Jump to content

1903 Cleveland Roadster project


Recommended Posts

Hello Harm,

One follow-up to the talk of "Apple Betty"...

When you bring the Betty out of the oven, give it just a bit to cool some then be ready to serve with a scoop or two of good quality Vanilla Ice-Cream!  This is very nearly as good as apple pie but a bunch easier to fix and enjoy.  I even like it cold with cold ice-cream also!

Regards,

Alan

PS: today we are cooking down cling pit green-gage plums and are getting ready to make several batches of Plum bars to eat fresh and frozen as well.

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Yesterday morning (Monday) I painted the radiator a dull black, heat resistant paint. As it was again a very hot day, the paint dried very quickly, so in the afternoon I assembled the radiator (distance pieces between the tubes and mounting pieces) and mounted it at the chassis. I am pleased with the result, another small job done.

 

1188710075_Paintedradiator2.thumb.jpg.b25de90545625106915127bc70f369ee.jpg

Painted radiator ready for assembly

 

1328075804_Radiator1.jpg.cc41f94bf463c2be39ece3d501e89c43.jpg

Radiator "hanging" on the chassis

 

As most of the yard chores are nearly done, I wanted the repair of the engine block done. This morning I gathered enough courage to start with the stitching of the engine block. I started with stabilizing the block. Used just some wooden blocks and a heavy clamp to fix it at the work bench.. I started with the crack between both pipe thread holes, this according to the advice from Jeff at Lock and Stitch. He provided me with a lot of advice and drawings. Furthermore a lot of useful how-to  instructions can be found on YouTube.

 

1118276877_LockandStitchkit1.jpg.8bb625446357ed3acb2fc2f6e0685153.jpg

Stitch kits for the large holes (Number 4 and 5 on the drawing below)

 

560430259_LockandStitchkit2.thumb.jpg.270f2cb25ca0a520c19beec3f4a86cbe.jpg

Stitching kits with small and larger pins, drills, taps and countersinks.

 

392767446_Engine4.jpg.e58ed19115607cd317cb70c4fa136522.jpg

Engine block fixed at the work bench.

 

Engine 3.jpg

Crack between the pipe thread holes pinned.

 

997948358_Engine2.thumb.jpg.cdba836e4fbaab2c65f46763b8ac63bc.jpg

A very difficult pin at the end of the crack at the pipe thread hole.

 

Tomorrow,  I hope to tackle the small crack left between the pipe thread hole and the deck and finish the pins I placed today.  As the small crack was welded the metal is very hard, at this moment I did not break a drill nor a tap 😁. I must say, that I took my time to place the 11 pins visible on the pictures -easy does it-.

 

Regards,

Harm

 

 

 

Edited by Sloth (see edit history)
  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello Harm,

Great update photos of the radiator and the "stitching" process.   This is a great overview.  When you get a chance (and can relax knowing that a hard job is complete).  Please ad more detail to the actual process of pinning, methodology, sealants used depth drilling, tapping fitting of the pins, lastly finishing the exposed surface to prep for paint.  I am very impressed with your craftsmanship and ability to jump in to a project!  The radiator is included!

Regards,

Alan

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Peening over the pins, and grinding them can be a challenge. Cleaning up the threads in the big holes won’t be easy. I would use small hand field or a Dremel tool. Use NEW good quality taps.....not China junk, and take your time. I would take the extra time to pressure test the repair and hold it for 48 hours. Since the system is not pressurized I would test it at 25 lbs. looks good so far! 👍

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

If I were going to try to fix those threaded holes I would bore them out and make a brass or bronze sleeve, with a fine external thread secured with Locktite and the internal thread as it is or, if whatever attaches there can be modified, a slightly smaller inside diameter to add thickness to the sleeve. I wouldn't do that until after the stitching is done but it would give you a threaded diameter that is completely free of whatever flaws the stitching leaves. The truth is, there aren't many people who could make the parts but you've demonstrated that you are one of them! I've made sleeves with a wall thickness as little as 1/16".

