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NOT MINE: 1939 Delahaye 135M Cabriolet


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I have no Knowledge of whether this is any kind of deal or what it could actually be bought for as they say a substantial cash discount but you would have a pretty cool car after investing untold wheelbarrow loads of cash.  Also not something you usually see on Craigslist.

 

1939 Delahaye 135M Cabriolet, one of two 1939 Letouneur et Marchand bodied 135M's and the only surviving example. 90+% complete. Sitting since 1962. Needs complete restoration. Substantial discount for cash buyer. Will also trade for land in the Canaan/Cornwall/Sharon CT area plus cash. Additional photos are available upon request. 

$220000

 

 

 

 

https://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/atq/d/wallingford-1939-delahaye-135m-cabriolet/7118235775.html

00Q0Q_eiHqnC2Hp8I_600x450.jpg

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Prewar 135M is a big time car.  But that car looks like it has been sitting in a rusty inducing lean to for years.   I'm not sure that price is attainable at a Pebble Beach auction,  let alone Craig's list.

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Makes one wonder what a steep cash discount means?  I agree looks rough,  but it is nice to see something besides a hacked up normal production car for sale once in a while.  Proportionately it's probably normal craigslist over pricing.  Just the numbers are much bigger. 

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I always tell people not to come unless they have cash to buy. It is a wonderful step toward closing the deal.

 

"Would you like to come tomorrow? The banks are closing in about an hour."

 

"No, I think I can make it before they close if I hurry".

 

It makes me smile just to write that.

 

Bernie

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The cost to get this vehicle up to what is normal condition for an auction? $200,000? Labor alone I opine should be over $100,000. Add that to the $220,000 demand and you are close to $500,000. Is this unit really worth that price at auction? 

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  • 2 weeks later...

At $4.04, I would even pay to have it shipped here, drop it in my back yard, and plant flowers in it. Would bring me more years of joy than anyone who paid to restore it could possibly expect to get. 

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Just a word to the wise or unwise - unless it is a million dollar car when restored or ..., you had better keep your project cars priced under 100K or be willing to sit on them for a couple years and then take the discount nevertheless.  When I have people offer their "logic", I am quick to say they should do it then with their money - and then the excuses are one after the next after the next.  As to the doing it for the love - well, you have to love it first and then I have to watch my feet from falling off door or fight off rats, then probably my love will probably be a little on the weak side. 

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Actually the 4.04 would be a hell of a deal for a planter.  Just got back from spending over $300 at the garden center on flowers and none of the pots were under $20.  The nice ones were alot more.   Would look cool at the end of the driveway though,  but that would be another $300 in flowers. 

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The couple thousand dollars in shipping would take the economy out of the planter plan... I suppose it could be shipped open, so perhaps only one $1,004.04 plus 300 in flowers. 

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Photos (few) without any of them of the engine makes me think that the engine compartment is in a horrible condition. Is craigslist so expensive that to place more photos makes it too costly to market?   

 

The seller appears to be unfamiliar with how to sell a used classic or the seller has on his hands a rust bucket that he is trying to sell without making full disclosure. I doubt he will get an offer above $45,000. I am sure that some of the parts would be desirable, but without good photos it appears that there is more damage to be discovered. Sad that the car was stored in such poor condition for what appears to be so long a time frame.  I opine that the former owner went to his grave with the thought of this car being worth more than in reality. From the look of the car I surmise that that the former owner's grave is filled with a pine box or used plywood.

 

Reminds me of the group of old Lincoln vehicles from an Estate that sold in Marysville CA last year where  the seller (Estate of the deceased) initially 2+ years ago wanted $120,000+ for the group. Once the Estate learned that no one was interested the Estate ended up selling them in an auction 18 months later for less than $20,000 and having to pay 10% to 15% commission to the auction house. I think the buyers at that auction however likely paid too much and may have buyer's remorse as the condition of those cars was very rough.  

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Horrible advertisement in the wrong venue.

 

But you guys are underestimating the car itself.   It is a Letourneur et Marchand body which is much better than the run of the mill Chapron bodied cars that are plentiful.

 

Again,  seller is foolish for not pulling the car out and getting clear shots of the back and the windshield.     I compare it to this Pourtout bodied car that I saw at Amelia and LOVED.

 

Delahaye 135M Cabriolet by Portout - Delahaye

 

 

Edited by alsancle (see edit history)
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Here are some similar cars that have sold at auction within the past 10 years. Sale prices suggest the seller's price is off by an order of magnitude given the cost of restoration and the finished car's value. It strikes me as just another guy who lucked into something interesting, found one comp that maybe brought huge money, and decided that car collectors are just simple idiots with too much money.

