The Caponemobile

Chrysler Model 77 master cylinder

Recommended Posts

The Chrysler 77 Sedan has a headache.  There are three major problems.  Last time I asked about the front end.  It is all tight, and, when the car becomes mobile again, we will have to have the front end aligned, from all appearances.  We (my 14 year old helper and legs) and I took the front wheel to what I thought was a real tire specialist, and he wanted nothing to do with my leaky front wheel  with a split rim.  TBC.

 

We planned to put the spare wheel in place when we found that the reason the tire on it had never touched ground was that the wheel can't be removed from the spare holder.  The internal rim of the wheel won't fit over the bottom of the spare frame.  In league with the great mysteries of the universe is, "How the Hell did anyone get that wheel on the spare holder frame in the first place?"  We let the air out of the tire, but that helps nothing, because the split rim can't be opened, and the tire removed, with out some form of destruction.  Low on the priority list is how to remove the entire assembly from the car, and see what can be pried, sprung or bent without bending the tire rim itself.  Ultimately, I conclude that I will have to remove (grind or machine) enough of the lower half of the spare holder frame for the lip of the tire rim to pass out from under it.  Another TBC!

 

I seem to have eternal carburetor problems.  When I started the car a few days ago it was pouring gasoline on a wooden barn floor again.  That's widely seen as a definite NO NO!  Again, the needle valve was stuck.  Right now I am not in a position to replace the inappropriate Carter W 1 with the correct DX3, so I decided to order a rebuild kit for the Carter.  I found the model, and, you guessed it - - - the kit is out of stock.  We have the patience of a rock, and the search continues.  I did examine the condition of the needle valve under a  microscope, and neither the seat nor the tip of the valve seem damaged.  I have slightly lowered the float, but have since then not yet reinstalled the assembly for further test.  Does TBC seem unfamiliar?

 

Next, I believe I should either rebuild or replace the hydraulic brake master cylinder.  On a couple of occasions I have had the brakes lock and I was able to relieve them by cracking and spilling fluid that should have passed back through the master cylinder.  Probably it would be wise to purge the brake system on the assumption that there are particles of rust in the system.  Still, I feel I would like to overhaul the master cylinder as a security measure.  My problem is that I have no idea what master cylinder, or kit, I should order.  The cylinder is original as far as I can tell, using the "77 Handbook" as a reference.   Clearly the reservoir was overfilled at some time, and brake fluid has spilled over the grungy looking cylinder.  (The rest of the engine compartment is a lot better looking.)  

 

Note:  I tried to attach a picture of the master cylinder, and lost all of my text. Through some miracle I returned to the forum, and found my "lost" text.  I have no intention of messing with all this again just to attach a picture.  Computers are not my thing.  If anyone needs a picture of my master cylinder, I will try again, but not until this text is sent.  

 

If anyone got this close to the end of this message, can you tell me how I identify the brake master cylinder for my car?  Thanks for your patience with my ramblings, and for any information you can provide.  TBC?

 

John Losch

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Some You -tube s on Model A tire repairs . repair or replace tube your self is easiest . On the rim being taken off , pics would be great help . But as rule they are made with one side with a larger opening one side so only go on one way . And then bolts with clips hold it .

  If your brake do not release usually means the compensation port is not open . Could be adjustment ,no free play or more likely rust . Napa has rebuild kits should be standard 1-1/4" dia bore .  Pics man, Pics  !!!

Edited by ArticiferTom
spellin (see edit history)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, Tom's last point about the brake compensation port. There was someone else troubled with adjusting brake pedal free travel and the effect of it being insufficient was to prevent that compensation port opening, esp. when things warmed up. The piston doesn't quite come out far enough.

 

The DX-3 was Stromberg's first attempt at a downdraft, but it is basically updraft technology according to Carb King. Carb king suggested I put a 1942 Dodge carb. on my DC-8 to make it run properly. The '42 Dodge had a slightly larger engine. I have a lot of trouble with carburettor icing, which I discovered the other day in Dyke's means the carb. (venturi) is too small.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is a picture of a 1930 Model 70 which should have the same master cylinder:

 

IMG_20190612_0001.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Spinneyhill said:

Yeah, Tom's last point about the brake compensation port. There was someone else troubled with adjusting brake pedal free travel and the effect of it being insufficient was to prevent that compensation port opening, esp. when things warmed up. The piston doesn't quite come out far enough.

