FS- Love to Love or Hate to Love - 1957 Buick !!

[buick man]

Sunday Pick of the Week : Just came across this 1957 Buick Special  over at BAT site ... So what are your thoughts :  This could just might redefine what a Tail Gate Party could really be !

 

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1957-buick-special-3/

 

 

[lancemb]

Beautiful car, but I'd take that monstrosity off the back before I left the house with it.  That's an easy fix though!

[BUICK RACER]

My mom and dad hated the continental kit, I learned from them, nice car but..............

[Matt Harwood]

Non-original fender skirts and continental kits are removed immediately as soon as cars come into my shop. You want them, they're in the trunk. May God have mercy on your soul.

[SpecialEducation]

8 minutes ago, Matt Harwood said:

Non-original fender skirts and continental kits are removed immediately as soon as cars come into my shop. You want them, they're in the trunk. May God have mercy on your soul.

 

 

Yeah, I'm not a fan of the continental kit, but those fender skirts are hideous! The sweepspear accentuates the lines of the wheel opening, and the skirts ruin the whole flow.  They look great on other body styles, but they just don't work here.

[lancemb]

That current high bidder, Gary Pike, I've talked to him about something in the past year or so but can't remember what but I'm sure he's a 57 guy if I was talking to him.

[buick man]

... ah come on folks ... there is a lot of love area in that there back hanger .... Just think about it, pull up to a club event or a C&C, set up a table cloth off the back and lay out some cold cuts and buns, beer or it's your party what would you bring to the party other than a wrench !  Other than that IMO there is a lot to love with the rest of the car as well.

[suchan]

Like the colors, clean car, but that continental kit...if you have a steep driveway, prepare to leave some bumper on the street every time you pull in.

Besides being butt-ugly, IMHO.

[6T-FinSeeker]

OK, so everyone seems to agree that the fender skirts and continental kit have to go, but what about the rest of the car???

[lancemb]

I think we  an agree the rest of the car is great.  What's the bet on value?  As nice as it looks, being a 4 door Special I don't think it would bring more than $13-14k, and much less on BAT probably.

[John_S_in_Penna]

5 hours ago, SpecialEducation said:

Yeah, I'm not a fan of the continental kit, but those fender skirts are hideous! The sweepspear accentuates the lines of the wheel opening, and the skirts ruin the whole flow.  They look great on other body styles, but they just don't work here.

 

I agree.  The original stylists of the 1957 Buick

Special and Century did an excellent job, and those

add-ons make a beautiful car appear clumsy.

 

Four-door hardtops are much scarcer in most car lines

than people realize.  They were produced in ample

numbers, but today people restore the more glamorous

body styles, so 4-door hardtops languish.  Remember

when station wagons were seen as routine and unimpressive?

 

[RivNut]

Why oh why does everyone speak of the Dynaflow as a two speed.  Are they thinking that Buick used a Powerglide in all their cars?

[MRJBUICK]

Being a 57 Special 4dr sdn owner a few observations

in a 57 i don't get the fender skirts as has been mentioned above the lines and exposed wheels look great on a 57

continental kit is personal taste had a friend put one on a 57 Roadmaster 75 years ago you could have a cup of coffee by the time it drove by

the owner was in love with the 50's theme dual antennas so now there are three on the car hmmmm 

dual hooded accessory mirrors very cool i have one of those on my car and love it mine is mounted higher on the fender but hey it was an accessory

i guess he never did the cloth on the doors that could finish it off

it has the early temp gauge in the dash

those colors just work so well on 57s really good looking car

just curious how the car is started being an alternator and looks like a non pedal start carb.

and everyone who doesnt know calls the dynaflow a 2 speed because of "D" and "L"

my opinion

[RivNut]

I guess a typical unknowing car salesman would call it a 2 speed; a true Buick affecianodo would call it a Dynaflow. 😎

[SpecialEducation]

On 2/24/2020 at 12:01 AM, RivNut said:

Why oh why does everyone speak of the Dynaflow as a two speed.  Are they thinking that Buick used a Powerglide in all their cars?

 

Why, pray tell, is it not a 2 speed?  It has two speeds...

[RivNut]

5 hours ago, SpecialEducation said:

 

Why, pray tell, is it not a 2 speed?  It has two speeds...

Forward and reverse?  😳

[SpecialEducation]

9 hours ago, RivNut said:

Forward and reverse?  😳

2 forward, 1 reverse. 

[1956322]

Low is a separate gear.. it always starts out in high in drive but there is another gear to choose so it is technically a two speed.

[50ChevyFrank]

The skirts aren’t so bad, I think.   I could live with them.   But that tail end.  Yuk!

I do love me some 4-door hardtops.  Chevy called it a Sport Sedan.  Nice car.  

