Mark Gregory Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 (edited) Some news about Tesla cars Shares of Tesla gained 5% to hit a new all-time high of $1,135, giving the company a valuation of roughly $206.5 billion, compared with Toyota's valuation of about $202 billion. ... In the same period, Toyota produced 2.4 million vehicles.8 hours ago Tesla tops Toyota to become largest automaker by market value Edited July 1, 2020 by Mark Gregory (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lebowski Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 And at the other end of the spectrum does anyone know how much Yugo is worth these days? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dustycrusty Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auburnseeker Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 Seems to be valued purely on speculation and not on actual sales and output. Careful or they'll have you taking your dividends in bitcoin. I prefer to value something on actual products that could be sold not speculation of what hasn't been built yet. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalowed Bill Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 (edited) Few of the stock prices we see today are a true reflection of their actual value. The future of much of the economy is a crap shoot. The wealthy still have money to invest and, it seems to me, that many have chosen to bet on a perceived long term trends rather then the uncertainty of today's economy. Edited July 2, 2020 by Buffalowed Bill (see edit history) 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 Today’s stock market is the biggest legal gambling operation in the world. Nothing seems to be based on real value, just wild speculation. It’s always had some degree of speculation in it but today’s market seems to be running wild. The sad part is so much of the money in it is retirement funds that shouldn’t be used for gambling. As usual it’s the investment bankers that win regardless of what the market does. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete O Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 Remember the dot com bubble of the '90s? Same thing going on with Tesla. Their stock price is being inflated by hope, which is not an actual business plan. Having said that, I sincerely hope that Tesla thrives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenie Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 They are apparently delivering some cars with their new tractor trailers. We can all keep laughing until Elon becomes the next Henry Ford. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdc Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 How can a company that has been loosing money for 90% of its existence be more valuable than a company that produced almost 25 times as many vehicles in the same time frame? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 1 minute ago, bdc said: How can a company that has been loosing money for 90% of its existence be more valuable than a company that produced almost 25 times as many vehicles in the same time frame? Stock values are predicated almost entirely on what people buying them today think someone will pay for them tomorrow. The company such stocks represent is largely meaningless anymore. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8E45E Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 On 7/1/2020 at 5:59 PM, Lebowski said: And at the other end of the spectrum does anyone know how much Yugo is worth these days? More when transformed into Modern Art. http://www.mwstaffo.com/yugo/ Craig 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdc Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 16 hours ago, Matt Harwood said: Stock values are predicated almost entirely on what people buying them today think someone will pay for them tomorrow. The company such stocks represent is largely meaningless anymore. That shows that the whole stockmarket is a huge bubble! 1929 in the making...history repeats itself usually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hidden_hunter Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 29 minutes ago, bdc said: That shows that the whole stockmarket is a huge bubble! 1929 in the making...history repeats itself usually. pretty much, the minute the whole covid situation started I switched my retirement fund from growth investments to cash for that reason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaybokay Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Interesting stuff, to be sure, but I doubt it will end well for Tesla. It's position was already fairly weakened before this whole Covid thing started on account of concerns about build quality and problems with the Gigaplant. Keep in mind that I don't hate Tesla. I'd never own one of their vehicles, but I don't actively hate them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1935Packard Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 (edited) On this board, it seems, news that Tesla's stock is up proves that the stock market is delusional, while news that Tesla's stock is down shows that the market is all-knowing. Seriously, I have no idea how to value Tesla vs. Ford, but I'll stick to my guns that Teslas are incredible accomplishments. World-beater cars, truly revolutionary technology that everyone sees as the future, constantly improving, blindingly fast, and beautifully designed. All designed and made here in the USA, with factories popping up around the world to export US know-how.. Again, I have no idea how to value it versus Ford. But it seems like something we would want to root for, or at least I do. Related story about how Tesla is doing well in the pandemic while other car companies are struggling. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/02/business/tesla-sales-second-quarter.html Edited July 3, 2020 by 1935Packard (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 There's a pretty strong hatred of electric cars here, for reasons I've never been able to explain beyond political affiliation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