 

The DX-3 was Stromberg's first attempt at a downdraft, but it is basically updraft technology according to Carb King. Carb king suggested I put a 1942 Dodge carb. on my DC-8 to make it run properly. The '42 Dodge had a slightly larger engine. I have a lot of trouble with carburettor icing, which I discovered the other day in Dyke's means the carb. (venturi) is too small.

 

Carburetor icing is more often the result of the carburetor being adjusted too rich. If the venturi is too small, the carburetor will run rich.

 

Jon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes....please provide photos of the spare tire/wheel situation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

According to my Wagner  Lockheed 1938 catalog

Master cylinder should be stamped FD1444 for the Wagner Lockheed barrel type. Only shared with the 1930 70 the 77 and the 1930 66 models as far as I can tell...

 

Edited by 30DodgePanel (see edit history)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, 30DodgePanel said:

Only shared with the 1930 70 the 77 and the 1930 66 models as far as I can tell...

My info. shows that too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
On 6/11/2019 at 6:03 PM, The Caponemobile said:

 I believe I should either rebuild or replace the hydraulic brake master cylinder.  On a couple of occasions I have had the brakes lock and I was able to relieve them by cracking and spilling fluid that should have passed back through the master cylinder.  Probably it would be wise to purge the brake system on the assumption that there are particles of rust in the system.  Still, I feel I would like to overhaul the master cylinder as a security measure.  My problem is that I have no idea what master cylinder, or kit, I should order.  The cylinder is original as far as I can tell, using the "77 Handbook" as a reference.   Clearly the reservoir was overfilled at some time, and brake fluid has spilled over the grungy looking cylinder.  (The rest of the engine compartment is a lot better looking.)  

 

If anyone got this close to the end of this message, can you tell me how I identify the brake master cylinder for my car?  

John Losch

 

 

Hey John, I also wanted to add some other numbers that may help you in remedying the problem with the MC.

 

These are Wagner Lockheed original numbers:

Hose assembly is FC1098

Master Cylinder FD1444

Front Wheel Assembly FC1235

Rear Wheel Assembly FC1234

 

Recommendation:

Just make sure your rebuild kit that you order is clearly for the FD1444 and make sure your MC is stamped as such or you may have issues. Some guys will sell on sites like eBay while advertising that it will fit your application, but make darn sure the box is clearly marked or do your due diligence to research the parts are correct and in good condition before buying (not dry rotted etc..).

 

BTW, I wish I had 14 year old eyes and legs again but I digress... Wearing cheaters is such a pain in the neck and that cracking noise when I stoop to get up is something new ..🙄

Edited by 30DodgePanel (see edit history)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

IF that Master Cylinder is one of those with the  flat top that is bolted on  take it apart and clean the whole  master cylinder  from rust and debris !!

I strip them all down then put them in a electrolysis tank  to get it back to a clean  casting .

then  i rinse it and see if all the rust is gone  if not back in  the  electrolysis again ,

then when it is clean I hone the bore the  I put it in a crock pot with pure lemon juice and boil it a while  the  rinse it out and  spray it down with carb  cleaner and dry it and put it together.

There can be a lot of rust and junk on the tops of those cylinders and best to get what you can out.

Edited by Isaiah
got knocked opff line (see edit history)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Isaiah said:

IF that Master Cylinder is one of those with the  flat top that is bolted on  take it apart and clean the whole  master cylinder  from rust and debris !!

I strip them all down then put them in a electrolysis tank  to get it back to a clean  casting .

then  i rinse it and see if all the rust is gone  if not back in  the  electrolysis again ,

then when it is clean I hone the bore the  I put it in a crock pot with pure lemon juice and boil it a while  the  rinse it out and  spray it down with carb  cleaner and dry it and put it together.

There can be a lot of rust and junk on the tops of those cylinders and best to get what you can out.

Isaiah, what is the effect of boiling the m/c in lemon juice (besides the obvious of making it smell better)?

Edited by r1lark (see edit history)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It will clean a lot of crudd out of  hard to get spots .

It works good on carburettor's also but keep a eye on them as the pot metal  may start to slough off.

If you have screws that dont want to turn after they are in the water  lemon juice  bath  as while  the screws  come out easy.

 YOU WANT THE REAL LEMON JUICE LIKE THE WOMAN USE FOR CANNING

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You also can clean  the coffee stains out of the coffee pot, and will help  clear a plugged sink drain.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...