debris from entering the radiator.  Once the cooling system is all sparkly clean, I continue using a stocking filter but remove and check it only about every four years--to assure myself that the cooling system has remained clean.  I find this particularly important on cars whose cores are not visible under the radiator cap (1934-38 Pierces, for example).  Last year I changed the hoses on my 1930 Pierce after 10 years and was delighted to find absolutely no debris in the stocking.  I will continue to use them.

Mr. Grimy, Sir. The stocking filters certainly have much appeal. Unfortunately, the return hose on my beast (and most others) heads in an uphill direction. Wondering how the debris gets collected there without falling back to the head on shut-down. This why the cone 'fishtrap' element of Ed's unit caught my eye. I am probably missing something, here, or perhaps over-thinking it. Thoughts on this,please?

[Grimy]

Mr. Bush Mechanic, Your Worship 🙂 :  I use a blunt handle (screwdriver, ratchet) to stuff the closed toe of the stocking into the top tank of the radiator *through the upper radiator neck*, then fold the selvage (open end) over the outside of the upper radiator neck.  The upper hose secures the stocking in place.  The toe captures debris and remains in the top tank.  Use a razor blade to cut off the excess showing after the hose has been installed.

 

I use the rather coarse calf-high stockings women wear with slacks, which seem a bit more robust.  After 300 miles or so, drain and save for reinstallation about a gallon of coolant, then remove top hose and the stocking.  The amount of debris in the stocking tip will give you an idea of the next interval.  Rinse the stocking under a faucet and re-use it.  After the first check, you too will be a believer!  After about 2,000 miles or a couple of inspections with minimal debris, you're good for a couple of years.  Of course, anytime you've used a chemical flushing agent, replace the stocking after a thorough flush.

 

This is a finer screen than the Gano filters yet water will pass through the stocking tip even if quite occluded.  This will even catch sludge that beset my Paige after its life with mineral-besotted Iowa water.

 

Gee, this sounds kind of kinky....

Edited November 20, 2020 by Grimy
added four words (see edit history)

[Bush Mechanic]

Thank you Sir, it all makes sense, now. And I already have a large supply of panti-hose on hand, for straining the must of homemade wine. Kinky? Who, me?

Edited November 20, 2020 by Bush Mechanic (see edit history)

[Grimy]

10 minutes ago, Bush Mechanic said:

And I already have a large supply of panti-hose on hand, for straining the must of homemade wine

An even better purpose for them!

[Bush Mechanic]

Well, that's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

[padgett]

And prophylactics were needful for an M 16...

[edinmass]

FINAL REGULAR POST UPDATE:

 

 

Everything in life must come to an end, and it’s time to put this thread to its logical conclusion. While the car still needs a bit of sorting and finishing...........today I will align the front end.......it’s time to end the regular updates. I will install a new set of tires in a few weeks, and do countless other small items. I spent the last four days driving the White as my “everyday car”. It’s been staying outside overnight in my driveway at my house.....the rain and heat finally stopped in Southern Florida. I used the car for going to work, out to eat, the grocery store as well as the hardware store. Took the wife and dogs for a three hour ride in it along the water on Thanksgiving day. Since the first time I started it, it has never failed to proceed or break down. Every single time I set out in it from day one, it’s made it back to the garage without complaint. Rather amazing if you ask me. It’s entirely reliable, starts instantly hot or cold...........the strangest sensation even for me.........a car this early and new to the road is simply a 100 percent reliable car. The car has been a pure joy to learn about, recommission, and drive. I don’t think I have ever worked on a project that was as much fun as this one. I have made fifty new friends during this adventure.........which is even better than owning the car. I will come back and post occasional updates........but the best update will be looking for the car in the publications as I intend to drive it that much in the next few years. The car will now make its way north as soon as it’s finished. The White was one of the few bright spots in my life during the pandemic..........so much sadness and heartbreak  on a daily basis.....it was fantastic therapy for me........and from the comments I have received, for many others as well. I would like to thank everyone who has helped, commented, shared information, and contacted me during this “Great White Adventure” the car has become something much different than I anticipated..........and every single part of the journey has been fun. My best to all...........and I hope to see you at a show or on a tour.....with a bit of luck, I will be driving the White or displaying it at the event. We still have another six months of challenging times ahead of us before we get back to “normal”...........if anyone dares to think any of us ever fit the definition of the word!

 

 

Edited November 27, 2020 by edinmass (see edit history)

[trimacar]

One of the best phone calls I ever made...great adventure, Ed...

[SC38dls]

We enjoyed the ride along this adventure has been as well. Looking forward to seeing it and possibly getting that actual ride in the days to come. It’s been a series of bright spots during this pandemic and none better than hearing Phil is coming out of his touch of C19 ok. I hope you enjoy this continuing adventure for many years to come. 
Now maybe you can do this all over again with another thread on something you mentioned early in the Great White thread!  
dave s 

[edinmass]

1 minute ago, SC38DLS said:

We enjoyed the ride along this adventure has been as well. Looking forward to seeing it and possibly getting that actual ride in the days to come. It’s been a series of bright spots during this pandemic and none better than hearing Phil is coming out of his touch of C19 ok. I hope you enjoy this continuing adventure for many years to come. 
Now maybe you can do this all over again with another thread on something you mentioned early in the Great White thread!  
dave s 

 

The next car.......will be a little while till I get to Long Island to pick it up. As I said before.....it’s strange. It too has an interesting  history........... No guessing or posting yet please.........your one hint is in the post below.