 

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10 minutes ago, Matt Harwood said:

Here are some similar cars that have sold at auction within the past 10 years. Sale prices suggest the seller's price is off by an order of magnitude given the cost of restoration and the finished car's value. It strikes me as just another guy who lucked into something interesting, found one comp that maybe brought huge money, and decided that car collectors are just simple idiots with too much money.


Someone should correct him on the reality of the situation.  First: we are complex idiots. Second: by the time we have enough cars to be collectors, most of the money is gone. 

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When doing comps  you need to compare to prewar 135M specification,  4/5 passenger convertible.     The 2 passenger cars will break 7 figures but there are few of those. 

 

I believe this car is worth more than the typical Chapron,  but without seeing it in full view it is hard to tell.     I liked my comparison to the Pourtout which brought 500k with an older restoration.  My only nit, would be the front of this body style is much swoopier and probably led to the strong result.

 

Delahaye 135 M Pourtout Cabriolet

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I think we are looking at something more along these lines - the traditional Delahaye (the sporty Buick of France).  And someone should have fixed the landau irons - that is what wrenches are for. 

<b>1939 Delahaye 135M Competition Convertible Coupe  </b><br />Chassis no. 48700 <br />Engine no. 48700

2015:  https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/22717/lot/236/  with sale price of $297,000 incl. premium 

Edited by John_Mereness (see edit history)
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1 minute ago, mike6024 said:

00Q0Q_4VRsUIfh8y1_1200x900.jpg

 

Has fender skirts

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well, that is better than most from the tail - add on another 50K-ish for tail end potential, but still saying owner will be hard pressed to get over 100K - maybe low 100's

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By the way, this "condition" will easily happen to anything stored in a crate or a trailer, especially in climates such as Florida or even Ohio where you have dramatic temperature changes that cause "sweating" - or even California where you have heat. 

Edited by John_Mereness (see edit history)
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27 minutes ago, mike6024 said:

Yes I've heard of a car rusting away in a shipping container. That was supposed to have preserved it.

 

 

This is what happens when you have sweating involved from temperature changes - common in trailer storage.  

 

The Auburn I am restoring is that way and went from one of the nicer original cars to needing every single piece totally done in a year and a half - owner expected to pull out his beautiful car out of the trailer and was instead horrified and put up for sale immediately. 

Edited by John_Mereness (see edit history)
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22 minutes ago, Restorer32 said:

You have to admit though this car is well worth restoring if it can be bought at the right price.

Make no mistake - all this kind of stuff gets restored.  The problem is that to get restored you are investing 250K plus for a car in this condition (maybe less if you are careful, but then doing a lot of it yourself and ...).  And, the money is coming out of your wallet, so would you still interested in anything other than a discount when you are paying to break even or loose money ?  The logical move is to get one pretty nice and then upgrade, change its colors, and ....

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Just now, John_Mereness said:

Make no mistake - all this kind of stuff gets restored.  The problem is that to get restored you are investing 250K plus for a car in this condition (maybe less if you are careful, but then doing a lot of it yourself and ...).  And, the money is coming out of your wallet, so would you still interested in anything other than a discount when you are paying to break even or loose money ?  The logical move is to get one pretty nice and then upgrade, change its colors, and ....

 

There are not many guys left like you John, that can GC their projects and do some of the smaller work themselves to keep the costs down.   This is not a large car but there are is lots of chrome and leather and paint.  

 

A significant car that may be worthy of restoration depending on what that windshield looks like.  One to two inches in greenhouse height will tell the story.

 

 The cars you posted at all Chapron or similar and lesser to this car, in my opinion.

 

 

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Just now, alsancle said:

 

 The cars you posted at all Chapron or similar and lesser to this car, in my opinion.

 

 

Agree, its windshield height and construction will be key (hard to tell as not a full windshield shot, windows partially down, and top down too).  I was impressed by its tail (at least from a side view), but still not leaning toward a take your breath away swoopy affair - it leans toward the generics.  Possibly could pull a class win at such as Pebble Beach - but a gamble. And could win at any other concours, but still a gamble there too. 

 

And, it gets more and more hard by the day for even me to deal with these kind of projects - and I even have my support network. 

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56 minutes ago, mike6024 said:

 

I think the L&M car has a more attractive back side.   But the Figoni car has the more pronounced fenders in front as well as the magic name.   It gives you a good idea of upper bound on full retail for a fully restored similar car.

 

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