30DodgePanel

Musk's Cyber Truck speed bump

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To me it isn't a car/truck, it is an amalgamation of at least 8 different styling cues including Kendig-It door handles. Not sure why it needs that big squarish pseudo not-grille & have a feeling there is going to be a lot of rear lift "at speed" (might have a governor like the Abrams tank). Of course to have world-wide appeal it needs a LWMMG mount.

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The triangular shape has a connection to video game coding.

 

 

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What triangular shape. It is not "the shape of things to come" (qualifies for AACA, one just showed up a Cars and Coffee here).

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2 hours ago, padgett said:

 (qualifies for AACA, one just showed up a Cars and Coffee here).

 

????????

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30 Dodge Panel wrote 

The one question that the pioneers answered that Musk in his ideology hasn't is:
Is there a need...?

 

All climate and political discussions aside, the obvious answer is no

 

Seriously 30DP! Climate Change Concern is the primary, some might argue the only factor in the decisions by governments and entrepreneurs in creating these prototypes. It's like saying Preservation of Food aside, who in their right mind would want to buy a Fridge! Within 10 years, like it or not, EV Trucks are going to command the market, you heard it here first folks, and you can quote me! BTW, I can't remember the last time I saw a $60,000 Crew cab pickup go by with more than one person in it, and with anything in the bed except a tonneau cover!! My personal observation is that 90% of pickups trucks are grocery haulers 90% of the time, except perhaps in ranch country. 

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24 minutes ago, Gunsmoke said:

30 Dodge Panel wrote 

The one question that the pioneers answered that Musk in his ideology hasn't is:
Is there a need...?

 

All climate and political discussions aside, the obvious answer is no

 

Seriously 30DP! Climate Change Concern is the primary, some might argue the only factor in the decisions by governments and entrepreneurs in creating these prototypes. It's like saying Preservation of Food aside, who in their right mind would want to buy a Fridge! Within 10 years, like it or not, EV Trucks are going to command the market, you heard it here first folks, and you can quote me! BTW, I can't remember the last time I saw a $60,000 Crew cab pickup go by with more than one person in it, and with anything in the bed except a tonneau cover!! My personal observation is that 90% of pickups trucks are grocery haulers 90% of the time, except perhaps in ranch country. 

 

Obviously my point was not to get into the climate or political side of the discussion for fear of diluting the conversation. At least, I thought I made that obvious... I guess not. 

 

We understand your points and well taken but I'm sorry to tell you, not all agree with your view points. 

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I've been venturing into Manhattan a few times this year and I have not seen a single gas station in there. The only one I've seen is right at the start of the NYS Thruway and that's up a little bit. I have idly wondered where the taxis fuel up.

 

Every time I've been to the city I've seen old cars. Have not explored much of it yet but I didn't expect that, it does not seem like an old car friendly place. I was wrong apparently. My very first trip to the Bronx for the Fordham museum yielded a1959 Cadillac driving into there as we were leaving and a 70s Thunderbird in the parking garage we used. Saw an MG and several Corvettes in Manhattan, and a 50s car, can't remember if a Pontiac or Plymouth, parked in Coney Island. Appears to be being used as a daily driver.

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I've been to Manhattan once. Stayed here:

 

Pickwick Arms Hotel

Midtown Manhattan, New York City

 

Hotel Description
Hotel Features
Hotel Map
Internet Deals


1.5 Points

230 East 51 St. Street, New York, NY 10022 USA


 

Pickwick Arms Hotel, Midtown Manhattan, New York City  Reservation  
   

The Pickwick Arms Hotel is located in the center of the action in New York, on 51st St. between second and third avenues.

Pickwick Arms is within walking distance to Rockefeller Center, St. Patrick's, Saks, Madison Avenue shops, Empire State building and fine dining restaurants.

Accommodations reflect Euro style rooms with shared baths.

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17 hours ago, Gunsmoke said:

I can't remember the last time I saw a $60,000 Crew cab pickup go by with more than one person in it, and with anything in the bed except a tonneau cover!!

 

That's like saying, I see cops carrying firearms, but they never use them. These cops don't need to carry a gun!! Some of us use our trucks quite often. For my purposes, a car would be absolutely useless.

