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Period images to relieve some of the stress


Walt G

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Me a politician?!!! 🤪 I would last about 3 heartbeats before I got someone really annoyed at me because I did not agree with their perception of reality.

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Politics and religion are taboo, Walt, but I'm hoping you or someone can tell me what a top like this was called back in the day.  I don't recall ever seeing anything like it.  Kind of a jack-in-the-box arrangement.

Boston Catholic.jpg

T dog.jpg

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20 hours ago, Walt G said:

OK guys, it has been 23 hours since I contributed the image of the 1933 Ford in France , and no one has mentioned the headlamps - look inside past the lens on the car, does it look different? Stop gazing at your Easter basket 🤪 and tell me what is different? Are they stock Ford factory headlamps? are they European? or are they a combination of both?

This whole thread to me is about making you think , observe ...................... yes, the historian and former teacher in me is still very much active and well , even on the annual country wide "bunny" day.

 

 

Walt.......what's a Ford? 🤔

 

Sorry, I can't help myself sometimes. 

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I have seen that "flip top" type of body on similar style vans of that same era but never in a sales or promotion piece in anything  by any body builder nor commercial periodical that focused on trucks. No specific name either . It seems to have been around in the 1913-1919 era, none before or after that time that I can recall an image of.
The bulldog on the hood of the model T racer looks great, need one of those looking like that at Hershey! Nice period accessory!

Ford - well it means Fantastic Overbuilt Reworked Duesenberg , Ed, thought you knew that , A.J. told me he reminds you of that all the time!

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On 4/3/2021 at 2:36 PM, Walt G said:

One additional Ford of France image and I will be done for a few days , have to look some Lincoln stuff up to possibly go with a story a friend did for the 100th anniversary of that make. Happy Easter everyone.

FORDFrance193001.jpg

    Obviously a photoshopped ad with a driverless flying 33 Ford Roadster 

    with a young woman waving to the people below.   They also photo           

    deleted the convex headlight lenses, left door handle and slanted

    the left side windshield stantion to denote speed.  (Also common in

    advertising with artists renditions of automobiles of the period)

    My 2 cents worth.

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Interesting comments Paul, thank you. I think cut and past and air brush were the way photos were "enhanced" in that era, photoshopped is a modern equivalent with the modern technology now available in the last 30-40 years, My thought was that the guts ( reflectors etc) of the Ford lamps were replaced with units from Marchal, the European lamp manufacturer/supplier. The laws in Europe for lighting were not the same as the USA. thus larger fender mounted lamps ( what we would deem parking lamps) were required in addition to the headlamps and most of the period photos I have seen for all cars had different interior equipment in the headlamps if the USA shells were used. Most of the time the entire light was replaced - it was just easier to do.

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On 4/4/2021 at 12:25 PM, Colin Spong said:

1928 Lincoln L with  unknown French coachwork. Suggestions are Binder, Franay or Saoutchik. The licence plate can be dated to Paris, 1928.

The car has a full set of Grebel lamps and disc wheels (Michelin?) The photo was found by me at a Paris flea market.

French 1 001 (2).jpg

French 2 001 (2).jpg

That highly polished belt molding was a Fernandez & Darrin trademark wasn't it? 

 

d.jpg

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1 hour ago, nzcarnerd said:

 

Some research to do but I think Pawson's car is a rebodied Humberette from 1903-04. 

That was my thought as well.

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5 hours ago, Walt G said:

Interesting comments Paul, thank you. I think cut and past and air brush were the way photos were "enhanced" in that era, photoshopped is a modern equivalent with the modern technology now available in the last 30-40 years, My thought was that the guts ( reflectors etc) of the Ford lamps were replaced with units from Marchal, the European lamp manufacturer/supplier. The laws in Europe for lighting were not the same as the USA. thus larger fender mounted lamps ( what we would deem parking lamps) were required in addition to the headlamps and most of the period photos I have seen for all cars had different interior equipment in the headlamps if the USA shells were used. Most of the time the entire light was replaced - it was just easier to do.

I believe Lucas also had a headlight assembly with a flat glass outer lens which protected the silver reflector, with an inner diffusing lens immediately ahead of the bulb, (although I can't really see Lucas being sourced for a French-market car.)  A forerunner to the later Lucas P-100 headlamp assemblies?

 

Craig

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8 hours ago, Walt G said:

I have seen that "flip top" type of body on similar style vans of that same era but never in a sales or promotion piece in anything  by any body builder nor commercial periodical that focused on trucks. No specific name either . It seems to have been around in the 1913-1919 era, none before or after that time that I can recall an image of.
The bulldog on the hood of the model T racer looks great, need one of those looking like that at Hershey! Nice period accessory!

Ford - well it means Fantastic Overbuilt Reworked Duesenberg , Ed, thought you knew that , A.J. told me he reminds you of that all the time!

I thought it stood for Fix I Again Tony !