padgett Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 October 1929 started out great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarNucopia Posted July 4, 2020 Share Posted July 4, 2020 6 hours ago, Matt Harwood said: There's a pretty strong hatred of electric cars here, for reasons I've never been able to explain beyond political affiliation. I think you’re conflating feelings about Tesla vs. EVs in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9 Posted July 4, 2020 Share Posted July 4, 2020 On 7/2/2020 at 1:18 PM, bdc said: How can a company that has been loosing money for 90% of its existence be more valuable than a company that produced almost 25 times as many vehicles in the same time frame? Good question. I asked the same thing about Amazon in the 90’s as they bled millions every quarter but refused to die. Sometimes things have a way of working out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
padgett Posted July 4, 2020 Share Posted July 4, 2020 Well I can see hybrids for the range issue (today), and just like the earlier Hummer H3 they are fashionable. Personally I usually buy cars after they have depreciated out and wouldn't touch an old electric car even though the Tesla quality is probably better than the CitiCar and have AC. As to money, I suspect SpaceX is doing well (accountants can be very creative). As to electric trucks, the UK milk trucks have been working for over a century so have a place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalowed Bill Posted July 5, 2020 Share Posted July 5, 2020 On 7/2/2020 at 1:18 PM, bdc said: How can a company that has been loosing money for 90% of its existence be more valuable than a company that produced almost 25 times as many vehicles in the same time frame? In 1995 I became the the USPS account rep for a small company that was fighting the trend of the dotcom failures. The question was asked, for decades, how could this company's stock price keep increasing while it was showing an operating loss every year. Nobody asks why or how any more. If you haven't guessed, the company is Amazon. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
padgett Posted July 5, 2020 Share Posted July 5, 2020 The secret is creative accounting. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ojh Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 I read that Elon is very upset with California politics and is moving to Texas? I think it was. I have no problem with electric cars, saves the gas for us, I do have a problem with the idiots that idolize the brand and thinks the owner walks on water. Its still a lump of metal with wheels at 4 corners, a horseless carriage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 Tesla is out of manufacturing room in CA and with the price of land there it would not make sense to build there. Texas and Oklahoma seem to be in the running right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalowed Bill Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 Idolize Musk? I don't know anyone who thinks that he walks on water. I do like his product and believe that he was a visionary for being able to produce an electric car that even a car people like. Politics and personality aside, and maybe a little selfishly, I hope they survive, because I hope to be able to own one some day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryB Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 Henry Ford also had quite a few views that did not endear him to everyone. Seems like success can make you think you are an expert in everything. I’m definitely not an expert in everything so I guess success hasn’t found me yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 1 hour ago, ojh said: I do have a problem with the idiots that idolize the brand and thinks the owner walks on water. Its still a lump of metal with wheels at 4 corners, a horseless carriage. Do real people actually do that? Or is that just an anonymous imaginary stereotype that makes it easier to think Teslas and their enthusiasts are stupid? Plenty of people love their Volkswagens without anyone drawing a line connecting them to Adolph Hitler. People seem to love their Tesla automobiles yet admit that the guy who builds them is a character. That's not unique in the history of the industry--look at E.L. Cord, Ned Jordan, Preston Tucker, and Earl Muntz--all characters with controversy constantly nipping at their heels. They had their adherents and their detractors. I know plenty of people who own Teslas and not one of them has ever tried to tell me how awesome Elon Musk is. Most seem to think he is kind of a doofus who nevertheless seems to dream big and puts his money in the right place more often than not. That about sums it up as far as I'm concerned. Is that enough for the haters? I don't know. But the love-blind Tesla-fest that the haters like to imagine is happening, isn't. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
padgett Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 Any car with "Ludicrous Speed" cannot be all bad. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8E45E Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 15 hours ago, padgett said: Any car with "Ludicrous Speed" cannot be all bad. I admire electric vehicles for their unmatched performance, especially trolley buses. Fully loaded with rush-hour passengers standing in the aisle, those older ACF/Brill and CCF/Brill trolley buses could easily ascend steep hills without any strain, and even accelerate going up hill if they needed to, while their diesel-powered brethren would be lugging at 10-15 mph tops, huffing and puffing up the same hill. Edmonton Transit and several other city transit systems foolishly got rid of their trolleybus fleet claiming it was getting difficult to maintain the overhead wire network, and others claimed it to be an 'eyesore'. (Not that anyone looks up while walking along the sidewalk anymore. They all got their eyes DOWN looking at their iphones.) Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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