[SpecialEducation]

I can post the entire service manual and nobody will read it, so I'll just post this snip.

 

Direct drive and low gear.  Sounds like two speeds to me.

[lancemb]

Technically it is a 2 speed.  I think the confusion comes from the fact that most people in normal driving will only use the high gear, and the car doesn't shift itself between the 2; both are not required for full range of speed.  Hence, calling it a 2-speed Dynaflow is accurate but calling it a 2-speed automatic is not.

[6T-FinSeeker]

Car was a no sale - Reserve Not Met at $10,500

[Smartin]

and good luck getting any more out of it.  It might be able to squeak 12, but as others have said, all that "flare" has to go.  And the Auto Zone air cleaner.

[EmTee]

23 hours ago, lancemb said:

I think the confusion comes from the fact that most people in normal driving will only use the high gear, and the car doesn't shift itself between the 2; both are not required for full range of speed.

 

Similar to the '71 Super Beetle "AutoStick" my wife drove 40 years ago.  Basically a 3-speed manual with a torque converter/electric-vacuum clutch replacing the normal mechanical clutch.  Touching the gearshift activated the clutch.  Like the Dynaflow, it could be driven forward just leaving it in 3rd gear -- but 0 to 30 acceleration was measured in minutes...  It could, however, be shifted like a manual without a clutch pedal.

[RV6AAVIATOR]

Gents, 

 

Greetings. New to the Buick forum here. I was the high bidder on the Love to Hate 57 Buick.....

 

I am in Cincinnati and was wondering if there is anybody up in the NW part of the country that knows the vehicle or would be able to inspect the vehicle for me? 

 

Cheers  

[buick man]

.... I mean no bad and not defending anything here really , but gee Smartin I just don't think if you had listed your RM on BaT you would of pulled anything near the upper 20's listing price you were asking and most likely why it was listed on both this site and eBay.   So a comparably presented car evan as a  Special with easily detachable nuances in comparable condition and overall presentation should be lucky to peak at under 10k, really what are we missing and here is why ? 

 

BaT is an interesting site.  IMO and generally speaking it is a community that can be easily divided ... On the one hand you have your veneered cork smelling wine caver's set generally within a specific age grouping range that identifies and appreciates predominately european gated community shiny offerings, Fuchs, Ruf wheels, european factory tool kits etc. and/or offerings of either over the top resto-mod american 4 wheelers or " Survival Bot,  " Transformer Type" all terrain restored and heavily upgraded vehicles. The other group appears is predominately set well within the informed retired rare to purchase range and which btw seems to contribute the bulk of the commentary during each sale.  A site for the Love of true preserved American classic non modded metal ? - Ah not so much.  In short, for these reasons and no doubt others, BaT is a poor site to sell true american preserved classics at their true potential value for American pre to mid 60's rolling iron and that segment of the public that these classic cars endear themselves to is shrinking by gentrification but their value is still out there when presented correctly to the right audience.      

 

Dynaflow as a 2-Speed or 2-Range transmission ? ... That is the question. To shift or not to shift quoted the Raven.  My take is the Dynaflow as a fluid coupling torque multiplying type transmission as Lance and others correctly pointed out not an actual conventional thinking 2 speed transmission but a rather and more correctly a 2 range transmission with each range offering an almost logarithmic multiplication of torque based on a fluid's ability to move an object and not based upon a direct gear's ability to do so achieved by hard gearing and layshaft interplay resulting solid feel of gear changes. 

Edited March 3, 2020 by buick man (see edit history)

[Smartin]

I would have thought you could pick out all of the authenticity issues without needing to ask me why I thought the price would top out at $12k.  

I got good money for my car because it’s an excellent example.

[SpecialEducation]

14 hours ago, buick man said:

....not an actual conventional thinking 2 speed transmission but a rather and more correctly a 2 range transmission with each range offering an almost logarithmic multiplication of torque based on a fluid's ability to move an object and not based upon a direct gear's ability to do so achieved by hard gearing and layshaft interplay resulting solid feel of gear changes. 

 

What are you talking about?

 

My bicycle is a 5-speed. It doesn’t shift automatically, and technically it has sprockets, not gears, but when I tell people it’s a 5-speed, they somehow seem to understand without getting pretentious. 
 

Look:  GEARS!!! 🙄

[buick man]

...  ahh that's funny too 🤒

[buick man]

Edit to my prior post : Smartin yes you had a very nice complete original model 57 and got a proper and realistic price for value at the sale but that was not my contention here so perhaps I should give an abbreviated power point explanation to clarify once again ....  In short IMO you never would of gotten even half that amount had you gone through BaT ... and this seller who knows it now should never of done so either.  Classic cars selling on BaT are almost always " mercy sales " ( aka load and dump sales ) via estate executors i.e with no reserve or through non savvy family members with reserve.  Hope that cleans everyone's shorts.