 

To bore the holes accurately I'd use an end mill ground to the desired diameter...that may be had to find or someone to grind it so if you needed one I'd be glad to organize it for you and mail it. It will also be necessary to buy a special tap...those are readily available. Fine threads are not generally used in cast iron but I don't feel that applies when the piece is going to be locked in place forever.

 

Oh...and I'd make the sleeves first so you know they will work...a little long so the surface can be fly-cut after they are in place.

Edited by JV Puleo (see edit history)
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with Joe......and most of the work on that block is a one time chance and you done if it isn’t right. From past experience I would have blasted the entire outside and checked for more cracks.....both from freeze and welding. Usually you will find a lot more problems if you only check by eye.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello,

At the last two days a lot of stitching and related activities happened. I made a lot of pictures but Thursday afternoon my IPhone choked in an update. Anna went to a telephone shop, they repaired it, but I lost some pictures. Oh well, still a lot survived.

Thursday I continued with the stitching, some good progress.

 

456413410_Crackbetweenthewateroutletsstitchedandpeened.thumb.jpg.31e366b95e7f0e4943a583b1c0544e28.jpg

Crack between the water outlets stitched

 

2056726852_Partialypeened.jpg.ff358d38d6f23195717cadac5e722482.jpg

Pins, peened and partially leveled

 

1913354215_Wateroutlettodeckstitched.jpg.5f5f560da207e09866302f87c5b85394.jpg

Water outlet to deck stitching, two nearly invisible cracks

 

The most difficult parts of the stitching are the edges of the deck, they are real brittle, later more on that. Furthermore, I broke a tap on a diamond hard lump embedded in the casting. The drill just went free from it but the tap touched it enough to break.  Took me two hours with a Dremel and some dentist small mills to remove it. During the drilling I discovered more hard lumps and some (molding) sand, all embedded into the casting..... But luckily no more breaking of tools.

 

417106502_Drilledfirsthalfoftheholesinthedeck.jpg.deab59c88e2609d1e7bb653fcb3c1007.jpg

Drilled the first half of holes in the deck (first crack, 3 to go)

 

135166426_Putthepinsin.jpg.f8d98319d759159d2e67ea80ba45e535.jpg

After counter sinking and threading I put the pins in

 

1342727814_Leveledandpeenedthepins.jpg.11960114cfde7e2e61a6f326b4a7d7b4.jpg

Leveled and peened the pins

 

1351207318_Crackinthedeck.jpg.881aa5c342c3628ef2e7d9ddcd1db449.jpg

Just another crack in the deck, clearly caused by welding (I guess...)

 

Here should be the pictures of the repair process of other three cracks, they got lost due to the malfunctioning Iphone, grumble 😡.

 

1488131675_Allotofdeckstitching.thumb.jpg.4ba4b7f0bc0a9b052da06fde67384b15.jpg

Picture of the deck, the stitching can clearly be seen.

 

1965511517_Tappingthetreadsforthewaterholeinserts.jpg.a8450f591f7885c0ddfeb0320838e10a.jpg

After drilling and countersinking, tapping the thread for the large inserts

 

378197693_Shortningtheinserts.thumb.jpg.2f48806e0fb3b4ef7c5b6a59818fad49.jpg

Shortening the large inserts, just 1/4" too long

 

1809735827_Insertssecuredintheengineblock.thumb.jpg.1a08b70136dbf4a3c58d6fba46dd7be8.jpg

Large inserts secured in the block

 

1387181770_Threadedholeforstuddrilledandtreadedforinsert.thumb.jpg.b0970a1a7b03e92143de389228621939.jpg

Hole for stud insert drilled and threaded

 

As my Iphone again, started to behave erratically, I am gone on expedition to find my old and thrust worthy Sony Cybershot 😃 (still not found). This (Saturday) morning I started with leveling all the pins (mostly by using a file). After completion, I made a setup for leak testing (pictures tomorrow). Started with 20 PSI, just 3 very small leaks. The one at the large insert was easy to repair, just putting another pin in. The other two were nasty, to say the least. Both of them are situated on the the deck edge. So I started drilling a hole at 45 degrees on the deck edge, for pinning the first one,  went for an eight of an inch deep, and lo and behold sand and a very hard lump of ?? came out. Cleaned it thoroughly with the Dremel, and drilled it to the appropriate depth. Threaded the hole and put a pin in. Leaked solved. For last one I needed 2 pins, same problem, sand and hard lumps, but at last success.

