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1 hour ago, 1935Packard said:

According to Steve Babinsky's "President's Message"  in the last CCCA newsletter, the proposal to add Packard 120s to the CCCA list of approved cars is not going forward.  The member survey indicated that an "overwhelming majority" wanted to add 120s to the list, but the Classification Committee "narrowly decided against bringing it to the Board for a vote."   Interesting. 



I was working on a 120 the other day........they are cheap, and not well built. They were inexpensive new. They are nice drivers, and so are 1935 Ford’s. It’s supposed to be a luxury car club..........although like everything else in this country, it has to be watered down and make others feel “inclusive”. Bullshit. I own a 1915 Ford T, and I don’t try and Caravan with it. I drive it and use it with the Ford club. This everyone needs to be catered to and made to feel good about themselves is asinine. All people should be treated with decency and respect.........all people have the same rights and privileges afforded to us by the US Constitution...........as it should be. Treating our fellow countrymen in a polite and respectful way is what all of us should aspire to. Not letting someone take a Ford on the Duesenberg Club tour is NOT discrimination and it’s not putting someone down........it’s about driving a certain brand of car. Exclusiveness in an organization based on interests is fine......and what makes certain organizations interesting and allows like minded people to freely associate with others that have the same common interest. I don’t belong to the Chevy Club, or the Edsel Club. Doesn’t mean I’m biased, doesn’t mean I look down on those cars or their owners, it just means I’m not particularly interested in those cars. Notice no political talk here.......just an analysis of too much group think. The AACA doesn’t let in five year old cars as collector cars........does that make them objectionable? No........it makes them a club of cars that accepts only vehicles over twenty five years old. That is an exclusive rule........it rules out 99 percent of the cars on the road...........and it doesn’t make the club or it’s members bad people. End of my rant.

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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I fully support going earlier like they did.   I think the club is much more about a coachbuilt 1918 Model 48 Locomobile than a 54 Bentley.


I don't know why the economy car that Packard dreamed up to save the company would make the list.  Even if they are attractive and carry a Packard nameplate.

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I might think it is a good idea (adding lower priced cars) if it would add members to the club.  It won’t.  There are already great cars that are accepted by the CCCA that are sub $40k.  A senior 1941 60 special just sold for $35k. 


From my standpoint it won’t add any members. 

How many members have only a Chrysler Town and Country?   Ie, allowing the Town and County in caused them to join.  My guess: very few.  It only allows members who own the cars already to bring them to events.  


That does not seem to cure their problem of lower membership.  

Here is an idea:  comb through the ccca eligible cars in the Buick club, Cadillac club, ACD club, Packard club , Lincoln clubs, etc and send the owners who are not CCCA members of these cars a free 6 month membership, starting in March.  Then have the regions invite these new members to their events throughout the summer.  

But that takes work and effort.  It is much easier to let in 120 Packards or Oldsmobiles and cross your fingers that the owners will join. 

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Some sage advice spoken here, but would not be considered seriously by the board. Yes, it would work, even if it got an additional 50 members total , more then there is interested now.

Nearly a decade ago the 120 was considered by the Classification committee and rejected then, what changed? Lack of members changed. As mentioned, why water things down, there are ways to gain membership that really do not cost a lot of $ to do so but many that have been mentioned are ignored.

I owned a 120 Packard for decades but did not consider it a classic and it was a very rare factory body that Packard had built by an outside coach builder. 

I wish the CCCA the very best possible but in order to continue to exist they will have to reconsider what to do to make the club attractive to draw in new people .

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6 hours ago, edinmass said:

Post 1948 cars added would be an end to the club. They should have stopped pre was like in the early days. Only the Lincoln Continental was allowed post war for years. Never mind the 60 series Cadillacs.


I can definitely understand stopping at 1942.  It's an easy bright line rule.  But if you're going to include a few post-war cars that were basically the same as included pre-war cars, I'm not sure why a car like the '51 Delahaye above shouldn't be included. It seems like a pre-war car that they just kept making, in very small numbers, for a few extra years.

Edited by 1935Packard (see edit history)
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It’s killing me not to answer in a snide, smart ass manor.......since you’re not AJ, and are educated, refined, and have a certain “je ne sais quoi” to your personality............it’s about an era. Not a particular year. Post war everything was different. 