[buick man]

Special Ed : Not to sound too pretentious here and I mean no bad, but I recommend that you go drive a real period correct dynaflow and report back to us on your take about the absolute obvious lack of ANY sensation, sound, vibration of sprockets or gears changing during acceleration or deceleration ... That is Dynaflow ....

[SpecialEducation]

Well, I’m pretty sure that claiming some special form of knowledge or fabrication of your own definitions of terms to argue against data that came from Buick’s own literature is a classic example pretentiousness. 
 

I’ve been driving a ‘56 Buick for over 25 years. If YOU can’t feel the difference between low GEAR and drive, maybe YOURS is broken. 🤷🏼‍♂️

[lancemb]

Repost from earlier:

Technically it is a 2 speed.  I think the confusion comes from the fact that most people in normal driving will only use the high gear, and the car doesn't shift itself between the 2; both are not required for full range of speed.  Hence, calling it a 2-speed Dynaflow is accurate but calling it a 2-speed automatic is not.

 

[buick man]

.... er now I'm getting confused, you mean 2 range Dynaflow right with 2 sprockets ? .... 😇

[RivNut]

On 3/4/2020 at 8:33 PM, buick man said:

Special Ed : Not to sound too pretentious here and I mean no bad, but I recommend that you go drive a real period correct dynaflow and report back to us on your take about the absolute obvious lack of ANY sensation, sound, vibration of sprockets or gears changing during acceleration or deceleration ... That is Dynaflow ....

If you're addressing me, you're smokln' your week old never washed socks.  The first car that I drove when I was 14 was my dad's 1950 Buick - Dynaflow equipped.  When I was old enough to have a car of my own, it was a 1955 Buick - Dynaflow equipped, which I traded for a 1957 Buick - Dynaflow equipped.  Then there was the 1963 Buick Wildcat - Dynaflow equipped.  After I got married and my family was established (1982,) I bought a 1963 Buick Riviera - Dynaflow equipped - and drove it as my daily driver fo 18 years. It now has 197K on the clock. It had 72K on it when I bought it.

 

Dad was a professional mechanic at the Stuart Conklin dealership in Hutchinson, KS.  Our family dinners usually had at least one mention of what dad worked on that day. Lots of talks about the Dynaflow's torque multiplication capabilities. Dad even had to go out of town and "back to school" for a number of days to go to Dynaflow training in the late 40's.  He shared a lot with us about transmissions.

 

I've driven my share of Dynaflows. To me it's a torque multiplying variable pitch transmission, that has, according to the chassis manuals, a separate low gear to be used for getting out of a tough spot or to assist in braking (if you like your teeth in the steering wheel.) Dad told me "NEVER" shift from L to D at full throttle - it's  not designed for that.  In my opinion, a person trying to sell a Dynaflow equipped Buick is not familiar with them and is only getting information by looking at the shift quadrant.  Same guy that will tell you that my 1964 Buick Riviera has a two speed transmission.

 

I remember that when I was in the 6th grade (1958) that we took a field trip from Hutchinson to Lindsborg to visit the Birger Sanzden art museum.  When we got there, Danny Holloway's mother was complaining that her new to her 1955 Buick Roadmaster was "stuck in low gear, it won't shift." (And she was cruising with everyone else at 70 mph.) As a 12 year old kid, I was able to tell her that a Dynaflow equipped Buick has no discernable shifts.

  

Not knowing me our my background, you did come off pretentious and meaning bad.  "Special Ed?" Someting close to you? That is totally politically incorrect. At least you've grown past using the "r" word.

 

I'll wager that I've driven more miles in a Dynaflow equipped car in my 73 years than you have.  Any wagers?

 

Ed - Special only to my family.

[lancemb]

33 minutes ago, RivNut said:

 

Not knowing me our my background, you did come off pretentious and meaning bad.  "Special Ed?" Someting close to you? That is totally politically incorrect. At least you've grown past using the "r" word.

 

I'll wager that I've driven more miles in a Dynaflow equipped car in my 73 years than you have.  Any wagers?

 

Ed - Special only to my family.

 

RivNut, I am pretty sure Buick Man was aiming his reply toward forum member "Special Education".

[RivNut]

19 minutes ago, lancemb said:

 

RivNut, I am pretty sure Buick Man was aiming his reply toward forum member "Special Education".

If that is the case, I didn't catch the other post.  When I open a thread, I'm automatically directed to the last thread read. Buick Man's was the first to show up and I assumed that it was directed at me because I'm the guy who first questioned the use of "two speed" to describe a Dynaflow.