One other "challenge" is drilling on the border of the welding and the cast iron. The welding is very hard and the casting no so. Detecting where the welding ends and the cast iron starts is nearly impossible, so I guess the crack line is the border. But I must say the drills that came with the kits are top quality, not one drill broke. I used a cordless drill with a torque limiter, it worked very well.

 

On the end of the afternoon, having 25 PSI on the block, NO leaks are found. Left it, with 25 PSI, will see tomorrow how much of the pressure is left. So I am reasonably  happy for now ☺️. If my luck holds, I have an usable engine. I must admit I felt rather a bit depressed about the situation with the engine.

 

Tomorrow (if I can find the camera), I write more in detail about the process and the tools and materials I used.

Regards,

Harm

 

 

 

  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites
50 minutes ago, J3333 said:

My father has this car fully restored as garage right now. Lots of memories.

Hello,

Thank you for your post. Is your father still alive?

Regards,

Harm

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello Harm,

All I can say is great work!  I am certainly watching with interest as one never knows when a repair like this is needed.  I am watching for your additional information.

Regards,

Alan

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Harm......you did a very good job stitching........and 25 pounds holding is perfect. Be sure to remove all the paint on thr block, and magna-flux the entire unit using both the flux and dye........it’s twenty times easier to find all the issues now, than after the first drive.....it saves time, money, and disappointment. Keep up the good work, Best, Ed.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

This morning I went up early, anxious to see what happened with the pressure on the stitched block. Well, I am very happy to mention that the block still held 20 PSI! So during the night only 5 PSI was lost. I think that due to my hastily cobbled together, leak test contraption, some pressure is lost trough the cork gasket and the water hole plugs. But never the less, I can remove this repair of my to do list. I realize very well, that the real "proof of the pudding" will be starting and running the engine (in the very near future I hope).

 

58499086_Airpressureregulator.jpg.1feff23c01c776dd5ce55ce529d8add2.jpg

"Make shift" leak tester

 

1634078449_Makeshiftleaktestcontraption.thumb.jpg.cd8e9e9321cb536fd72509d124ebf32f.jpg

Leak tester, all cooling water holes closed off by means of a 3/8" thick plate  a cork gasket

 

Ed, I followed your advice and removed all the paint on the block. After using the penetrating dye and developer, I could not find new cracks. I took my time for the inspection, used a magnifying glass, large LED lamp etc.  Made a lot of pictures,  got worried when inspecting the pictures I took. But strangely enough, what seems a crack on the picture is just a small scratch in reality.

 

310186689_Crackdetectionpenetrantapplied.jpg.4ffe61cb038bfddec56260dea4f386a3.jpg

Penetrating dye applied after meticulous cleaning the whole engine block 

 

1824415290_Cleaneddeckdecknocracksdetected.jpg.6385498ffeb4f44afd4acb0c351a2c84.jpg

After applying the developer and cleaning the block, no red lines (cracks) showed up. I got worried when

I saw the the long crack like scratch on the deck. And that is just what it is, a scratch. The deck has suffered

a lot in the past, many scratches prove it.

 

273814953_Otherstitcedareaofthedecknocracks.jpg.e29fdc5311f110b2126a6ea66f30f45b.jpg

Part of the stitched area of the deck, no cracks anymore

 

I left the two short studs alone, as they are stuck in the deck, I did not dare to remove them. They are looking good to me, will use them as is. As the deck is rather thin, I am afraid, that applying some force to remove them, will damage the deck.

 

2103081907_Stitcedareaofthedecknocracks.jpg.13ce8c74053cf21b2a355274c20d64d7.jpg

A detail picture of  a stitched part of the deck

 

273814953_Otherstitcedareaofthedecknocracks.jpg.e29fdc5311f110b2126a6ea66f30f45b.jpg

Detail of a stitched part with the edges which caused me some trouble to stitch

 

I am sorry but ran out of time and energy to prepare the "how to" .... Item has to wait till tomorrow.

