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babychadwick

1938 Zephyr rear end

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What similarities are there between the Zephyr and Ford rear end?  Yesterday I was driving, a bang and then free wheeling, after towing home (a couple blocks) if placed in gear there is a grinding sound in the left rear hub.  I will be tearing into it soon and most likely looking for parts.

 

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Posted (edited)

Hi Chad,  sounds like it may have broken an axle. That  happened  to my 38 LZ. about 4 years back. Jack the left wheel up, give it a shake, see if it wobbles and falls off.
Can be due to worn axle  tapper, due to loose  nut and  or worn bearing housing sleeve. The sleeve has a grease nipple and should be regularly greased. The sleeve   can be replaced. Check the under side of sleeve for wear. 
Similarities?  The 36,37 LZ. . rear end is similar to Ford I believe  but from 38 the housings where heavier and  the gear wheel / pinion was  Hypoid. The axles are the same as Ford as much as I can tell.  Roy

Edited by 38ShortopConv. (see edit history)

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The design is similar, but except for the 36 LZ, there are very few parts that interchange with the Ford rear end. The axles for the 36-39 LZ is 86H-4235 indicating that there is a difference between it and the Ford axle. I don't have the specs for the LZ axles.

 

Here are the dimensions of the Ford V-8 axles:

18-4235 (1932-1934)  length 32.18" with an 18 tooth gear.

48-4235 (1935-1938) length 32.85" with an 18 tooth gear.

81A-4235 (1939-1941) length 32.85" with a 16 tooth gear

21A-4235 (1942-1948) length 33.70" with a 16 tooth gear

 

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Posted (edited)

Yes, it seems its just a matter of matching your axle length and number of spur gear teeth with a Ford axle from the thirties.  The broken axle  that came out of  my 38 LZ. and the one I replaced it with both  had FORD stamped on them but no part  number visible.  

Edited by 38ShortopConv. (see edit history)

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Looks like I get to tear it apart again.  The axle I got was listed as being a 35-38 ford and while both appeared to be the same length with the same gears the only difference was the bearing where it fit the housing inside being smaller.  Both were stamped ford and everything went together smooth.  I just got the housing back on (working on it in the car) and it appears that the axle is about an 1/2 to 3/4 too short.  While at is does anybody have a part number or an equivalent for the seal that is inside the housing?

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Ok, its apart and sure enough I miss measured the broken vs the replacement.  32 7/8 appears to be the axle measurement

 

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The P/N for the seal is B-4245 and should be available from any of the suppliers for the 32-48 Ford hobby cars.

 

32  7/8" is 32.875" means that the Ford axles will be too short. Try sourcing one from a junk yard.

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The axle lengths in the 38-39 Zephyr is the same as Ford 35-41. You must use the correct spider  gears to match the gear on the axle. 16 tooth axles use 11 tooth spiders and 18 tooth axles use 12 tooth spiders. I have Ford axles (NOS) in my 39 Zephyr . 

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The second axle showed up today and while I haven't opened it yet this was another seller disappointment.  Twice I have gone to the club the first was for the distributor and the second was for the axle. 

 

On the first I was quoted x amount to do a rebuild, after mailing I was informed my polished dist housing was junk and they would need to replace it as well as additional money needed for parts like points and condensers.  Needless to say I was unhappy as I was under the understanding that a rebuilt dist cost would translate to a rebuilt unit ready to go.  Not a base price with parts added on.

 

On the second was the axle most recently "I will sell it for X amount and try to ship it out Saturday with the seals in a flat rate container"  On Monday I receive a call "It's going to be 50% more" so I inform him that it is out of my budget which is mostly true but also that I don't like his business practice.  A few min later he calls back and agrees to sell for the original quoted price.  I receive it along with the bill charged to my card along with a $75 shipping charge.  Bear in mind I just had an almost identical axle WITH a portion of the diff shipped for $20.

 

If you are wondering why clubs are failing and new members are few and far between this is a good reason.  If these 2 instances are normal I will unfortunately end up tearing out/modifying the driveline

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I am sorry to hear that you feel you were ripped off. Unfortunately there are many people who think that car collectors are all rich and don't care how much they pay for something. They sometimes feel that they have the only remaining part that you need, which is seldom true.

 

In both cases, you were dealing with an individual or a business, not with a club. They may be members of a club, but that doesn't mean that they are the most honest and best suppliers of the parts that you need. As with any seller, you have to ask the right questions before you purchase and check out their reputation before you buy.

 

You have a rare car and it was well preserved by your grandfather. It will be more expensive to maintain than a 57 Chevy, because the parts are not being reproduced and the rarity of the car makes parts hard to find. The car is yours now and you can do anything that you want to it, but I would hate to see such a well preserved car be modified from stock.

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My primary focus is older cars so I am well versed on the "hard to find" or non existent parts. My gripe was being quoted X amount and then having that amount change.  If this is what I should expect from suppliers then I am left with 2 choices.  Update or create my own parts yard.

 

Upon opening the package today the axle had deep rust pitting and mushroomed threads that had cracked between the cotter key hole and end of the axle.

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Your gripe about having the price changed is legitimate. I would also be very upset with the high priced shipping charges and then when you found a defective part in the package, it adds to the frustration.

 

If a Ford axle will fit, you can try these vendors:

Lowell Kimball   402-649-1116

South Side Obsolete (507) 332-6789

Mike Dennis  402-489-3036

 

I dealt with all 3 of these many years ago and they were fair in their dealings. I also dealt with American Parts in KY, but cannot find his contact information. I believe that he has an E-Bay store, but I don't have that information either.

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On 6/28/2019 at 4:05 AM, 38ShortopConv. said:

Nice Columbia two speed Ken. Yes the vacuum canister opening faces the front as per first picture.
.  
Roy

Didn’t know it would go any other way.   

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