 

Sorry, a bit of 'King of the Hill' humor

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1 hour ago, TAKerry said:

I thought it stood for Fix I Again Tony !

 

Sorry, a bit of 'King of the Hill' humor

 Fix it again Tony is Fiat.

 

Ford is funny old rattling disappointment - among many other things.

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16 hours ago, 58L-Y8 said:

Is this a Biddle?  The photo is an obviously posed publicity image of a child actor cranking his expensive touring.   Did you ever notice the similarity of the V-wind-split headlights and radiator of the Biddle and the 1932-'34 Packards?

 

Walt: The French 1933 Ford appeared to have Marchal headlights, difficult to tell for sure from the angle.

It's a Meteor (Philadelphia).

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Just think how many trees that your little flash drives have saved. This is 4.5 mega bites in 1955. Then for those who thought Chevrolet was the only division that toyed with coming out with a sports car. Then, like the Borg said: "resistance is futile" 1918 flu

4.5 megabytes of data in 62,500 IBM punched cards in 1955..jpg

1954 Oldsmobile F88.jpg

No mask,no ride Seattle 1918 Spanish Flu Pandemic.jpg

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Posted (edited)

Derham Body Co. of Rosemont, Pa. built this town car body on a Chrysler Chassis in 1937. Lower body structure below the belt line was Chrysler sedan and modifications were done above that and to the interior. With the Great Depression going on the demand for custom bodied luxury cars grew less , among one of the reasons was that the wealthy people who could afford a custom car did not want to be "in the face" of many who had no jobs nor enough to eat, so some cars were still being built for customers by Derham but were not as dramatic in appearance. Derham also became a dealership for Chrysler about 1937 so had a ready supply of chassis/cars that could be altered for customers, a good number of Chrysler 8 and 6 cylinder cars would see the factory bodies modified to give those cars a unique look . The last sales catalog Derham issued for custom cars was in 1967.

CHryslertowncarDerham 1937 001.jpg

Edited by Walt G (see edit history)
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2 minutes ago, Walt G said:

Derham also became a dealership for Chrysler about 1937 so had a ready supply of chassis/cars that could be altered for customers, a good number of Chrysler 8 and 6 cylinder cars would see the factory bodies modified to give those cars a unique look . The last sales catalog Derham issued for custom cars was in 1967.

 

I do know Derham did some alterations to Packards and Hudsons after the war, including a 1951 for the Mrs. Barit, the wife of the President of Hudson at the time.

 

Craig

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Craig, you are correct. Derham would work on any car a customer wanted! They took on the Chrysler franchise as a backup for extra $ income on a regular basis . In the late 1940's - 1947-48 they did full customs on Dodge chassis, at least two I am aware of and have photos of . In the late 1950s and early 1960s with much revolutions ( today deemed/labeled  unrest?) going on in South America and Cuba they had a increase in work to armor plate and bomb proof automobiles as well.

Walt

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9 hours ago, hanski said:

It's a Meteor (Philadelphia).

Thanks, I knew there were a related contemporaries to the Biddle, the Meteor also of Philadelphia and the Argonne of Jersey City, N.J.   

 

AJ:  I don't think that was a Stutz...it was an Hispano-Suiza!

'20's Hispano-Suiza 'truck-mill'.jpg

Edited by 58L-Y8
Hispano-Suiza (see edit history)
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2 hours ago, Walt G said:

Craig, you are correct. Derham would work on any car a customer wanted! They took on the Chrysler franchise as a backup for extra $ income on a regular basis . In the late 1940's - 1947-48 they did full customs on Dodge chassis, at least two I am aware of and have photos of . In the late 1950s and early 1960s with much revolutions ( today deemed/labeled  unrest?) going on in South America and Cuba they had a increase in work to armor plate and bomb proof automobiles as well.

Walt

Hey guys,

While we're on the Derham subject. I saw this Caddy in Hemmings back in 2019. They said the present top was vinyl, but the original was leather. Just like the top on your former 1931 Franklin Derham Walt. It was listed as a 1948.

Bill

1948 cad 1.jpg

1948 cad 2.jpg

1948 cad 3.jpg

1948 cad 4.jpg

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Bill, Yes indeed. This Cadillac has the Derham script badge emblem that was starting to be used by them in about 1941. If you look on the photo of the 1937 town car I posted just in front of the lower front door bottom hinge you will see a small triangle shield shape. That was the Derham badge in use just about from the teens up until 1941. Leather roofs - yes I recall the installation on the 1931 Franklin victoria very well, the upholsterer had a devil of a time trying to get hides large enough to do the job without a lot of seams being placed where they weren't originally.

If you get a leather roof soaking wet with rain for an extended period of time ( like a 4 plus hour session driving from long island to the center of NY State for a Franklin Club meet) the leather roof swells, stretches and gets a lot of sags. First time I saw that I almost passed out! But the sags go away once it drys out. Like some of the people who read this and contribute we have had decades of just about every kind of experience with the pre war cars and some are very unique just to custom built ones. I never owned or restored a car that I then didn't drive for tens of thousands of miles after it was done- every mile I drove it made me think 'this is what all the $, time and effort spent was all about' - going down the road in a car with running boards and headlamps mounted on a bar between the front fenders.