 

Regards,

Harm

 

 

 

Detail of stitched deck.jpg

  • Like 7
Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello Harm,

I am very impressed with the result of your Pin repair!  Your efforts give me confidence that this type repair can be completed at home and not necessarily a professional shop.  It looks to me  that you have achieved professional results.  Any things you learned and things, if any, that you would not do...please share.

Regards,

Alan

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, alsfarms said:

Hello Harm,

I am very impressed with the result of your Pin repair!  Your efforts give me confidence that this type repair can be completed at home and not necessarily a professional shop.  It looks to me  that you have achieved professional results.  Any things you learned and things, if any, that you would not do...please share.

Regards,

Alan

 


 

Alan, he’s more talented than most home shop restoration guys.........I would judge his work on the block repair excellent.........and he took constructive suggestions and applied them..........I’m impressed with his results. To be honest, with such a accomplished expert stitcher so close to home, I would personally never attempt to stitch such a rare block......that’s just me........I give him credit not only for his skill, but his willingness to do the repair. I give him a 100 out of 100 on this repair. Bravo!👍👍

  • Like 7
Link to post
Share on other sites

I concur also with all the above. I have learned much from Harm’s journey as I did from Mike Macartney’s loooooong journey. Together with Keith B’s postings on his project I have found these three to be the most enjoyable I have followed. So much good information on this forum.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Dear gentlemen,

I feel honored by your very kind comments. I must admit that this repair caused me some sleepless nights.....

Thank you all.

Regards,

Harm

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Dear gentlemen,

As promised the "How I stitched the engine block of the Cleveland".

 

How I stitched a 1903 Cleveland engine block,

After a discussion on this forum, about possible repair methods for the cracked engine block of my 1903 Cleveland, I decided that stitching was the way to go. Some welding was done in the past. I think, causing more damage than the initial crack. Searching the WWW, I found Lock N Stitch. I had an email discussion with Jeff of Lock and Stitch (LNS). He explained to me what metal stitching is, and gave me some back ground info about the screw thread design they use. It is quite special, the form of the thread pulls the metal together. More explanation can be found on their website. Furthermore there are some really good and clear YouTube movies about the stitching process, I learned a lot from it.

Also, Jeff send me a drawing he made, with the repair sequence and a lot of instructions about the stitching itself. So my confidence grew  in tackling the job myself. After a while I ordered all parts needed. That is to say, I asked Jeff what stuff I would need. Well cost…..it is not cheap, but if you want to know, please send me a PM.

529035150_Cylinderrepairassy.jpg.2ca401e7057ab2cf4a8e8950f1cedbec.jpg

 

Drawing of the engine block, the number present the repair sequence

 

When I received all the materials, well packed and in good order, I just put them at the work bench and so now and then stared at them just to familiarize with it. But, it is as with swimming in slightly to cold water, if you want to swim, you must jump into it. So I started last Wednesday with cleaning the engine block. Then removing the paint 2 inches at either side of the cracks. Later on I removed all the paint, as was advised by an experienced forum member. Later more on that.

Then I accentuated, with a fine line color marker, all the cracks I had to stitch. Repairing the thread in the deck for the stud seemed easy. The repair of the water holes thread and the related cracks was not so easy.

 

Tools I used:

2 cordless drills with torque limiter

1 air driven grinder with assorted grinder pads ( 40, 80 and 120 grid)

Files: large and small, round and some flat,  fine and course

Assorted spanners and screw drivers

Assorted pliers

Lathe, for shortening the stud and waterhole thread inserts

Drill press

Milling machine

 

Tools.jpg.c1e3d23a42235ea80fd2b0f68ca6222d.jpg

Selection of tools used for stitching

 

Materials (I ordered everything at  LNS Inc) :

For the stitching of the cracks,

Pins L4CS and C2F, 50each

Drills for the pins

Spotfacer

Depth stops for the spotfacer

Taps for threading, beware these are not ordinary taps, but tap with a special thread.