Think of it like this.......the jazz era, or the rap era.


Pretty fancy language for a low class Canuck from the wrong side of the tracks. Who would’ve imagined that I have savoir fair!


Look them up!😛

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
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Wow, Ed. you're impressing me with your excellent mastery of a fern language.  Oh, sorry, that's a slip from the greenhouse, foreign.  


When one starts a club, let's say 1909 VSDB pennies, that's great. You have to own one, or have a great appreciation for such a year and the mark.  Or, in the case of the cars, the marque.  Not crazy rare, but expensive.  Thousands to buy one. 


Then, membership fails, so the club adds the VDB penny.  Well, rare, yes, just missing a slight mark from the really nice stuff.  But still, a somewhat more exclusive club.


Then, it really gets bad.  So, the heads of the club say, gee, let's just let in any old penny that's out there, prior to 1950 of course.  And so it begins...and there's no longer a club with focus, just another club....

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I recognize that running a large organization, like the CCCA, is a massive juggling act.   The cars that are admitted into the club is only one piece of the puzzle. 


I am a past member of the CCCA.   Therefore, my views are from someone who has been a member of the CCCA and I am looking back as to why I left.   If the CCCA board takes the time to listen to those who left the club they might have a more clear vision in how to move forward.


The collector car that I own is a recognized CCCA Full Classic.  I have heard it referred to within the CCCA organization as a “lesser Classic.”  When I bought my 1929 Studebaker President it was because I wanted a Studebaker President.   I was not looking for membership in the CCCA. 


After I owned a recognized CCCA car, and discovered that I was eligible for membership in the CCCA, I decided to give the club a try.   I was a member for several years, including membership in a local region, region newsletter editor, a regional board member, and for a while the board director.   I consider myself as having given the CCCA a reasonable chance.   I won’t go back.   


If the CCCA wants to attract, and retain membership, they need to stop focusing on adding cars to the list of eligible Classics.   There are enough cars from the “lesser Classics” to the “desirable Classics.”  The cars that are eligible to be on the CCCA list is just one issue.   The additional issue is the cost of membership and the cost of participating in CCCA events.  


While I was a CCCA member there were very view events that I could participate in because of the cost.   I was a school teacher on a limited income.  Now I am a retired school teacher on a really limited income.   Yes, I can afford a “lesser Classic”, however, I could not afford most of the CCCA events.  I had always wanted to go on a CCCA CARavan, unfortunately, they were always financially out of reach.  By the time you add up the cost of traveling to the starting point, the full cost of the CARavan, the cost of traveling back home, it was way outside of a middle class school teachers budget.  


Not every club is for every person.  I get it.   The CCCA was not for me because I can’t afford to pay to play with the guys and gals who plan events for their Full Classics.   Which brings me back to my point – If you are going to let in less expensive cars like the 120 Packard then you better start planning for less expensive activities.   You can’t have the “lesser” cars included in your roster of approved Full Classics and then have every event out of reach of those very same members you sought to include.  

Edited by Mark Huston (see edit history)
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Mark, sorry to hear that your time in the CCCA was less than perfect. Mine has been the opposite. To set up inexpensive short tours

and gatherings should be pretty easy at the regional club level. If you served in those capacities in the region you might have missed

some opportunities to set some of those up yourself.


Where I really disagree with you is as to CARavans. They have been phenomenal. Of course they are expensive. So is my annual vacation

to Hawaii. In fact vacations anywhere are usually costly, assuming that you want to stay in nice places. It does cost to ship cars to the destinations,

but the Club works to have CARvans in different geographical areas (less travel for you). I have had members often offer their car to me to save the

transport costs, and I have made reverse offers to others. Not all of us are retired, so when we take our time off to go on a tour we really like to

visit interesting areas and stay in reasonably nice places.


What I know for sure is that it would have cost me a small fortune to have a staff come in for me and spend hundreds of hours finding great roads,

great hotels and great things for me to see (often unavailable to the general public).   I get that for free from the many local club volunteers and

national board folks who do it for me. If you have NOT been on a CARavan and you are confusing it with a general vacation to that area, you have no idea

what you are missing.  As they say, you come for the cars and stay for the people.........


As just a regular club member, who lives pretty close to you and one who owns a Studebaker President, I would invite you to rejoin.



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