 

EV trucks commanding the market in 10 years?? That's highly doubtful. Musk pulled that tug-of-war stunt with the Ford pickup, Ford should run an ad showing Musk's "wind it up and go" truck pulling a 8,000 pound boat and dead on the side of the road less than a hundred miles. Now I'll make a prediction, the EV truck is going to flop for 95% of the country. They might be used in local city deliveries or some other specific superficial service, but the core of the pickup market will remain I/C powered. And feel free to quote me on that.

-Ron

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ALBs and Blimpmobiles are popular here particularly for small people. I have always preferred small overpowered cars because they are easier to park and the AC cools faster.

 

When an EV has a 500 mile range at 70+ with AC going it may catch on.

 

I'd call thast a "pent roof", the paint just makes it look sorta triangular.

 

This is a triangle:

 

 

 

tr7.jpg

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It doesn't appear in that "tug of war" that things were done quite right.  IT looks like the ford was being pulled backwards before the wheels started to spin.  Also appears to be a 2 wheel drive truck.  As mentioned on posts , on those videos that the ford didn't have a chance as the Tesla broke it's traction loose before it even tried to pull.  No different than having the opposing team already leaning forward in a tug of war battle in humans. Now if you put it up against a 4 wheel drive diesel that would be more comparable but again,  not even the same as the torque curves are different where the diesel doesn't even start to come in until above 1500 rpm Approximately especially accounting for the turbo which really has no boost until it starts to come in at 1500 RPM.  Atleast on my truck.  The new ones are a bit different.  

Guys mentioned it would be a better comp to place them both on pulling sleds and see where they come in.  

Also it would be a better comp once you have 100KMI on it of use to see how it holds up overall.  

As one guy mentioned to you are heading out in the while or off to the lake with most of the toys you would be pulling behind it, so it might be tough to find a charging post out in the wilderness. 

Lots of miles to be traveled before it will convince many it's a real player.  Give it 10 years in the North Country cold salty winters plowing and then we'll see how it compares. 

 

If there were the subsidies in place the EV's have for Cord in 1936,  hell we might all have a Cord in the driveway.  It was revolutionary for the time just didn't have someone holding the companies hand to fix all the issues. 

Probably the same for many car manufactures that failed,  that had to rely on the market to prove wether their product would make it prime time,  not outside factors helping to cushion pricing and popularity. 

 

I will say a $100 fully refundable deposit for a 100G probably plus truck is a joke.  I can bet alot of those orders won't pan out.  Put a 2500 deposit on it and that might change those pre order numbers drastically.   You need real flesh in the game to be taken seriously. 

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It's not "cheating", different tests evaluate different things.  Tesla marketing choose the one that showed their advantage, a square torque curve.

The other tests would show other things.

You don't see any truck company doing a slalom against a sports car as a demo, after all.

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13 minutes ago, auburnseeker said:

 $100 fully refundable deposit for a 100G probably plus truck is a joke.  I can bet alot of those orders won't pan out.  Put a 2500 deposit on it and that might change those pre order numbers drastically.   You need real flesh in the game to be taken seriously. 

 

 

Bingo ! This stunt is a perfect snapshot of his circus act, one can almost hear the carny as he speaks  "STEP RIGHT UP" ….

 

Let's wait and see how those orders pan out around the time the truck hits the market in late 2021 and 2022. By then, and with two years behind us, it will give us all a sense of the progress and demand but even then, I doubt it proves much as most of it will be conflated as we all know having been to the circus a time or two...

 

I'm all for advancement, improvement and ingenuity for the good of humanity and environment but it's hard to take some of these types of PR things seriously - the tug of war was laughable and I'm not even a Ford guy...  

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I can see the case for dropping the EV subsidy - but then the IC truck subsidy should go too.  Same standards for all light vehicles, let the technology and the market sort it out.

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What Subsidies are there on IC trucks?  I didn't see any being sold with a 7500 or 10,000 Gov't funded rebate,  but then i might be out of the truck buying loop as my last new and probably only new truck was 15 years ago. 

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In the interest of facts and clarity, the announced prices were $39,900 to $69,900 not $100k as stated in a recent post.  Seems in line with current truck pricing. Not everyone needs any kind of truck regardless of how it’s powered. You buy what fits your needs.  I have a grossly overpriced wheelchair accessible Dodge Caravan.  It’s what I need so I have to pay the price.