Tapping and drilling fluid

Heat resistant thread sealer/locker fluid

 

424928183_Crackrepairtoolsandstitchingpins.thumb.jpg.9b4bfef86e7ba9336f553720a8055969.jpg

Pin stitching tools and pins

 

For repairing the water holes thread  and the stud thread in the deck:

I ordered the complete kits (Full-TorqueR) at LNS Inc, containing:

Threaded inserts 5 each

Installation tool

Drill bit

Spotfacer

Tap

Small retaining pins

Long drill and depth limiter for small retaining pins

 

669816598_Threadindeckrepairkit.thumb.jpg.d59d82e66b517517880d7551eabfa3c8.jpg

Thread in deck repair kit

 

7375617_Waterholethreadrepairkit.thumb.jpg.68b382b6600441a38da6f433427456ff.jpg

 Waterhole thread inserts

 

690752020_Spotfacerforwaterholethreadrepairinserts.thumb.jpg.63a89ece23f9f8122bb503236fdf6949.jpg

Spotfacer showing the pulling  form of the inserts

 

Starting the repair of the crack between the threaded water holes.

I carefully measured the distance between the two holes. Taking measurement of the inside of the holes. The edges of the raised edges must also be repaired. After some calculation I decided to use 11 pins spaced evenly. After tapping and spotfacing, I cleaned the holes meticulously. Then applied the thread sealer and inserted the pins. Filing the remaining pin heads till they are slightly higher than the casting.  Then I inserted the pins between the already inserted pins. Same procedure. What was left was the repair of the raised edges of the water holes. Took me quite while to figure that out. I put the block in the mill and milled a small flat so I had some “meat” to drill trough. That worked very well. During the process I did not break any drills, although I encountered some hard spots in the casting. One of those hard spots caused me to break a tap. Stitching the small cracks and the deck followed the same route.

 

Lathe.thumb.jpg.b6afca915c6f36019f8327192262296d.jpg

Shortening the waterhole insert in the lathe

 

Repairing the threaded holes.

First the water holes, I put the block on the drill press and secured it very well. Drilling the holes caused no problem. Using the spotfacer was a bit tricky, this because of the difference in material (grey iron and the steel of the pins). But I ended up with nice holes. Tapping caused no problem. The insert were 1/4” to long, the lathe made short work of it. By using the installation tool, inserting the inserts caused no problems, drilling the hole for the small retaining pin, caused no problem either. But performing the whole procedure, I took my time!

For repairing the threaded hole in the deck, I used the same procedure.

 

1886718258_Drillpress.thumb.jpg.57fb95a8e44f82d5aae14c0a0b618fb5.jpg

Drilling the threaded hole in the deck

 

After all the pins were grind-ed and filed, just slightly higher than the surrounding casting, I started peening the pin edges. I used the smallest ball peening hammer I had. This went fairly well, during leak testing just three leaks showed up. Two were easily fixed, but the third not so. That one was situated on the very edge of the deck. It  took a lot of time to got that one fixed, I fixed it by inserting a stitching pin at 45 degrees. During drilling I encountered a very hard lump of material and some sand. Removed it by using a Dremel tool and some very small mills as used by dentists, the mills are really hard and top quality material.

 

1825066759_Engine3.jpg.e9d232bcb2ba9dd0eeb82483046d2ab4.jpg

Pins before leveling and peening

 

During the tapping of the threads at the deck, I broke a tap. Drilling the hole caused no problem, but tapping did, so I guess the drill just did not touch the hard spot, but the tap did. For drilling, spotfacing and  tapping the pin  threads, I used the cordless drills with the torque limiter set very low… that worked well.  I did the tapping of the large holes by hand. On the end a forum member advised me to remove all the paint of the block, and crack test the whole block. That was a sound advice, so I did so. Luckily no other cracks showed up.

Well gentlemen this is my report how I stitched the engine block of my 1903 Cleveland. I am much relieved it went so well. If you have any questions, please let me know.

Regards,

Harm

 

 

 

 

Edited by Sloth (see edit history)
  • Like 6
  • Thanks 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

That's a really great job Harm. I don't know that I'll ever need to do it (an Ed's stitching guy is only abut 20 miles from me) but it's reassuring to know that it can be done if you are patient and careful.