Walt

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Padded formal tops in landau leather or Hartz cloth fitted to luxury sedans largely became Derham's stock and trade in the postwar years.  The CCCA Museum Archives have digitized the remaining Derham files they have in their collection.  Although Derham was still capable of more extensive modifications, they became rarer as the decade wore on.

 

Walt: That 1937 Chrysler Derham town car appears to be based on a lwb 1938 DeSoto.  Talk about democratizing the formal town car!  One can only imaging the owner's consternation when being chauffeured in Fifth Avenue traffic and noticing 1938 DeSoto Skyview taxis that were the same make and model as his  luxury car, how declasse'!

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4 hours ago, Walt G said:

Bill, Yes indeed. This Cadillac has the Derham script badge emblem that was starting to be used by them in about 1941. If you look on the photo of the 1937 town car I posted just in front of the lower front door bottom hinge you will see a small triangle shield shape. That was the Derham badge in use just about from the teens up until 1941. Leather roofs - yes I recall the installation on the 1931 Franklin victoria very well, the upholsterer had a devil of a time trying to get hides large enough to do the job without a lot of seams being placed where they weren't originally.

If you get a leather roof soaking wet with rain for an extended period of time ( like a 4 plus hour session driving from long island to the center of NY State for a Franklin Club meet) the leather roof swells, stretches and gets a lot of sags. First time I saw that I almost passed out! But the sags go away once it drys out. Like some of the people who read this and contribute we have had decades of just about every kind of experience with the pre war cars and some are very unique just to custom built ones. I never owned or restored a car that I then didn't drive for tens of thousands of miles after it was done- every mile I drove it made me think 'this is what all the $, time and effort spent was all about' - going down the road in a car with running boards and headlamps mounted on a bar between the front fenders.

Walt

Do you have any further information on this 'post-delivery' or 'after-sale' rebody by Derham on this 1940 Studebaker Champion:  https://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/forum/your-studebaker-forum/general-studebaker-specific-discussion/1887799-1941-red-studebaker-convertible    ?

 

Craig

 

 

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13 minutes ago, 8E45E said:

Do you have any further information on this 'post-delivery' or 'after-sale' rebody by Derham on this 1940 Studebaker Champion:  https://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/forum/your-studebaker-forum/general-studebaker-specific-discussion/1887799-1941-red-studebaker-convertible    ?

 

Craig

 

 

 

 

I thought much Derham documentation survived?   I would be highly skeptical of that Studebaker minus some strong provenance.

 

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15 hours ago, edinmass said:


Try these........

2E3723E0-EB6F-4358-B0B2-0A8E055E04B6.png

8F1703CE-991A-484B-BEE7-18C34B25D19E.png

The great golfer from the 20's & 30's. Gene Sarazen.

PMCC at the proving grounds testing who is faster.  The Twin Six- V12 Packard, or a golf ball hit by Mr. Sarazen. Its the Macauley Speedster.

Thanks Ed, I have never seen such a great pic of the dash before.

 

Edited by 34LaSalleClubSedan (see edit history)
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4 hours ago, 8E45E said:

Do you have any further information on this 'post-delivery' or 'after-sale' rebody by Derham on this 1940 Studebaker Champion:  https://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/forum/your-studebaker-forum/general-studebaker-specific-discussion/1887799-1941-red-studebaker-convertible    ?

 

Craig

 

 

That 1940 Studebaker Champion Phaeton by Derham was an individual commission by Frank Tracy Griswold II, millionaire, race car builder and driver:

1940 Studebaker Champion (conceptcarz.com)

Its been written up in the SDC Turning Wheels and Antique Studebaker Review publications.

I'40 Studebaker Champion phaeton by Derham a.jpg

Edited by 58L-Y8
Publication write-ups noted (see edit history)
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13 hours ago, alsancle said:

 

 

I thought much Derham documentation survived?   I would be highly skeptical of that Studebaker minus some strong provenance.

 

I also believe their records survive.  That is why I am hoping someone here has access to Derham documentation, and would be able to post copies of the work order for the car above, and the two 1940 President convertibles made for the New York World's Fair, in addition to what we already know about these cars.

 

Craig

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6 minutes ago, 58L-Y8 said:

Craig:

Here's the link to the CCCA Museum Archive viewer of the Derham files they have:

CCCA Museum Archive Viewer

 

Thanks!  I knew they survived, but was unaware they are able to be viewed online.

 

Now you know with I'll be doing for the next couple of evenings after work!!

 

Craig

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You are welcome!  Although their Derham files are incomplete as documentation was somewhat dispersed through carelessness, its still unusually good with much interesting material. 

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