 

Now back to our regularly scheduled program where discussion of people actually buying electric vehicles indicates the world is going to end any day now.  

 

 

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AS, light trucks have a more lax CAFE target than passenger cars.  So you as the buyer are not subsidized, but the manufacturer is.  The car companies that make most of their money on trucks lobbied hard for this.  The engineering and materials efforts and costs to bring a light truck to a passenger car CAFE are very significant.

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4 hours ago, padgett said:

ALBs and Blimpmobiles are popular here particularly for small people. I have always preferred small overpowered cars because they are easier to park and the AC cools faster.

 

Mr P translation please???? Seriously I have no idea what a ALB or a Blimpmobile is. The key word to your statement is the word "here" These vehicles have a nitch market in certain areas of the country mainly urban and especially on the commercial level. I do know from when I worked how much time was lost (non-billable hours) getting fuel and service the vehicles for our fleet. I know for a fact I would have recommended to the contractor I had worked for that he purchase some for the light duty service fleet to see how they worked out and create a cost data analysis to see if there were any advantages. I also know he would have listened to me and done so.  

 

How many of the white Amazon Vans do we see every day making local delivery's every day? 

 

 

 

4 hours ago, Locomobile said:

EV trucks commanding the market in 10 years?? That's highly doubtful.

 

Ron, I only hope that many of us are here in 10 years to say "I told you so!" 

 

I think it would be safe to say that the similar statement was made over 120 years years when automobiles were just starting out replacing animals pulling carts. It would be safe to say there were many people back then arguing that nothing would replace the horse and ox carts.  The driving force to that was for commercial use. The bigger cities had major problems with horse drawn vehicles making delivery's. They city of New York had to remove 3-4 million pounds of manure a day and 15,000 dead animals left dead per year on the streets. Spreading insect born diseases in growing densely populated areas. As the population grew so did the need for goods and services, and the number of animals required to perform the task   (that statistic is from page 17 the book Fins Harley Earl the rise of General Motors and the glory days of Detroit authored by William Knoedelseder, 2018 Harper Collins).

 

3 hours ago, auburnseeker said:

If there were the subsidies in place the EV's have for Cord in 1936,  hell we might all have a Cord in the driveway.  It was revolutionary for the time just didn't have someone holding the companies hand to fix all the issues. 

Probably the same for many car manufactures that failed,  that had to rely on the market to prove wether their product would make it prime time,  not outside factors helping to cushion pricing and popularity. 

 

I will say a $100 fully refundable deposit for a 100G probably plus truck is a joke.  I can bet alot of those orders won't pan out.  Put a 2500 deposit on it and that might change those pre order numbers drastically.   You need real flesh in the game to be taken seriously. 

    

We all forget that the one of the greatest technological accomplishments done with government subsides with private research was the lunar landing, without those subsides it most likely would never had happened. Just look at the technology in battery life in the last five years. A subsidy to promote technology and bailing out a failing company are two very different things.

 

It is nice to think we can predict the future, I just want predict the lottery numbers. There are a lot of things in this world we all can say "it won't in 10 years" and we were wrong. When I first saw my son's text messaging I thought that was a dumb idea and would not be around, now when I am stopped at a traffic light and look around at the other vehicles everyone's texting somebody about something that is more important then driving their car.

 

I bought a new Yukon in 2002 (give or take) and I got a $2500 discount because it was able to use E/85.  Never seen a station that sold E/85 the entire time I owned the vehicle. That was a government subsidy as well

 

   

Edited by John348 (see edit history)
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I think it's an excellent point about subsidizing a technology vs. subsidizing a company.

On the academic side, that's supposed to be part of Federal Research Grants.

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1 hour ago, TerryB said:

Now back to common sense thought that questions if hideous unwanted items on the taxpayers $ can truly keep the world from ending

 

Hi Terry,

 fixed that for ya 😉 

 

 

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1 hour ago, bryankazmer said:

AS, light trucks have a more lax CAFE target than passenger cars.  So you as the buyer are not subsidized, but the manufacturer is.  The car companies that make most of their money on trucks lobbied hard for this.  The engineering and materials efforts and costs to bring a light truck to a passenger car CAFE are very significant.

That is not a subsidy, it's physics.
Or; why doesn't a Mercedes S600 get 31/40 MPG like a corolla does; they're both cars.

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