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

Harm......worked on two younger siblings of your Cleveland today. My 1917 White with a body by Rubay(Both chassis and body of Cleveland) and a 1929 Stearns Knight. So while we are thousands of miles apart, we are both working on the legacy of the Cleveland  automotive history. Thought you would enjoy the coincidence. Best, Ed

57D11B46-1323-44E7-B1A8-D8B172E4A0F1.jpeg

27B862B0-B272-482B-9521-B19B191FF852.jpeg

Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello Ed,

That are really wonderful cars. The Stearns-Knight looks huge. Are you planning to restore it, or leave just at it is?

Regards,

Harm

Link to post
Share on other sites

Last two days, I cleaned the shop and re-arranged the tool chests and lockers. Got rid of much junk, you will recognize it... "I can use this small piece of steel/iron/whatever..." but to be honest it just  ads up, and it never fits or can be found back on time.  So, off to the municipal dump.

I assembled the engine and mounted it into the chassis, this took the best part of the day. The main reason for this was to motivate my self a bit, and see if I did not lost parts of it. Well, no parts lost, but oh boy that thing is heavy as iron 😁.

Just some random pictures.

 

DSC00757.jpg.3089554b87337ff2a4cdbdc2660797a4.jpg

 

DSC00759.jpg.3e8c97868a0108255a45ddda2bfcf5be.jpg

 

DSC00756.jpg.7175549bef73e60210e8b0bff6a61f84.jpg

 

DSC00758.jpg.e46cdb5bfbca992e1cfdffcedeafd395.jpg

 

DSC00760.jpg.53b87e38f031a29105c33d8814bec0c6.jpg

 

DSC00761.jpg.8f5218501cc9971db2d192e0e6c17b41.jpg

 

Looking at it, I felt something was wrong with the distance of the small sprocket to the chassis  and the distance of the large sprocket on the rear axle to the chassis. Well, right, a difference of 1", sigh. That means, shift the engine 1" to the passengers side. Drilling 6 holes and welding shut the wrong holes. Nice job to tackle tomorrow.

 

One of the more challenging jobs will be, to contrive the gear shift mechanism. I got some vague understanging of the mechanism, but have not much of a plan how to tackle this item. I looked at the Olds CDO and Cadillac model A, but they are quite different. Also the Ford 1903 model A gave me not much of an idea. Roger Weiss did send me some info, he made some parts for the shift mechanism of his car. But at that time, I just did not ask enough questions....

Regards,

Harm

 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks good........three steps forward and two steps back........everyone has the same challenges.......just keep pushing ahead. 👍

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

Harm.......I don’t think I would paint the engine green. Not sure what others think, but that early I find it hard to believe that it would be anything but black, or bare iron. Too much over restoration on cars today. All bright and shiny is NOT what you want. Try for what it looked like when it was new......no better. Modern materials are fine when undetectable. Also, as the engine, leaks, gets dirty, and gets hot.......green will not look that great over time. Any thoughts? Best, Ed.

  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, edinmass said:

Harm.......I don’t think I would paint the engine green. Not sure what others think, but that early I find it hard to believe that it would be anything but black, or bare iron. Too much over restoration on cars today. All bright and shiny is NOT what you want. Try for what it looked like when it was new......no better. Modern materials are fine when undetectable. Also, as the engine, leaks, gets dirty, and gets hot.......green will not look that great over time. Any thoughts? Best, Ed.

Hello Ed,

You are absolutely right, I will paint it not too shiny black. I hope to do that before it gets to cold, mostly I paint outside the shop.

Regards,

Harm

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/26/2020 at 2:40 PM, Sloth said:

"I can use this small piece of steel/iron/whatever..." but to be honest it just  ads up, and it never fits or can be found back on time.

Really?  I thought we were supposed to save everything 🤪 

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

You just never know about scrap iron!  Just this morning I was scouting around in my junk pile of steel remnants and was lucky enough to find just what I needed, I mean exactly what i needed.  Maybe I will hold off on the trip to the Scrap Iron store.....

Al 

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

Today, I managed to fit the small sprocket on the "gear box" brake drum. First I made a mandrel of aluminum to mount the sprocket on. Then removed the boss by turning it down. After that I turned a small recess into the sprocket to have it precisely positioned on the brake drum and the internal driving gear. One odd thing, the gear is fasted with 5 bolts at the brake drum and internal drive gear, 6 bolts would be logical in my opinion, 60 degrees offset between them. But 5 at 72 degrees seems unnecessary complicated. One job left for tomorrow, broaching the key way 1/4".

 

431194851_Removingtheboss.thumb.jpg.3176aad4bc1ad1990d3ba75d62c98904.jpg

Removing the boss, sprocket mounted on an mandrel

 

 

348874868_Sprocketputonmandrelforturningasmallrecessformountingitonthebossatthebrakedrum.jpg.587204c7d7377b3c6be7551ca82a8a4f.jpg

Turning a small recess

 

1941327756_Finishedsprocketonbrakedrum.jpg.4f9ecf38daf49c685ce9aba76db66488.jpg

Finished sprocket on the brake drum

 

184607452_Weirdholepaternonsprocketandbrakedrum.jpg.07d12f7f198ef41a7672dec66d7e2043.jpg

"Odd" hole pattern

 

Regards,

Harm

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/23/2020 at 4:13 PM, alsfarms said:

Hello Harm,

I am very impressed with the result of your Pin repair!  Your efforts give me confidence that this type repair can be completed at home and not necessarily a professional shop.  It looks to me  that you have achieved professional results.  Any things you learned and things, if any, that you would not do...please share.

Regards,

Alan

 


I feel the same way.  While not underestimating his skill (which is evident in nearly every post) the process certainly looks more doable than I would have imagined.  It certainly opens up the number of projects one might do as I would have rejected any project with cracks like Harm had.   I might *still* pass on them but at least I know I have options. :)

 

  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Luv2Wrench said:


I feel the same way.  While not underestimating his skill (which is evident in nearly every post) the process certainly looks more doable than I would have imagined.  It certainly opens up the number of projects one might do as I would have rejected any project with cracks like Harm had.   I might *still* pass on them but at least I know I have options. :)

 

 That's my reaction too. I suspect that faced with a real tricky repair I'd still want to use the professional but for a simpler repair - like a cracked leg on an antique machine, I'd be tempted to give it a try.

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

Harm,  Keep up the good work.  Your efforts encourage each of us to get out of our comfort zone and learn new things along the way, not simply opening our pocket book and paying someone else to do what we can do ourselves.  It the sprocket you fitted an off the shelf item or was it special made and you modified to fit your application.

Regards,

Alan

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, alsfarms said:

Harm,  Keep up the good work.  Your efforts encourage each of us to get out of our comfort zone and learn new things along the way, not simply opening our pocket book and paying someone else to do what we can do ourselves.  It the sprocket you fitted an off the shelf item or was it special made and you modified to fit your application.

Regards,

Alan

Hello Al,

The sprocket is an off the shelf item, 1" pitch. As we live in a rural area with farmers and lots of agricultural machines, this kind of replacement items is readily available. Many agricultural machines use chains, for example tillers, manure spreaders and so on. A fair mix of European standard and American standard chains is used (depends on the brand). So getting a chain and sprockets for my Cleveland is not a problem (wish, I could say that for all the parts I need 😁). Roger Weiss told me, his Cleveland was fitted with a chain which is no longer available. He advised me to use a standard 1"pitch chain. So I did.

Regards,

Harm

Edited by Sloth
repaired an ambiguous sentence (see edit history)
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Harm.....do NOT use an "o ring" or oilless chain.............the reason......it takes about 3/4 of a horsepower away, and you want to keep all the power possible. Running high air pressure is also helpful.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, edinmass said:

Harm.....do NOT use an "o ring" or oilless chain.............the reason......it takes about 3/4 of a horsepower away, and you want to keep all the power possible. Running high air pressure is also helpful.

Hello Ed,

Thank you for the tip! I never thought of it, but 3/4 of a horsepower is about 12% of the available horsepower, and in this case that's a lot. So I will use the standard chain, which I have to clean and oil. No oil-less chain for me.

Regards,

Harm

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...